Commando Newbie

CHARGER · Mar 1, 2014

Hi Guy's,

My name is Lee from Gold Coast, Australia.
After a few years of Lusting for a Norton, yesterday was finally my day to pull the trigger

Picked up a 1975 Norton Commando 850, pretty complete and running Non import.

It needs a bit of loving but I am very happy with it.

Now I am new to Lucas and british wiring, the bike had no key and someone has hot wired the coils to get her running, obviously I need to sort out getting a key cut
or new Ignition Barrel and un hotwire it so I can get the lights and such running.

A manual is on its way to me but I was hoping someone could shed some light on what I am missing, I bypassed the Key Switch and did some testing finding no life at the Key Switch end, I then went back to the wiring beside the battery and I believe I am missing something Regulator Rectifier maybe? some sort of fuse box? I have included a pic of the original wires sitting unplugged below
Pic Here - https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B7PK3IiDMdkjY21iQ3l3T25MRGc/edit?usp=sharing

Thanks very much in advance for any help

olChris · Mar 1, 2014

Welcome

.. The pic didn't work for me. I dont know if other can open it.. Good luck ...

ooops....... I see the server had a crash last night, so your pic may have got lost through that .. Maybe try again...

1up3down · Mar 1, 2014

I had no problem viewing the picture using my Google Chrome browser

however, I can be of no help with the wiring

Matt Spencer · Mar 1, 2014

Likely the problem , new smoke should doit .

Lighting Switch is in the Headlamp,,some would consider custom wireing par for the course . Its all perfectly logical .

L.A.B. · Mar 1, 2014

Welcome to the forum, Lee.

CHARGER said:
A manual is on its way to me but I was hoping someone could shed some light on what I am missing, I bypassed the Key Switch and did some testing finding no life at the Key Switch end, I then went back to the wiring beside the battery and I believe I am missing something Regulator Rectifier maybe? some sort of fuse box? I have included a pic of the original wires sitting unplugged below
Pic Here - https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B7PK3IiDMdkjY21iQ3l3T25MRGc/edit?usp=sharing

The missing component is the (charge) warning light unit (see manual-electrical section J8) otherwise known as the "assimilator", however the lack of the assimilator shouldn't prevent power reaching the ignition switch, so check continuity of the Brown/Blue [NU] wire between the battery (-) and the ignition switch (refer to the wiring diagram, manual, section J).

One place where there is likely to be "break" in continuity is at the 2MC emergency start capacitor if the Brown/Blue wires are disconnected, of course the 2MC unit may also be missing? If the 2MC is missing, connect the two Brown/Blue wires together.

Until your manual arrives-

Factory 850 Mk.III Manual pdf:
http://britmoto.com/manuals/Manuals/850_man.pdf

Mk.III assimilator (modern replacement but similar to the original item) http://www.britcycle.com/products/06/06_6393.htm

L.A.B. · Mar 1, 2014

Matt Spencer said:
Lighting Switch is in the Headlamp,

There's no lighting switch in the headlamp of the 850 MkIII model.

CHARGER · Mar 1, 2014

Thankyou Very much guy's.

I will get reading and try nut it out

concours · Mar 1, 2014

Hi, Welcome. You know about the POSITIVE earth, yes? Many batteries accidentally connected backwards by newbs. Sorry if it too basic. You're doing well, slow and easy :mrgreen:

CHARGER · Mar 2, 2014

Hi thanks concours,

Yes I was pretty hesitant at first hooking up the battery but sourced some info first and got it running surprisingly quickly.

A lot to learn that's for sure but I love the quirky old girl

kerinorton · Mar 3, 2014

why bother spending $80.00 on a warning light assimilator when a 5 pin relay, wired correctly will do the same thing for approx. $8.00 plus a little wire and connectors. The warning light serves no function in the charging circuit accept telling you when the bike is charging.

CHARGER · Mar 5, 2014

So, I got a key cut and have hooked up the original ignition wires to the key switch.........

