Fake numbers???

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Jun 13, 2011
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I believe that I may have been duped!! The following are pictures of the head stock after several coats of paint removed. When I first got the bike, the PO showed me to the right of the head stock "home made numbers". Now after paint stripper, to the left of the head stock I notice the more legitmate numbers. Also I've noticed that the holes for the rivets have been filled in with weld and sanded smooth.

Can I respectfully ask the membership for their knowlegde in regards to the numbers below. I know that crazy stuff had happened in the 70's, I'm hoping this may still be a matching numbers bike.

The first image when looking at the "home made numbers" the VIN has the 3 and S backwards, but the 00125 has got me stumped.

The seconds image is the more legit stampings, never seen with all the paint.

The last image is the engine numbers.

Lastly, not shown in pictures is another set of numbers. The left side of the frame where the coils are placed have the numbers "064140"

Again any input would be great!!

d63061cf.jpg


e030d083.jpg


0ec69c02.jpg
 

Norton Dave

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No expert on this but it appears the engine is 750 cc 1971 vintage , but the frame is definately late 850 which started in 1973 hope this helps . You did not state what it was you purchsed sorry , Norton Dave.
 

L.A.B.

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canadiancopper71 said:
The first image when looking at the "home made numbers" the VIN has the 3 and S backwards, but the 00125 has got me stumped.

The seconds image is the more legit stampings, never seen with all the paint.

The last image is the engine numbers.

You have a '71 750 engine and a '73 or '74 850 frame.

For whatever reason the original certification plate has been removed and the "home made" number obviously stamped (albeit incorrectly) to match the engine.

*850*F106291* with the factory limit marks appears legitimate and correct for an 850 frame. The 00125 number is probably original, (however the significance of this 5-digit number is still-as yet, unknown and my be some kind of factory production marking).

http://atlanticgreen.com/commandoframes.htm


canadiancopper71 said:
Lastly, not shown in pictures is another set of numbers. The left side of the frame where the coils are placed have the numbers "064140"

064140 is the '73 850 frame part number and is stamped in the normal position.

Edit: According to the Atlanticgreen list, the F106xxx frame number relates to approximately March '74 production, by which time I would have expected the frame part number to be 065404 not that this is particularly significant. Check if there is a date stamp on the frame gusset in the area behind the left hand Z plate?
 
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Which matches your title and year? The gearbox should also have a matching number.
 
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What numbers are on your title?

If your were going to fake some numbers, you'd think you'd be a little less sloppy.
 
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Tks again guys, the ownership shows the same number as the engine, 20m3s144365. The only stampings that I could find on the gearbox is "NA8108".

Me thinks that this is a mishmash of parts. Nothing matching.

Admittely, I'm quite ignorant to the petagree.
 
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Another forum that I visit deals with "choppers". They have an occassional thread about VINs, and it seems that the general concensus there is to be very carefull. I assume the "chopper" crowd gets targeted for VIN checks a little more often then the Norton crowd, but they say that any hint of funky numbers can lead to an impounding of said bike.

I'm sure it's different with every locality, but you might want to get things inspected, and make sure that you won't get hassled in the future.
 
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Contact Fred at OldBrits. I believe he offers stamped data plates. Then simply direct any inspectors to the motor and data plate which match the title. :wink:
We'll need to research the build date for the plate.
 
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I think most officers are trained to looked for stamped frames, not the ID plates.
 
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If yours are anything like Ohio's, as soon as they find a number that matches the title, they stop looking.
 

kevbo82

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hh76 said:
I think most officers are trained to looked for stamped frames, not the ID plates.
local police in my area just shot and killed a man while his hands were cuffed behind his back. Don't think they had ANY training let alone how to spot rip off cycles.
 
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First off, I would like to thank all for their input!!

After visiting the "AtlanticGreen" website, I never knew that the Italian frames were a bit larger on the rear hoop. That is the reason why I have a hard time dry fitting the rear tail piece.

Is there any tips on how to fit the rear tail section without cracking the paint. I will be adding more flex agent to the paint, but its the fibreglass I'm worried about.

Again, cheers gents.
 

concours

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WORST case is it was a stolen bike, maybe decades ago, engine sold, engine and clean paperwork from a crashed bike. Or something.
 

concours

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WORST case is it was a stolen bike, maybe decades ago, engine sold, engine and clean paperwork from a crashed bike. Or something.
 
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Most likely someone bounced it off the sceneary , and getting all inspired fitted a replacement 850 frame , as the press ranted about improvements
and whined of wobbles .A whole Degree of head angle ( out ) and 1/2 inch of trail , variation . Pre & post . Should have long inner gussets to stop
on shock brackets subframe collapseing if pillion overeats .

Judgeing by the number ' parted out ' on Ebay , even odds the perpetrator just restamped to evade endlesss beaurocratic nonsense attempting notification
of replacement . Unless it fell of the back off a truck .

A few pictures of the rest wouldnt go amiss , A FASTBACK , we presume . Youre going to have to get out the disc grinder and plane / shave a few high spots
Get the straight edge and marker pen to mark a centreline along underside inside , heave fastback over and throw a lamp up in it , and mark further
of slither between and mark. Then its plane it with a new disc , or a little worn one if you just carve a bit of a trough along in places .

Leaning the edge of the palm of the hand to steady , and NOT building ANY temperature if theres more than a mm or two to ' clear ' .

At least the 00125 doesnt mean he put a 125 Honda engine in it . ! :mrgreen:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/travelling ... otostream/
The R.C.M.P. allways get their man . :D
 
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