has anybody installed that hydralic clutch kit

complaining that the Norton clutch is to heavy and you need to toss some cash at the problem (other than maybe greasing your cables, checking the stack height and doing a few 40 oz curls) is the one of the sign's that you've truly become a gray-beard :shock:

next you'll want a MKIII :mrgreen:

Reading this older thread about the Comstock / CNW hydraulic clutch.
I went to Matts web site and noticed that CNW isn't listing or offering it anymore.
Can Matt or Jim let me know why? Was it demand not there? Long term performance / reliabity issues?
Just a bit curious

Thanks

JD

jeffdavison said:

Reading this older thread about the Comstock / CNW hydraulic clutch.
I went to Matts web site and noticed that CNW isn't listing or offering it anymore.
Can Matt or Jim let me know why? Was it demand not there? Long term performance / reliabity issues?
Just a bit curious

Thanks

JD

Click to expand...

They are definitely still available. I would be glad to set you up. Jim

jeffdavison said:

Reading this older thread about the Comstock / CNW hydraulic clutch.
I went to Matts web site and noticed that CNW isn't listing or offering it anymore.
Can Matt or Jim let me know why? Was it demand not there? Long term performance / reliabity issues?
Just a bit curious

Thanks

JD

Click to expand...

Jeff,

Its still available from cNw as well.

http://coloradonortonworks.com/part-cat ... /#post-231

Absolutely great upgrade and very positive feedback from those that have done the conversion.

Matt / Colorado Norton Works

www.coloradonortonworks.com

Jim, Matt, thanks for the reply.

One thing that is holding me back is the switchgear. With the setup that was offered through CNW, it was required to use a modified Honda left hand switch setup, at least that is what the pictures were showing and was in the description while it was on the web site.

I really would like to be able to use the standard Lucas switches. The reason why, is that I'm using Madass's Master Cylinder for the front brake, and the way he produces the assembly, it lets the stock Lucas switch and mirror be used. I would want to keep left and right switch gear and mirrors symetrical and stock if at all possible and that would be a priority for the hydraulic clutch.

Have you seen the way that Madass had adapted the Japanese M/C ? Could such a method be used on the M/C for the hydraulic clutch?

http://i1204.photobucket.com/albums/bb4 ... 2531b3.jpg


JD

I am not sure if something like that would work on the LH side but I will take a look this weekend. Jim

I wondered why my cable operated clutch on my Roaster was starting to grab, becoming harder to engage and generally being a pain, while fitting up a new Maney belt drive, found the centre spline hub was so badly notched, the plates couldn't separate!!!
Replaced the centre spline, installed an extra steel plate at the inside of the clutch hub to get the stack height right,,,no w smooth and light.
keep up the good work on the mods jim
Regards Mike

Nobody has yet mentioned the benefits that a hydraulic clutch has for those with "health" issues.. eg, arthritis, amputee etc and you can fill in the rest of the list....

Great piece of equipment for those that "need" it..

How much will a stock clutch transmit? is it well over rated ,or just enough...can a weaker spring be used?
I can access a large surface grinder ..can i grind of some to reduce the tension? or is that a waste of time?

Followed Dynodave instructions, top of ridge of pressure plate 5 mm below outer drum edge.
Fitted Venhill teflon lined cable. Adjuster half a turn out.
Clutch now is not a two-finger but a one-finger operation.
Barnett plates. No slipping.
Disengaging fine (no notches on center splines so far).
Original camplate, not the Atlas one which reduces clutch rod travel.
Switch-like action still there but easier manageable.
Then again, have not experienced hydraulic version, might be sweeter again.
Still carry spare clutch cable on trips..

hydralic clutch kit old concept- new marketing challange

First reference I found to a hydraulic clutch being sold by Bill Albaugh was in Norton News #62 spring 1987. For unknown reasons it did not seem to sell all that well back then , though it was reported to work OK.
In later discussions (mid/late 90's?) with norton enthusiast and parts hawker Denis Cavillier north of NYC, I found out he bought the rights to Bill''s hydraulic clutch release. He had called me for engineering consultation as to design and manufacturing issues in contemplation of reproducing the device. I don't think he ever did and later dropped out the norton scene altogether after well over a decade of Drouin supercharger wheeling and dealing along with lots of flea market norton parts sales.

I tend to agree with it being a novel solution looking for a problem to fix. That may be the reason marketing this device is a tough sell. The main problem being people not knowing how to do clutch cable maintenance on a norton...

Look through a Ducati forum and read the hydraulic clutch problem and failures there. It makes me think my nortons with cable clutch are easily as good or better than my 3 Ducati clutches even though the DUC come with a clutch rod seal :mrgreen:

I have no doubt the CNW system is as good as you would want and can buy. Those who have special needs will delight.

IMO Those with a commando clutch, who learn how to do clutch set up and maintenance will also delight.

I tend to agree with it being a novel solution looking for a problem to fix.

Click to expand...

wrong, it is an upgrade just as fitting a modern front brake is an upgrade

That may be the reason marketing this device is a tough sell.

Click to expand...

wrong again, CNW is selling them just fine, how do you personally know their sales #'s?

The main problem being people not knowing how to do clutch cable maintenance on a norton...

