How to test your stator output?

I've upgraded to the 3 Phase Sparx (Stator,Rotor and Rectifier) and I really don't see any improvement.From what I understand the battery supplies the voltage when the stator falls behind in output so how can I check the voltage output of the stator only? Is it safe to disconnect the battery while the bike is running?

speirmoor said:

I've upgraded to the 3 Phase Sparx (Stator,Rotor and Rectifier) and I really don't see any improvement.

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What improvements were you expecting?

Isn't the battery charging?

To be honest LAB I dont know.The Red ignition light is on at idle. It shuts off @ 2300rpm approx. While the red light is on I'm thinking I'm consuming battery power? I'm in dense city traffic for the first 30 mins of any ride so it's a lot of sitting at red lights with the engine idling.

You state the battery supplies the voltage when the stator/rotor falls behind.

I think you got it backwards. It is the battery that is supplying all the voltage.

And you can start and ride your bike with a fully charged battery with NO stator and rotor, for a while of course.

The stator/rotor exist only to send current to the battery to charge the battery while it is running and being depleted.

Yes you can check to see if your new charging system is working by hooking up a simple volt meter to your battery at idle and then increase the revs and watch the voltage go up a little bit, that shows it is charging.

Theoretically you should get the same charge but it will come at much lower RPM and be 3 times more efficient. All you have to do is take a DC reading at the battery with the bike not running (12.3 or so) and a reading with the bike running(13.5 to 14.5 or so if the system is functioning). The real difference is that you may see a good charge rate at lower rpm's and a better maintained charge rate with a load (lights,horn,brake lights, turn signals).

That's 3 wires at the stator and 5 at the reg/rec, right?

speirmoor said:

The Red ignition light is on at idle. It shuts off @ 2300rpm approx. While the red light is on I'm thinking I'm consuming battery power?

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But was it like that before the change to Sparx?
The charge warning light should go off just above idle speed (so off by approximately 1200-1500 RPM)?
The assimilator could be faulty if the light doesn't go off until 2300 RPM?

Sparx worked a treat on Peel with a tiny 1.2ah battery, about exactly as you report - I'd better be a few 100 rpm over 2000 or my lights dimmed going safe slowly up my long driveway after dark and it would stall out in traffic with brake light use if I let it idle more than a minute. With 1.2 ah battery if it did stall in traffic I'd have to jumper it or roll start to get volts enough to get Boyer brains to work. I've monitored oil, CHT and EGT in still air in hot summer traffic congestion to see over heating is a non-issue sitting and blipping rpm enough to stay charging. Can't put much more copper in the space allowed so only further solution with alternator on crank is super magnet rotor. Relays to to lights and LED tail light helped 1.2 ah battery work out. I could not let Peel idle even one minute or she'd stall out with Boyer going bonkers.

If you're solid state then the assimulator is useful for originality and not a hole lot more IMO. To utilize the headlight shell warning lights, I use the red and green to help me remember to turn off the turn signals. This is a more realistic usage of system resources. Red left, green right of course. The middle is yellow for highbeams. You can clean the system up a little more, aesthetically and functionally, by removing that thing. Again IMHO!

speirmoor said:

While the red light is on I'm thinking I'm consuming battery power?

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Perhaps you are under the impression that the charge warning light goes out when alternator output has risen to the level where it starts to charge?
The standard Lucas charge warning light assimilator is a simple (OK - crude) device which triggers and switches the lamp off when it senses that alternator AC output has reached a certain pre-determined level, so doesn't indicate the point at which the alternator begins charging.

According to the Sparx info, their three-phase alternator produces 140w @ 2000 RPM, so even at 2000 RPM there should be more than enough output to replace the drain from the head & tail lamps, ignition, etc. and still leave some spare output.

http://www.tri-corengland.com/acatalog/ ... lts_1.html

Yes LAB that's it exactly. My concern is battery draining while in slow traffic for length's of time. At the moment I find the indicator flasher is the first thing to stop working.When I rev the engine they start working again.I only run with the pilot light on .What else is consuming power only the coils the Boyer and the Tail/brake light? I don't want to be revving the engine every time I come to a stop to keep everything working.

speirmoor said:

My concern is battery draining while in slow traffic for length's of time. At the moment I find the indicator flasher is the first thing to stop working.When I rev the engine they start working again.I only run with the pilot light on .

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So, has anything actually changed from how it was before you fitted the Sparx?

As suggested, connect a voltmeter across the battery and check the voltage as you rev the engine with the lights on and off.

Ok I'll do the voltage check but its going to be Sunday now before I get to it again .

Here is something else.
Check battery voltage with the key off. Record results.
Then check battery voltage with the key on. Record results
Disconnect the warning light assimulator and connect the wires together and check voltages again. Record results
Start the bike and check battery voltage at 1200 rpm with and without assimulator connected.
Report findings.

Measure the voltage across your battery, the above figures are for Sparx 3 Phase.

