gearbox oil? why bother...

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Oh Ors- don't fret needlessly along with the other old women on list - fact of the matter is > if you ride you are a foolish person beyond reasoning on risking life and limb, period end of story throw in the ole towel and stay under your bed. Motrocycles are one of natures best ways of paying back past life karma in big installment hits and lots of small change too.

I've had about every failure mode possible in AMC tranny and as ya made it this far and now have nicer sounding functioning fully lubed gbox, just run it till it starts to mis behave - as they all eventually do any way no matter what. Easyiest assessment of state of sleeve bushes is open primary and see if ya can wiggle the clutch basket, if so, it'll run that way a long time with the alignment forgiving triplex chain, though might sling a belt off before end of the block. The most danergous thing is the factory installed lay shaft bearing is known to break apart and can lock up tranny and take ya down, but generally only shows up as kicker being dragged forward to strike your calf but still function enough to get home to open up. The most likely thing that suffered is the paper thin 1st gear bush just under outter cover, which can make shifts a bother or lets 1st pop out of gear when going slowing and momentum and engine drag match, usually on a easy lean over to enter drive way or ease a slow turn coasting under 25 mph- ya can suddenly lose engine drag, which on pavement is non issue unless rear hit a rut just then - can take ya down, or about half that speed on THE Gravel - took me down on a edge berm that fractured my congenital fused lowest vertebrae L5/S1, that crippled me like Hunchback for 7 mo but regrew better than new. So I came out ahead of the karma game, my pelvis protected a brand new b/g paint job and I can now bend to touch toes and back don't bother to stand in lines anymore and pops on its own by a twist or lean back ahhhh....
 
Btw, when I had 1st bush fracture apart I was racing up wagon trail sharp chicances pulling 60 in 1st and 80's in 2nd just fine, on way back down ran into traffic so just stayed in 1st 25 mph in the 10-15 mph marked turns keeping a dozen bike lengths behind car but enjoying the far over leaning - when rear cross a small section of pavement missing, so had an instant of matched drag and momentum, popper out of gear so rear slide right out from under me leaving me runing a few yd to end up standing in mid lane watching Peel slide another coulpe dozen yd into gaurd rail, but just picked her up and carried on, waving at the cars waiting on me in the way. No issues at all rest of the day... till momentum and drag matched entering my drive way for DIY surgical correction w/o anesthesia. I have a spare 1st gear bush always on hand now a days.
 
Smell in a important tool.

If you smell something other than the fine fragrance of gear oil, then you may want to take extra action.

If all you smell is the flowery essence of gear oil, then I would fill to the required level, run it for 100 mile or so, drain/change and inspect for any "excessive" flakes.

The next off season will beg for a complete inspection.
 
petev said:
Smell in a important tool.

If you smell something other than the fine fragrance of gear oil, then you may want to take extra action.

If all you smell is the flowery essence of gear oil, then I would fill to the required level, run it for 100 mile or so, drain/change and inspect for any "excessive" flakes.

The next off season will beg for a complete inspection.

I think in the circumstances, that's good advice. If the box were mine though, the parts would already be clean and spread out for examination. Whatever he chooses to do, I hope that I'll see Orso in Montsauche next weekend. (Have you looked at the long range weather forecast ? Torrential is the best description).
 
hobot said:
You should be able to see some oil down among the cogs with a flash light shown down the filler cap, which is like a inch below the useless level plug and the level .........................

You see cogs?


Anyway, to the OP, if it were me, I would also have the parts out, cleaned and inspected by now. It is an easy task.

If you really believe the bike ran w/o adequate oil in the gear box for 3-4,000 km then pull it open and see. While in there, replace/upgrade the layshaft bearing for reasons noted elsehwere in this thread and throughout this forum.
 
Dances with Shrapnel said:
hobot said:
You should be able to see some oil down among the cogs with a flash light shown down the filler cap, which is like a inch below the useless level plug and the level .........................

You see cogs?


Anyway, to the OP, if it were me, I would also have the parts out, cleaned and inspected by now. It is an easy task.

If you really believe the bike ran w/o adequate oil in the gear box for 3-4,000 km then pull it open and see. While in there, replace/upgrade the layshaft bearing for reasons noted elsehwere in this thread and throughout this forum.

Sound advice!
 
as always lots of great advice from you guys.
No time for now to set it apart. will keep things as they are and ride soft and careful, change the oil again in a few weeks time and as soon as I have some spare time put my hands on it.
Suggestions as to what I should defo change once I open it up?
 
If its really done miles with no oil in it, all the gears with galled and spalled teeth will tell what needs changing.
As well as all the bushes flogged out, and the bearings with rough patches on their tracks.

But you may have been lucky.
If it was mine, I wouldn't push my luck any further, inspect now, your life may depend on it ?
 
Man, I used to soil my underwear just worrying that the layshaft bearing in my well lubed and perfectly behaved gearbox would self-destruct at speed on the highway.

I'm with the "open the box and find out" crew on this one. Although hobot has a point, as he generally does, about the overall risk profile of our sport.
 
What a bunch of p-ssie's, he's already gone beyond expected life time of gb survival, and we've seen some horrific gear finishes a brave soul is gonna freaken race on so lighten up and let's let fate work out and see what happens with just some lube added and learn a thing or two that goes against our grain. If it blows up and takes him down with injury and damage then for sure you'all can say Hey We told ya So, but on the other hand life is short so ride the snot out of it while ya can. Its all the traumas and harsh learning curves I went through that make some my post worthwhile. Besides making friends with folks here is quite a bit secondary to striking up a great working relationship with reliable vendors don't ya know. When ever ya do tear it down get its guts cryo tempered bearing and bushes and o rings and shafts and cases and KS inside splines to boot, literally.
 
