Green Blobs

Just obtained a Smiths Speedo for my Commando, as my Veglia has packed up, & am looking for a matching Tacho.
It seems to me that the early clocks had big green blobs, the one I have is smaller, & the Veglia is smaller again.
The earlier ones have smaller numbers whereas the one I have, the numbers are bigger, similar to the Veglia.
So, can I presume that the one I have is of later years?

Roll on Christmas Eve, when the stress stops & the drinking begins.

What is the number on the face?

The Smiths numbers are:

1968-70 Commando SSM 3001/02
1971-74 Commando SSM 3001/09
1975 (Mk3) SSM 4003/00

Aha!, Thankyou. I have the '71 to '74 one, which suits my bike as it is a '73.
I will keep looking for the matching Tacho, although not too seriously, as my Veglia Tacho is fairly matching.

Flo said:

I will keep looking for the matching Tacho, although not too seriously, as my Veglia Tacho is fairly matching.

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The Smiths tacho to match your speedo should be type RSM3003/15.

Thanks, when I see one, I will go for it.

Flo,
I have a working tach w/ a cracked glass.
If your interested in it let me know.
You can use it as such or send it out for glass.
It will be cheap so you have wiggle room to fix the glass.
It belongs on a bike not on my bench
Email me if this will work for you.
Marshal

The "big green blob" was some PR genius's idea for a new Norton logo, replacing the familiar script. Most people hated it. The lines through it were supposed to make it look sphercal on a flat surface. It was still in use when I left N-V in June of 1968, but I don't think it made it into 1970.

My "Commando Spares List" has the green AT&T death star, but my 69 instruments have the solid green blob.

Dave
69S

DogT said:

My "Commando Spares List" has the green AT&T death star, but my 69 instruments have the solid green blob.

Dave
69S

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Yeah, early Commandos I've seen have had solid green globes. Looks like it changed during '71 to the globe with lines, then to the NVT worm logo in '74 or '75

I've only seen a couple of Atlases, and they had 'Norton' script, but I think they were a '64 and a '65

post10109.html (page 4)


SMITHS SPEEDOMETERS


MPH speedos are normally marked; *1000 turns = 1 Mile*

SSM 3001/02 150 MPH (1968-70) Solid Green Spot

SSM-3001/02A 150 MPH (19??) Green Globe Logo (this could be a later replacement part?)

SSM 3001/09 150 MPH (1971-74) Green Globe

SSM 3001/10 240 KPH 600 turns (1972) [1971-74?] Green Globe

SSM 4003/00 150 MPH + Trip meter (1975-on) NVT

SSM 4003/01 240 KPH 600 turns + Trip NVT known to be used on Triumph 750 Bonneville/Tiger 75/76. Possibly also Commando 850 MkIII ?

SMITHS TACHOMETERS 4:1

RSM 3003/00 9k RPM (1968-70) Solid Green Spot

RSM 3003/10A (added 12/2009)

RSM 3003/12 9k RPM (Commando 'S' 1970) Solid Green Spot?

RSM 3003/15 9k RPM (1971-74) Green Globe

RSM 3003/(21?) 10k RPM (1975-on) NVT


___________________________________________


VEGLIA SPEEDOMETERS (also used in pairs as well as Smiths types but only fitting the deeper black instrument housings used from 1973-on)

1000 turns = 1 Mile

09190919900 (1973-74) 150 MPH + Trip meter, Green Globe and 'Norton'

0919 091 9911 150 MPH + Trip meter (1975) NVT


VEGLIA TACHOMETERS 4:1

09200909900 9k (1973-74) Green Globe and 'Norton'

0920 090 9911 10k (1975) NVT

I have norton rev counter 3003/10a where does this fit in?

It is matched with speedo #3003/10a that i am using for my &0 resto that i am doing at the momennt.
Al

possm said:

I have norton rev counter 3003/10a where does this fit in?

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RSM3003/10 could be early Commando (1968-69?)

possm said:

It is matched with speedo #3003/10a

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That would be an unknown number for a speedo, and it's odd that it matches the revcounter number? Does it have the SSM (speedo) prefix?

