Manx road bike engines, new

Edward Turner was no engineer, he was an egotistical, tyrannical, salesman who had a messiah complex. So said someone who worked under the same roof as him for several years.
The British motor cycle industries problems were manifold, milking off the fat in the golden years (Lady Dockers gold plated Daimler), failing to re-equip in the late 50s, stupid complacent management (e.g. Donald Heather) and so on.
Despite motorcycle design and manufacture being essentially "Engineering", sadly the engineers were generally not close enough to the seats of power to make a difference or to apply enough pressure, to the accountants and businessmen who pulled the strings. There are no end of prototypes that were worthy of development (BSA 250 racer (MC1??), 350 Bandit/Fury, the Domiracer concept, the lightweight Nortons Jubilee, Navigator, Electra, original Trident, F type Norton, 800ccAMC twin although this may be a bit marginal, Bert Hopwoods "modular" designs), which were stifled because of the lack of interest/money from the higher management. Yet the same management poured money and resources into things like the 50 and 75cc mopeds, the three wheeled Ariel, the OIF BSA/Triumphs of the early 70's, you know the ones that required a step ladder to get on, all of which were doomed to failure.
Its a hobby horse of mine, so maybe a bit biased!
cheers
wakeup
 
I think your take on it is pretty correct. I worked in Australian defence factories which were run under the old British system. We had five levels of people on the shop floor. And a sales person who had been jumped up from nowhere . There was no way that any fool could determine their own future by making suggestions about potential improvement. I don't believe even PW was in the ideal situation, and I'm amazed he achieved so much in that environment.
I would never buy a BSA Sunbeam scooter, however I wonder if a Norton Jubbly was a decent bike ?
 
The lightweight Norton twins. At NV Andover amongst the stuff emptied out of Woolwich, there was a hack Navigator it was probably about 8 or 10 years old. According to the resident ex Woolwich expert it had been part of the Navigator development effort way back. It appeared to be pretty much standard externally (single carb), it went very well and the motor was amazingly, very quiet, certainly the quietest lightweight Norton that I had ever heard. It apparently (according to the Resident Expert) would see off a T100 quite easily, despite giving away 150cc. The snag was that to arrive at this desirable state required some drawing and tooling/fixture changes which were not approved by the management.
A friend of mine made a special with a BSA Sunbeam (it may have been a Triumph Tigress) scooter engine/gearbox (250cc parallel twin, all alloy engine, 4 speed gearbox) in (I think) C15 cycle parts. Despite the one off exhaust pipes coming out of the sides of the cylinder head looking very odd, it was quite a nice little bike. It performed pretty much like a good C15, and was obviously capable of a lot more as it was very smooth and quite torquey. Sadly it was wrecked in an accident. Why the illustrious BSA management of the day didn't do more with that motor/gearbox lump I don't know, but I can guess.

I've just finished re-reading Bert Hopwoods "Whatever Happened to the British Motorcycle Industry" so I'm topped up on cynicism. Its all very sad.

cheers
wakeup
 
wakeup said:
I've just finished re-reading Bert Hopwoods "Whatever Happened to the British Motorcycle Industry" so I'm topped up on cynicism. Its all very sad.

The real problem of course, was the lack of £££ for R&D.
Back when motorcycles were decidely a niche market.
With an unlimited budget, who knows what may have eventuated. ?

As someone pointed out, Onda tried about 30 different versions of the Goldwing before settling on the production version.
Thats more designs/models than Nortons did in half a century ?!!

Back to the subject in hand, there is always this.
What a gem...
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/NORTON-1938-I ... 1332578408
Clock seems a strange addition to the sale....
 
'Lack of $$$ for R&D'.

Perhaps there should have been a Marshall Plan to rebuild British industry after WW2 ?
Who won the war ?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LQAZUNwNgHU


Money doesn't help if you don't have the right mindset. I suggest a lot must be attributed to their class system and inability to change. We suffer from the same thing in Australia and have a struggle between conservatives and progressives as well - no ambition.
 
Anyone know what issue of Motorcycle Classics this is ?
Manx Magic.

Manx road bike engines, new


Can't find a bigger pic.

Appears to show a roadgoing manx on the front cover.
Don't recall seeing this one...
 
It's from Nov/Dec 2011. More?
Manx road bike engines, new

Manx road bike engines, new


I've got tons of classic bike mags, so if anybody wants to borrow a bunch for winter reading...
Manx road bike engines, new
 
Thanks.
Now I've seen that Tonkin Tornado, so unless its a different mag, maybe I should look at the front cover !?

Race manxes are a dime a dozen (figuratively), but roadgoing ones are a bit thinner on the ground...
 
That is good to hear.

But what have you done to the bleeds to the valve guides....
 
the valves and springs are totally enclosed,a mod that was done because of the improvement in valve spring technology.It also does away with any oil leaks.
 
How about some detailed photos of the Tonkin Tornado you have and maybe some video? We'd all love to feast our eyes and ears on that.
 
There is a video on my website steve tonkin classics.It is of a lap of the TTcourse on closed roads at this years Manx Grand Prix
 
Tonkin Tornado,
Great videos!
I assume that you are Steve Tonkin? If so, wondering if you could tell me about your swing arm mounted rear sets with rollover gear change and fold up foot rest to clear the kick start. I'd love to buy a set.
Thanks
Jeff
 
I am not in a position to supply a rear set kit yet.If you get in touch in the future I can see where we are.What machine is it to fit?
 
Steve,
The machine it's for is an original wideline featherbed road frame, with a 650 Norton motor and gearbox.
I'll definitely stay in touch, as I like the idea of the added clearance and ability to mount rearsets without having to drill the frame.
Thanks
Jeff
 
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