Fullauto head vs combat head vs standard head

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comnoz

comnoz

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A couple years ago when I was doing the design work for the Fullauto head ports I had a lightening strike that took out my flowbench computer. I could still test flow but I couldn't do the analyzing and charting. This morning I finally got the full system up and running again. I started out with intake flow tests on three Norton heads . None of these heads have been modified in any way and all were flowed using the same valves and a spigot type manifold with the same velocity stack.

The first line is the green line that is the lowest at .250 lift. It is a NOS 750 head with 30 mm ports.

The second line is the blue line and is a low mileage combat 750 head with 32mm ports.

The top two lines are white and green and are left and right intake ports from the Fullauto head. Ken hasn't even seen these yet. Merry x-mas Ken. Jim

Fullauto head vs combat head vs standard head
 
mikegray660 said:
impressive!

less impressive is difference between combat and standard 750....
Click to expand...

Yes, all of the 32mm port heads go flat at around .250 lift. It is because the short side radius is too small. When the airspeed reaches a certain number it can no longer make the turn down to the seat so it shoots off across the back side of the valve and plugs up the works. Jim
 
Guessing from the pic of the chart, It looks llke the Full Auto head is about 15 CFM better at .450" lift. That is a lot. Nice.
 
Is that Fullauto head a 750 or 850? Does it matter?

Thanks for the data. You might end up having to explain it to us idiots but it looks impressive!

Russ
 
rvich said:
Is that Fullauto head a 750 or 850? Does it matter?

Thanks for the data. You might end up having to explain it to us idiots but it looks impressive!

Russ
Click to expand...

The porting is identical in either the 750 or 850 Fullauto head. Jim
 
Very nice work Jim, How much time do you figure you put into the final design? There is a guy my brother introduced me to when we were on the salt one year, He also had something to do with the flow bench. Can you guess who it is? :wink:
Fullauto head vs combat head vs standard head

One clue, he's in the motorcycle hall of fame. The guy on the right.
 
Well since the port design that is in that head started in the early 90's on my racebike I would hate to know how many hours are in it.

The picture made me think of the person that taught me cylinder head porting but I don't know who it is.
This is who taught my porting class many years ago. Do you know who this is.

Fullauto head vs combat head vs standard head
 
comnoz said:
rvich said:
Is that Fullauto head a 750 or 850? Does it matter?

Thanks for the data. You might end up having to explain it to us idiots but it looks impressive!

Russ
Click to expand...

The porting is identical in either the 750 or 850 Fullauto head. Jim
Click to expand...

$2000! I think I just died. O_O
 
Hortons Norton said:
The picture I posted is Jerry Branch, Could your picture be of your father?
Click to expand...

Sorry, my father was an Iowa farmer. I went to porting school not far from you at Joe Mondello's school. Jim
 
I just kinda figured with your skills in all these areas you must have a family history of some sort of fine motor oil running through your veins. But farmers need to do all things mechanical also, I'm sure you must have picked up some of your skills from your Dad. Where was the school you went to? Jerry did his work in Long Beach on motorcycles. In fact he is the one that is said to have invented the flow bench, Correct me if this is not true. Thanks for posting the chart and spending the time on Nortons. Now if I could just hit the lottery I know there are a whole bunch of parts out there that I would love to buy, The Fullauto head being one of them. :wink:
 
Well done Jim. Your cheque is in the mail.

Ooops. That was supposed to be a PM !!

With over 10,000 miles on my head now, I am still amazed at the punch my bike has from zero revs right through the mid range. It has been noted by others who have ridden it as well.

2000 bucks? If you only knew the amount of effort and expertise (not to mention money) that went into these heads, you'd be asking why they can be sold so cheaply.
 
Fullauto said:
Well done Jim. Your cheque is in the mail.

Ooops. That was supposed to be a PM !!

With over 10,000 miles on my head now, I am still amazed at the punch my bike has from zero revs right through the mid range. It has been noted by others who have ridden it as well.

2000 bucks? If you only knew the amount of effort and expertise (not to mention money) that went into these heads, you'd be asking why they can be sold so cheaply.
Click to expand...

Keep in mind I'm only 25 and make <50k/year. I'm not saying it's not "worth" $2000, I'm just saying it's more than I'll ever be able to afford (DAMN!). Not everyone is in the same boat and I'm sure they'll be absolutely STOKED to have such a nice cyl head on their beloved Commando.

Nice work!

-Jordan
 
Hortons Norton said:
I just kinda figured with your skills in all these areas you must have a family history of some sort of fine motor oil running through your veins. But farmers need to do all things mechanical also, I'm sure you must have picked up some of your skills from your Dad. Where was the school you went to? Jerry did his work in Long Beach on motorcycles. In fact he is the one that is said to have invented the flow bench, Correct me if this is not true. Thanks for posting the chart and spending the time on Nortons. Now if I could just hit the lottery I know there are a whole bunch of parts out there that I would love to buy, The Fullauto head being one of them. :wink:
Click to expand...

Joe Mondello's was- [is?] in Paso Robles. He had ties with GM in those days and it was through GM that I got to go. Jim
http://www.nitrogeezers.com/joe_mondello.htm
 
KSUWildcatFan said:
Fullauto said:
Well done Jim. Your cheque is in the mail.

Ooops. That was supposed to be a PM !!

With over 10,000 miles on my head now, I am still amazed at the punch my bike has from zero revs right through the mid range. It has been noted by others who have ridden it as well.

2000 bucks? If you only knew the amount of effort and expertise (not to mention money) that went into these heads, you'd be asking why they can be sold so cheaply.
Click to expand...

Keep in mind I'm only 25 and make <50k/year. I'm not saying it's not "worth" $2000, I'm just saying it's more than I'll ever be able to afford (DAMN!). Not everyone is in the same boat and I'm sure they'll be absolutely STOKED to have such a nice cyl head on their beloved Commando.

Nice work!

-Jordan
Click to expand...

Don't feel bad it's WAY out of my price league too. Be lucky you have a job, as I don't think I'm ever going to find one again.
 
-Jordan[/quote]

Don't feel bad it's WAY out of my price league too. Be lucky you have a job, as I don't think I'm ever going to find one again.[/quote]

Well jobs are overrated anyway. You just end up with that 4 letter word-work. Jim
 
Us old bikers are sure a tight bunch. $2000 is dirt cheap for the engineering advance. Consider what it'd cost if a Duci or even a Harely hi end head.
It takes about 150 cfm per 100hp so 15 cfm = ~15 hp gain, REMARKABLE!
Then can play with cam profiles and bigger carb or injectors = oh my my.
 
It would be cool if someone had a kick ass CNC setup for optimal porting. clamp down the head and push go. Should be cheaper than $2K, and repeatable. Just saying, hint hint.
 
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