Tread lightly in believing that it's the stator, I spent a small fortune replacing stators and rectifiers,
when the whole time it was a brand new weakly magnetized rotor.

Here is the troubleshooting manual for the Lucas 3 Phase Powerbase. It has a logical troubleshooting sequence beginning on page
5 or 6.

http://www.box.net/shared/dp8x1egas8c2qvxszck0


To troubleshoot the rotor and stator properly, you will need a 1 Ohm 100 Watt or better Power Resisistor. About 20 dollars, from Mouser Electronics.
http://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail...=sGAEpiMZZMvNd0dY0KymzjiwrIR75R9KELKmi63qz74=

Here's the best test I know of -

It requires two electrical instruments; an ammeter (10 amp scale or higher) and a voltmeter. If you only have one multi-meter you can do the tests twice. I prefer an analog ammeter for this (an old Simpson VOM). The ammeter is definitely the best instrument for alternator testing.

Put the ammeter in the output line of the Sparx rectifier/regulator. If you're still positive ground, the negative meter lead goes to the regulator. Put a voltmeter across the battery.

Start the engine and with lights off bring up the revs. You should see current start to flow at about 1500 RPM. At this point it's charging the battery and supplying ignition power (about 3-5 amps). Battery voltage should come up from 12.5V to somewhere between 13.9 and 14.3 VDC and stay there as you increase revs.

Then turn the headlight on. Depending on the wattage of the headlight the current will increase by 5-6 amps. The criteria here is that at 2500 RPM the alternator is supplying all the power that the bike needs and is also charging the battery. The Sparx 3 phase system comes on at lower RPM than the stock Lucas, which makes night riding a whole lot nicer.

If you can do this test, post your numbers here for confirmation.

I got a bad regulator with my Sparx three-phase (immediately replaced, before even receiving the bad unit back, by Sir Matt Rambow).

The testing sequence was, with motor running, first to check the alternator output leads (three of them) for AC voltage - IIRC, about 16 AC volts per lead at idle (not increasing much thereafter - tribute to how the unit produces output at low revs). That checked out. Then checking DC voltage across the battery - which in my case was equal to the battery voltage (high 12s or thereabout) and did not vary at all with RPMs. That clued me it was the regulator. New regulator and voila, success!

Love the Sparx unit, no issues since and it does easily support all my electrical needs and keep the battery fully charged, even if just putting around town.

Best of luck.

I'm sure I got to the root of the problem which is the Regulator/Rectifier.
I disconnected it from the battery .
I first measured each of the three phases from the stator.All were uniform and rising when revving the engine.
I reconnected the 3 phases to the 3 wires on the Regulator /Rectifier and measured the output voltage on the Red and Black wires.
Voltage was erratic mostly 3-4V with sometimes 12-13V.Voltage not increasing with engine speed.
Here shows the problem if someone can confirm.
[video]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=retePr-7LEg[/video]

I'm not sure if we're comparing apples to apples here, however…

Bob K., the distributor of the Podtronics Regulator/Rectifier, told me there was NO way to test with a meter.
The output is pulsed DC which you may see with an oscilliscope, but not a meter.

This is a direct quote from an email he sent…

Disconnect the two output wires from the Podtronics.
Now, connect the red and black wires directly to a 45w. headlamp bulb.
Start the bike (run on battery) and observe if headlight bulb lights up.

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Also, did you take your stator measurements directly from the three stator lead wires (before the connector near the starter motor)?

Have you load tested your battery? IMHO, this would be the first component to eliminate.

I upgraded my charging system to a 200 watt. I assumed I had a 200watt Regulator/Rectifier but it was a 160 watt and failed.

The tests and stats that you got are the same as I got so I believe you have diagnosed the problem correctly.

2Wheels said:

I'm not sure if we're comparing apples to apples here, however…

Bob K., the distributor of the Podtronics Regulator/Rectifier, told me there was NO way to test with a meter.
The output is pulsed DC which you may see with an oscilliscope, but not a meter.

This is a direct quote from an email he sent…

Disconnect the two output wires from the Podtronics.
Now, connect the red and black wires directly to a 45w. headlamp bulb.
Start the bike (run on battery) and observe if headlight bulb lights up.

Click to expand...

Also, did you take your stator measurements directly from the three stator lead wires (before the connector near the starter motor)?

Have you load tested your battery? IMHO, this would be the first component to eliminate.

Click to expand...

I have load tested the battery and its on the weak side.Its a better candidate for testing as I need to see it charging?
I measured the 3 alternator leads before the Reg/Ref and all showed voltage at idle and rising to 13-15v with engine speed.
I had my old podronics single phase unit on the shelf and for a comparison I hooked it up using two of the 3 alternator wires and taping off the 3rd alternator wire. I put the meter on the red and black output wires and saw voltage rising and falling with engine speed.
Heres the vid of that one.
[video]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yo4FgQdb-hU[/video]