Someone has run a wire straight from one side of the "Ballast I believe it is" between the coils back to the Negative on the Battery to hotwire start it.

The red wire you see connected is a wire that was run straight to the Negative on the battery allowing me to Kick start the engine and give spark, I want to ditch that now
that I have a key

In the Picture Below is what I have, I am assuming I have to re attach either of the hanging wires or both? one is "White/Yellow" and the other is "Red", wondering
if the Spade/Bolt Hole connector is factory and meant to be there?
wires running to the other side of the ballast are both "White Purple"

CHARGER · Mar 5, 2014

L.A.B. said:
Welcome to the forum, Lee.

CHARGER said:

A manual is on its way to me but I was hoping someone could shed some light on what I am missing, I bypassed the Key Switch and did some testing finding no life at the Key Switch end, I then went back to the wiring beside the battery and I believe I am missing something Regulator Rectifier maybe? some sort of fuse box? I have included a pic of the original wires sitting unplugged below
Pic Here - https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B7PK3IiDMdkjY21iQ3l3T25MRGc/edit?usp=sharing

Click to expand...

The missing component is the (charge) warning light unit (see manual-electrical section J8) otherwise known as the "assimilator", however the lack of the assimilator shouldn't prevent power reaching the ignition switch, so check continuity of the Brown/Blue [NU] wire between the battery (-) and the ignition switch (refer to the wiring diagram, manual, section J).

One place where there is likely to be "break" in continuity is at the 2MC emergency start capacitor if the Brown/Blue wires are disconnected, of course the 2MC unit may also be missing? If the 2MC is missing, connect the two Brown/Blue wires together.

Until your manual arrives-

Factory 850 Mk.III Manual pdf:
http://britmoto.com/manuals/Manuals/850_man.pdf

Mk.III assimilator (modern replacement but similar to the original item) http://www.britcycle.com/products/06/06_6393.htm

I assume this is the 2MC Emergency Start Capacitor?

seems the Brown Blue wire is connected, I believe I have continuity from the Battery - to the Brown/Blue at the ignition "New multimeter" but im sure I tested correct.

I investigated the loom more and found This?

Two chopped red wires and a Brown/Blue does this split out from the loom look standard?

Also someone has jigged with this aswell

The Purple Black wire has a red wire crimpted to it going knowhere and there is a black plug with purple black female connector hanging
just out of picture I assume I can connect this back up aswell

Thanks!

Hobot · Mar 5, 2014

The blue can capacitor is for battery-less running. There are a lot of dead end loops and wires for police equipment so before connecting wires better trace em as who knows what was scabbed in by someone ignoring color codes.

L.A.B. · Mar 5, 2014

CHARGER said:
I assume this is the 2MC Emergency Start Capacitor?

It is.

CHARGER said:
seems the Brown Blue wire is connected, I believe I have continuity from the Battery - to the Brown/Blue at the ignition "New multimeter" but im sure I tested correct.

I can't exactly tell from the photo, but there would usually two Brown/Blue spade connections to the 2MC (and 1 Red) , 1 single & 1 double Brown/Blue OR, *two doubles*? Some "Mk.III main harnesses" may have *two double* wire connections to the 2MC, lets call this "harness Type 1", and disconnecting either double wire terminal will probably result in a break in continuity. If however, there is a single and a double wire ("harness Type 2"), it probably does not cause a break to the Ign.Sw. if either Brown/Blue wire is disconnected from the 2MC.

However, as you say you have continuity to the ignition switch (Ign. Sw. terminal 1?) then the 2MC connections are probably OK.

CHARGER said:
I investigated the loom more and found This?

Two chopped red wires and a Brown/Blue does this split out from the loom look standard?

It's difficult to say? [Edit]Mk.III harnesses have a single Brown/Blue from battery negative into the harness.

