decal problems "help" (2010)

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sammy2chins

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May 29, 2010
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Hi all I'm haveing the tank and side cover painted and the decal was put on and clear coated and in a hour it started to bubble up i bought the decals from "old Brit" The painter said I need a Water based decal.. I'm I useing the wrong Decal ??
 
I've read about this being a common problem, but don't know how to solve it. Sorry. Someone will be able to help you out here.
 
Both MarshalNorton and I used Old Britts decals for our tank Norton logos and we used the same painter for our tanks. No problems with clearing over them. So I don't think it is the decal. MAybe the paint? He used an automotive type base coat /clear coat.
 
All water transfers (decals) need to have the clear lacquer dusted on with the first couple of coats and left to flash off for 10 mins. Then you can apply the clear in heavier coats but don't overdo it.
 
Keith1069 said:
All water transfers (decals) need to have the clear lacquer dusted on with the first couple of coats and left to flash off for 10 mins. Then you can apply the clear in heavier coats but don't overdo it.
Click to expand...

Beat me to it!
Waterslide decals also need a good 24 hours to get rid of any residual moisture before lacquering. The ones on my sidepanels were waterslide from the VMCC in the UK, and after a couple of light dust coats of 2-pack HS lacquer I gave them a single heavy coat, and they now look painted on, with no discernible edge.
My only regret is I couldn't get waterslide tank transfers.
 
Take it from an experienced painter... water slides do NOT like to be cleared. I use vinyl decals, properly scuffed. Or better still airbrush the emblem on with a stencil.
 
I found out that I have the vinyl Decals Not the water transfers . so we will clear coat then put the decals on to avoid any problems .. YES OR NO ??
 
maylar said:
Take it from an experienced painter... water slides do NOT like to be cleared. I use vinyl decals, properly scuffed. Or better still airbrush the emblem on with a stencil.
Click to expand...
did you clearcoat?? over the Decals??
 
batrider said:
Both MarshalNorton and I used Old Britts decals for our tank Norton logos and we used the same painter for our tanks. No problems with clearing over them. So I don't think it is the decal. MAybe the paint? He used an automotive type base coat /clear coat.
Click to expand...
is there a differences ?
 
I have tried multiple types of rattle can clear coats over the Old Britts vinyl decals, and I have yet to find something that will not make it wrinkle up. Even after months of the decal being applied. Maybe the 2 pack auto paint has some magical properties. I would sure like to know, but then I understand that the original gel coat on the fiberglass tanks had the vinyl decals applied and that was it. No overcoat.

I wish someone could supply the secret to protect the vinyl decals other than a pro painter.

Dave
69S
 
Hi guys.
Im a spray painter and have worked in a sign shop clear coating over vinyl almost everyday, this is a slow process and should not be rushed,it is best to give job 2 coats of clear and let it cure, then sand with 800 grit wet, clean with cleaning solvent and apply vinyl decals and sit job in the sun for a day or so,this lets the vinyl degas, the heat from the sun opens the pores in the vinyl and lets any air that has been traped under it escape and the decal will settle down nicely, let it cool and give 2 or 3 coats of clear, first coat very lite and giving plenty of time to flash off between coats.
Cheers simon.
 
With respect to rattle can paint, I can only assume that the Professional automotive refinishing trade were behind formulating that stuff - once you've had a go with spray cans you'll be happy to give those guys your business in future!

2-pack clear can respond adversely to what it's covering, hence one or two dust-coats first. After this it can be applied quite liberally, and it self-levels like nothing else - it even makes my work look respectable.
Being catalyst-baesd, once it's dry that's it. Many years ago (before 2-pack) I did a Triton tank for a friend, and in order to get a good shine I used about 3 or 4 coats of aerosol clear. Looked great for a few weeks, until the cracks started appearing :shock:
 
Gday All,
I read with great interest previous threads. A spray painter friend of mine tells me that clear over base should be applied before the base coat goes off. His reasoning for this is, the clear wont bond aswell and may laminate. His statement has made me postpone the painting of my Tank Shop 5 gal Manx tank until I can find out whats the best way. Im wondering if the thinners used,(as theres many sorts),maybe reactive to vinyll. Are there also different grades of vinyl used?
Foxy
 
My procedure is to paint one reduced coat of urethane clear over the color and wait overnight for it to dry. Then scuff the clear with Presta Scuff Stuff abrasive paste and apply the decals. I scuff the surface of the decals carefully with Scuff Stuff so subsequent coats of clear will stick to them. If you forget that step the clear can delaminate (DAMHIK).

When I paint the final clear coat I start with a 50-50 reduced light coat and wait 20 minutes before the next. Then follow with the normal 3 coats waiting 10 minutes in between. You need to be careful wet sanding and buffing or you risk having no clear on the edges and the buffer can rip the decal off (again, DAMHIK).

There are different "grades" of vinyl, and you can't predict what you'll get until they're in your hands. The "good" stuff is 2 mil thick and doesn't wrinkle under clear. Decals I've bought from Old Britts have been good.

These are two tanks I've done in the last few years.. the blue one is actually purple (my camera lies), the red one is mine. Clear is Glasurit 155.

decal problems "help" (2010)


decal problems "help" (2010)
 
Gday Maylar,
good description and top examples on how it should be done! Wondering about the pin stripes, are they vinyl aswell? Ive used glasurit before on my Harley, a bit more exspensive than other paints but worth it when you see the results!
A few years back glasurit did have some issues with delamination, but have fixed it with new clear.

Have you ever mixed clear with base/color on final coates for more depth and gloss? I use to do this with enamel and the results are brilliant.
Rgds Foxy
 
Foxy, the wide stripe on the '72 is airbrushed silver done with masking. The narrow stripes on the red tank are vinyl. When clearing over vinyl stripes an additional time element is required (over night) checking every few hours that the stripes stay down flat. There is a tendancy for them to curl up and lift away in tight bends, so I constantly run my finger over them until I'm satisfied they're not going to move. 3M is the ONLY brand of stripes I'll use.

In the world of paint, as in most things, you get what you pay for. Glasurit is "top shelf". I find that the more expensive paints are more forgiving of application variables and give the hobbiest painter better chances of success.

I mixed color and clear laquer years ago for special effect, with poor results. I was a newbie painter then.
 
Ive been painting 25 years.Last week,I painted all my parts, in house of Kolor metalflake.Did everything right.Today, applied decals and they rucked up under (2k) lasquer.Tried to bury the bad parts, but it didnt work.Never had this happen before,using vinyl decals, so I didnt change my procedure.Thats another 3/4 days of work as the colour coats are now f***ed.Ill either find some stencils or just apply over the lacquer.Unless I can find wateslides.Decals were from Andover.Not blaming them.Probably same as sourced from Old Britts.
 
Yup.Done that many times before.For whatever reason, didnt work this time.Looked like a combination, of two much thinners and maybe not eonugh time between coats .Who knows.Think ill try and source some stencils.Far less drama involved, if it goes wrong.
 
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