Click to expand...

this is no "main problem" with people wanting and buying hydraulic clutches, I have had mine for over two years now and would never go back to a cable operation

maybe, just maybe, you will get an opportunity to try out a hydraulic clutch on a Commando, and then you will be able to post credible opinions that are factually based

Dave,
I have certainly sold as many as I can build.

The problems with the Ducati and KTM hydraulic clutches relate to the fact that they use an aluminum cylinder which is a poor wear surface for a rubber seal and has corrosion problems when water collects in the bottom of the slave cylinder. I have not seen those problems when using a cast iron cylinder.

I have not tried one of Bill's old clutch setups so I don't know how they worked.

But I know I would never go back to a cable clutch. Maybe you should try one of mine before you knock it. Jim

comnoz said:

Dave,
I have certainly sold as many as I can build.

The problems with the Ducati and KTM hydraulic clutches relate to the fact that they use an aluminum cylinder which is a poor wear surface for a rubber seal and has corrosion problems when water collects in the bottom of the slave cylinder. I have not seen those problems when using a cast iron cylinder.

I have not tried one of Bill's old clutch setups so I don't know how they worked.

But I know I would never go back to a cable clutch. Maybe you should try one of mine before you knock it. Jim

Click to expand...

I've used one of Bill Allbaugh's hydraulic clutch conversions on both my AMA Pro-Twins race bike back in the '80s, and more recently on our Norton streamliner effort at Bonneville. It is very smooth, never requires adjustment, and I like the feel it gives. It works on the same principle as Jim's, but I think Jim's is the better design, and recently purchased one from him. I'm building two street MK IIIs this year, and I plan to use Jim's clutch on one and my spare Allbaugh on the other (trying to use up some of the parts accumulation). I've tried the feel of Jim's last week on the salt, and it's really smooth. I don't expect to feel much difference between them, but Jim's makes gearbox assembly and disassembly easier, and I do wonder about the durability of the aluminum bore on the Allbaugh cylinder. There's not a lot wrong with the cable clutch setup, as long as it's maintained properly, but there is still more friction in the mechanical bits than with a hydraulic system. Maybe not enough difference for some to justify replacing the cable with a hydraulic system, but like Jim says, once you try it you might not want to go back.
Ken

comnoz said:

Dave,
I have certainly sold as many as I can build.

The problems with the Ducati and KTM hydraulic clutches relate to the fact that they use an aluminum cylinder which is a poor wear surface for a rubber seal and has corrosion problems when water collects in the bottom of the slave cylinder. I have not seen those problems when using a cast iron cylinder.

I have not tried one of Bill's old clutch setups so I don't know how they worked.

But I know I would never go back to a cable clutch. Maybe you should try one of mine before you knock it. Jim

Click to expand...

I would say older KTM's never had trouble with either my 2005 950 or my 2011 990.
The two best thing I did for my NORTON have been the floating disc and Caliper and your hydraulic clutch kit from CNW!
Al

AlColombia said:

I would say older KTM's never had trouble with either my 2005 950 or my 2011 990.
The two best thing I did for my NORTON have been the floating disc and Caliper and your hydraulic clutch kit from CNW!
Al

Click to expand...

I have not had any problems with my KTMs either. I have just heard of some people having problems.

The problems I have witnessed have been on Ducatis and some BMWs. [not mine] All of them may be due to poor maintenance and moisture in the system. Jim

Never having to have suffer a broken clutch cable is worth the price of the hydraulic setup, alone.

So we all know that the cable setup can be made very light by getting the stack height right and changing to a Venhill Featherlight cable, however you must remember NOT to oil it. I'm starting to really like things that I have to remember to not do. Even if I forget all about the clutch cable for years, it's the same as remembering not to oil it, other than the dimensia aspect of things.
Venhill claims these stainless/Teflon cables last for eons, we will see. I hope to have the bike for two or three more eons.
Engagement is smooth and progressive, low wear in the centre hub probably helps with this. It does lift off enough that neutral is easy to snick.

As far as the hydraulic option goes, although it is not on my personal to do list, I can see the advantage.
I haven't heard of anyone converting their hydraulic disc brakes back to cables, although some early disc brakes were cable operated. Those brakes are known as "funky" nowadays. Not really a term one would want applied to their stopper!

Glen

jeffdavison said:

Jim, Matt, thanks for the reply.

One thing that is holding me back is the switchgear. With the setup that was offered through CNW, it was required to use a modified Honda left hand switch setup, at least that is what the pictures were showing and was in the description while it was on the web site.

I really would like to be able to use the standard Lucas switches. The reason why, is that I'm using Madass's Master Cylinder for the front brake, and the way he produces the assembly, it lets the stock Lucas switch and mirror be used. I would want to keep left and right switch gear and mirrors symetrical and stock if at all possible and that would be a priority for the hydraulic clutch.




JD

Click to expand...

Jeff,

Here you go......this is a clamp I have designed and it allows you to retain the stock Lucas switch cluster when using both the Brembo master for the Hydraulic clutch kit and also the Brembo master for the cNw/Brembo brake kit.

Still in prototype stage and it will probably be another 2 months before available.

Matt / Colorado Norton Works

www.coloradonortonworks.com