1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

Increasing oil flow to head

Discussion in 'Norton Commando Motorcycles (Classic)' started by Fast Eddie, Dec 21, 2018.

  1. Fast Eddie

    Fast Eddie VIP MEMBER

    Joined:
    Oct 4, 2013
    Peter, if you read through this thread you see that if you do as you’re suggesting, you will A) fill the head with oil and then draw it down the guides and B) steal much needed oil pressure from the big ends.
    I asked this question at the opening of this thread and my conclusion, after reading the feedback, was to leave well alone.
     
  2. comnoz

    comnoz VIP MEMBER

    Joined:
    Dec 10, 2008
    Allowing extra oil to the head just raises the oil temperature without doing any meaningful cooling to the head.
    It would take more oil than is possible to put in or get back out with a Norton to change the head temperature very much.
     
    nortriubuell and NorCat like this.
  3. L.A.B.

    L.A.B. Moderator VIP MEMBER

    Joined:
    Nov 20, 2004
    "don't do align"

    I assume you mean don't.

    The spindle slots should line up with the feed drillings in the head.

    If they aren't then the spindles are not aligned correctly.


    [​IMG]

    It's the rocker spindle feed holes that should not be aligned with the rocker arm drillings, so the spindle flats with the holes should always face outwards away from the head.

    Edit: The tabs on the inner rocker plates should align with the slots and prevent the spindles from moving.
    https://andover-norton.co.uk/en/shop-details/17154/r-spindle-locking-plate-d12-945-nmt2238-

    However, even then, the drillings may not always line up exactly with the slots so need opening out.

    https://www.accessnorton.com/NortonCommando/combat-rocker-shaft-oiling.17087/
     
    Last edited: Jan 10, 2019
  4. olympus

    olympus

    Joined:
    Aug 5, 2017
    If its extra oil to the camshaft & followers that required, why hasn't someone drilled the front of the crankcase adjacent to the cam, run a feed pipe down from the rockers & concocted some sort of fitting/banjo bolt/ spray nozzle in to actually spray the lower valve train with lubricant??
     
  5. comnoz

    comnoz VIP MEMBER

    Joined:
    Dec 10, 2008
    That is basically what I do with my rifle drilled end fed cam.

    And I have to keep a very small orifice in the line or I end up with too much oil in the cases and then the oil temperature skyrockets because the oil starts being whipped by the crank.

    The orifice size is ~.007 inch.
     
  6. Bernhard

    Bernhard

    Joined:
    Apr 20, 2011
    Yes it has been done, way back in 1961 on the 500 Norton Domiracer that finished 3rd in the TT, only this bike had non standard valve adjustment.

    There is another way, A third way????


    https://www.nortonownersclub.org/support/technical-support-heavytwins/cylinder-head-oil-feed
     
  7. Bernhard

    Bernhard

    Joined:
    Apr 20, 2011
    Depends on which set up your Norton head has got, if it is an early Domi top end set up, your cylinder head is fed from the RETURN side of the oil pump,

    Originally, low pressure oil was taken from the oil return at the point where it re-entered the oil tank, using a tee off a banjo. This was fed into the head via two drillings in the top of the cylinder head one left and one right. The rocker shafts were scrolled instead of plain, to encourage oil flow through each rocker. Although I heard some comments that the oil flow may be inadequate, I have never seen any evidence that a problem occurred,
    but the later one, like the commando .............
     
    Last edited: Jan 9, 2019
  8. Torontonian

    Torontonian

    Joined:
    Dec 28, 2009
    Well Norton did this restriction because oil would flood the head. The right amount is the right amount .( a chef friend says this a lot) . Flooding the head on a Commando is not good because it simply cannot drain off quickly enough what with the small drain tunnels. The oil would build up levels and find the valves and guides to exit (and the proper route) , and that would mean SMOKING .
     
  9. 84ok

    84ok

    Joined:
    Aug 10, 2014
    new folks luuv those details!
     
  10. RideItForever

    RideItForever

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 2018
    Same issue discussed at length on NOC site and....
    "15k miles ago I rebuilt my 850 Mk3 Commando and discovered this same oil feed alignment issue. On Les Emery's advice I opened up the oilway in the head to give a clear feed to the rocker spindle by careful work with rat tail files and a Dremel. The bike has now done many high speed and low speed miles and I have never seen any evidence of oil swamping the head. "
     
  11. kommando

    kommando

    Joined:
    May 7, 2005
    The NOC thread is about getting the right amount of oil, the spindles are still pointed outwards to restrict flow, the problem was a further restriction upstream.
     
  12. seattle##gs

    seattle##gs

    Joined:
    Oct 28, 2014
    It wouldn't look good but some simple duct work to direct more air across the head should help.
     
  13. Bernhard

    Bernhard

    Joined:
    Apr 20, 2011
    I have to agree with this, PW did that on his wheelbarrow Arter Matchless, but I don’t often see it used by anybody else.


    If you really want to improve the oil flow, why not get a thin grinding wheel, dress a U profile and holding the shafts in your hand carefully grind slightly deeper in the helix oil groves. But a warning. Metal once removed cannot be put back!
     
  14. L.A.B.

    L.A.B. Moderator VIP MEMBER

    Joined:
    Nov 20, 2004
    Commando (and other Norton high-pressure) rocker spindles don't have (and certainly don't require) helix oil grooves.
    https://andover-norton.co.uk/en/shop-details/17397/rocker-spindle-1966-on-nm25350-


    Isn't this all yet another solution to a non-existent problem?
     
    Last edited: Jan 11, 2019 at 10:53 AM
    MexicoMike, baz, lcrken and 1 other person like this.
  15. 84ok

    84ok

    Joined:
    Aug 10, 2014
    yup, but then beauty & the beast