CHARGER said:
Also someone has jigged with this aswell

The Purple Black wire has a red wire crimpted to it going knowhere and there is a black plug with purple black female connector hanging
just out of picture I assume I can connect this back up aswell

Purple/Black [PB] is normally the power feed to the horn (from the handlebar push button) so further investigation may be necessary if, as you say, it appears to be connected to a Red wire going nowhere?

drones76 · Mar 5, 2014

Get one of these. Great investment.

http://colorwiringdiagrams.com/norton.htm

CHARGER · Jun 18, 2014

Hey guys,

Got most of my wiring sorted out, was a dicky ignition key switch that was causing most of my issues
after I worked out Blue Brown was the main feed and not connected to the battery at all!

however am now stuck on the indicators.

Do all 4 or at least a pair on each side have to be connected for indicators to work? reason I ask is I have
just been testing out of the headlight bucket straight to RH Front indicator and i'm getting nothing.
No other indicators are hooked up though.

I have replaced the clicker also.

Cheers

Matt Spencer · Jun 18, 2014

They tend to go at twice speed , if one end ( F / R ) is out , due to half the resistance or whatever .
or maybe just go clickaclickaclicka . BUZZ . But that would indicate

the circuit is complete or
half there , Throwing two at one end it should click right , or left

as the case may be .

kerinorton · Jun 19, 2014

L.A.B. said:
Welcome to the forum, Lee.

CHARGER said:

A manual is on its way to me but I was hoping someone could shed some light on what I am missing, I bypassed the Key Switch and did some testing finding no life at the Key Switch end, I then went back to the wiring beside the battery and I believe I am missing something Regulator Rectifier maybe? some sort of fuse box? I have included a pic of the original wires sitting unplugged below
Pic Here - https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B7PK3IiDMdkjY21iQ3l3T25MRGc/edit?usp=sharing

Click to expand...

The missing component is the (charge) warning light unit (see manual-electrical section J8) otherwise known as the "assimilator", however the lack of the assimilator shouldn't prevent power reaching the ignition switch, so check continuity of the Brown/Blue [NU] wire between the battery (-) and the ignition switch (refer to the wiring diagram, manual, section J).

One place where there is likely to be "break" in continuity is at the 2MC emergency start capacitor if the Brown/Blue wires are disconnected, of course the 2MC unit may also be missing? If the 2MC is missing, connect the two Brown/Blue wires together.

Until your manual arrives-

Factory 850 Mk.III Manual pdf:
http://britmoto.com/manuals/Manuals/850_man.pdf

Mk.III assimilator (modern replacement but similar to the original item) http://www.britcycle.com/products/06/06_6393.htm

The assimilator does nothing to enhance the running of the bike. It sole purpose is to make the ign warning light work. That light only works when the alternator is charging.,. So, please forget about using these expesive W L assimilators when a cheap 5 pin relay will do the same job. the 5 pin has a power on mode and a power off mode. just connect it up so that the power off mde sie [ I think 87a ] powers the warning light. Ie, when the charging system powers up, it switches off the warning light. Simple and not expensive.

Hobot · Jun 19, 2014

Amend to key on or off assembulator light. Very proper to remove or bypass it and install V-meter as is to fix the lack of under tube brace on '68's or add brake safety spring. Solid state replacement available for those that tend to forget to turn off engine some times or don't know idle is bad and don't keep a charge up by amber warning light reminder.

Jed · Jun 20, 2014

It helps to replace as many spade/bullet connectors as possible the standard lucas ones lose their memory causing bad connections
i painstakingly traced every wire with a voltmeterFound a few irregularities but no problems since
If electronic ignition is installed (a must) then the ceramic resistor becomes obsolete
Your flasher cam may be the blinker problem but again a voltmeter will sort that out
A wiring diagram has been posted on this site and is available on the web
A little daunting at first glance but after a while it becomes clearer (if your alternator is 2 phase)

Good lick and welcome

Jed

Commando Newbie

CHARGER

olChris

1up3down

Matt Spencer

L.A.B.

Moderator

L.A.B.

Moderator

CHARGER

concours

CHARGER

kerinorton

CHARGER

CHARGER

Hobot

L.A.B.

Moderator

drones76

CHARGER

Matt Spencer

kerinorton

Hobot

Jed

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