If it were mine, I'd pull it apart and see what I see. And go from there. I mean how long can it take to pull the covers off and have a lookie.

That's all I'm sayin'.

But it's not mine.

Dave
69S
 
Well there ya go, send it to DogT to go though toughly then can just enjoy the riding like me.
 
" Well there ya go, send it to DogT to go though toughly then can just enjoy the riding like me. "

" though toughly " :)

" "
RRR HHRRRR .

:wink: :oops:

Right , well then . :o When you change it in a few weeks , use a white ice cream thingo , to drain into .
Preferably overnight . Pour the top of when settled ( a few days ) into a holder . And glare at dregs . stir with fingertip .
Look for gold dust , iron dust ( steel ) & schrapnel .

If there aint none , you are indeed lucky .
you could fill with kero 7 shake the s*** out of it , to flush . Spinning through on mainstand , briefly . maybe . perhaps .
 
Oh ugh Matt, if you'd had great ride day with me and Wesley, you might glaze over to confuse a dumb spell checker too. Wes's curmudgeon wisdoms, one of which is just ignore it till ya can't - are rubbing off on me - so I vote run that tranny into the ground then renew it and do it again. Its less likely to stop ya or take ya down than everything else out there, going by others and my own fates. hehe I'd get it swinging too...


gearbox oil? why bother...


Damocles sat down in the king's throne surrounded by every luxury, but Dionysius arranged that a huge sword should hang above the throne, held at the pommel only by a single hair of a horse's tail. Damocles finally begged the tyrant that he be allowed to depart, because he no longer wanted to be so fortunate.

Dionysius had successfully conveyed a sense of the constant fear in which the great man lives. Cicero uses this story as the last in a series of contrasting examples for reaching the conclusion he had been moving towards in this fifth Disputation, in which the theme is that virtue is sufficient for living a happy life.[6] Cicero asks:

Does not Dionysius seem to have made it sufficiently clear that there can be nothing happy for the person over whom some fear always looms?
 
hobot said:
What a bunch of p-ssie's, he's already gone beyond expected life time of gb survival, and we've seen some horrific gear finishes a brave soul is gonna freaken race on so lighten up and let's let fate work out and see what happens with just some lube added and learn a thing or two that goes against our grain. If it blows up and takes him down with injury and damage then for sure you'all can say Hey We told ya So, .

hey Hobot, this is an intriguing perspective, but the more I think about it and the more I know I'd rather not be the subject of testing against fate. (yeah, I guess I must be a p-ssie...). I think your post calls, more than anyone else's, for: get the gearbox down now! and that's no doubt what I'll do (as soon as I got the time for that)!
Now I keep wondering: I've done a complete overhaul of the bike in the last year. why did I not dare to even look into the gearbox? bah...
 
Well as the NIR is this week,you either stay at home and strip the box,or fill it up and take the risk. but as it's been said. fill the box with flushing oil and drain it into a dish, if there is no nasty stuff comming out..you should be OK. stick a magnetic drain plug in..just incase :!: It's surprising how little lube some things need, other than heat removal ,anything greater than a surface film is a waiste.....
 
When I was 17 in 1976 out in Orange County CA my Fastback kick starter kept swinging down and I had to tie it up with a bungie chord. I took it in to the local Norton guy and he informed me that it had no oil in the transmission!! He said he replaced two bushings and charged me 100 bucks. Those were the days! But, now I check my own oil.
 
john robert bould said:
Well as the NIR is this week,you either stay at home and strip the box,or fill it up and take the risk.

think I'll stay home... I could still put the bike in my van and carry it close to the location but I'd have to hide from the other folks... would not want to be teased by everyone there... ;-)

(BTW John, I am sooo glad I fitted your dampers upgrade, amazing what that can do to the bike's handling - great job with that stuff!)
 
hobot said:
What a bunch of p-ssie's, he's already gone beyond expected life time of gb survival, and we've seen some horrific gear finishes a brave soul is gonna freaken race on so lighten up and let's let fate work out and see what happens with just some lube added and learn a thing or two that goes against our grain. If it blows up and takes him down with injury and damage then for sure you'all can say Hey We told ya So, but on the other hand life is short so ride the snot out of it while ya can. Its all the traumas and harsh learning curves I went through that make some my post worthwhile. Besides making friends with folks here is quite a bit secondary to striking up a great working relationship with reliable vendors don't ya know. When ever ya do tear it down get its guts cryo tempered bearing and bushes and o rings and shafts and cases and KS inside splines to boot, literally.

You get some of the best bipolar advice on this list. Take your chances and ride it to destruction as if you were a macho he man but ooooh nooo (whilst holding the tea cup with pinky firmly stuck out), must cryo temper bearings and bushings ...and o-rings?, and shafts and cases and KS inside splines and blah blah blah. This forum really brightens my day reading how off the wall things can get. I am glad it becomes so apparent so quickly to most.

Keep up the steady stream of ....................
 
I would get the bike in the van,and go! as i have said, if there is no nasty stuff drained from the box, fill up and ride steady.
glad you approve of the Lansdowne-dampers...300 sets sold, with only 4 issues.

Orsonoce said:
john robert bould said:
Well as the NIR is this week,you either stay at home and strip the box,or fill it up and take the risk.

think I'll stay home... I could still put the bike in my van and carry it close to the location but I'd have to hide from the other folks... would not want to be teased by everyone there... ;-)

(BTW John, I am sooo glad I fitted your dampers upgrade, amazing what that can do to the bike's handling - great job with that stuff!)
 
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