Is there any chance you could post some close-up photos of those instrument dials, please?

The "1000" after the rest of the p/n indicates revs per mile of the drive cable. On the prototypes we had the 1000 rev/mile speedometeers and a 1600 revs/mile rear-wheel speedo drive. Man, thos bikes were quick! Most of the time we used engine rpm to cavclulate speed, since the sppedo was showing 1.6 times the real speed!

I'm surprised Ludwig's speedo is a '1000 turns' KmpH speedo, as I can't see how it would read correctly unless it has a different ratio drive gearbox?

I've recently spoken with Wally Olins of Wolfe Olins which was the agency commisioned by Dennis Poore to brand the Commando. The green blob was Micheal Wolfe's idea (the other partner in the agency), and was intended to be used as a 'brand' mark - not only as a blob on the tank and instruments but also as a generic identifier for Norton. This was a bit ahead of its time (well a lot ahead of its time at the time if you get my drift) and was only adopted half heartedly by Norton.

Matt01 said:

The green blob was Micheal Wolfe's idea (the other partner in the agency), and was intended to be used as a 'brand' mark - not only as a blob on the tank and instruments but also as a generic identifier for Norton.

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Quoted by Mick Duckworth's in his Norton Commando book, according to a Wolff Olins publication, it said the green blob: "...was a symbol of almost arrogant simplicity. It represented nothing. It was just a thing in itself. Michael Wolff believes that people are as motivated by apparently meaningless objects as by logical argument and that this influence has barely been exploited."





Not only did they come up with the green ball trademark but I believe they also did the styling for the original Commando which became the Fastback.

ludwig said:

because the scale is calibrated differently ?

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Yes although the speedo reading is governed by cable rotation speed and internal calibration and not by the total number of turns within a given distance.


I thought all Km speedos were 600 turns (per Km) so the same 1.25:1 speedo drive box was used for both KmPH (600 turns = 1Km) and MPH (1000 turms = 1 Mile) instruments, as there are no other drive box ratios listed for the Commando, only 1.25:1 (15/12)?

ludwig said:

but this speedo is fitted on my N15 , and I think it has a different drive ( 1/2 I think .. )

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Ah.. but that would explain it.

ludwig said:

Of course not the original speedo , but the green blob indicates it was intended for Commando use

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I'm not sure you are right about that. I think what you have is a later Andover Norton replacement part (03A) so it has the green globe, and I don't think it was intended to be fitted to a Commando, but to an earlier Norton model with a different (2:1? BG5330/257?) ratio drive gearbox. The fact that it only reads up to 190 Km/H (118 MPH) instead of 240 Km/H (150MPH which MPH speedos read up to) also leads me to believe it's not meant for a Commando.

Ludwig I know you would already know how to adjust your speedo calibration, I did mine yesterday after I had pulled the speedo down to clean the glass and lubricate and check inside. In good condition and now the dial looks much clearer. I drilled the cover to have access to the adjusting screw which you can see through the lamp hole and after test riding and setting I dabbed the screw with some silastic to retain the setting and covered the drill hole up with some water proof tape. Will find a grommet later. Mounted my Garmin GPS on the bars and set to MPH (Australia metric KM/PH) . After the stripping and replacement of the needle in the position that I noted on removal it was with in half a MPH. I then switched the GPS back to KMPH to note what speed in MPH at a given reading so I do not get pinched for speeding (not that I would :mrgreen: ) It was Sunday when I tested the bike and over here we have a system where in peak holiday periods they double the demerit points for speeding etc. and one offence and your could loose you license. Checked at 60KMPH then 80KMPH then 100KMPH in a 80 zone and backed off to slow down to 80 and looked up to see the Highway patrol coming around the corner. WOOPS :shock: he did not turn around so I must have just slowed down enough as they have to lock onto you for a set time,not long, to book you. Moral of that story is don't test/check things like speedo's on holiday periods. To remove the bezel from the speedo I mounted a piece of Oregon in the lathe and turned a neat fitting hole for the speedo to the depth of the chrome bezel then into the vice and levered it off. Now after that short of subject note my two speedos are 1969 and 1970 marked SSM 3001/02 1000.
Ian