Carb gasket

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Carb gasket


I don't know if the photo that I have attempted to post has come thru- it shows one of my two Amal carbs, and you may be able to make out that part of the gasket between the float bowl and the rest of the carb has come away. I was washing the bike today; and as I wiped the carb the gasket came off. I think a little strip might still be in place - i.e. That there is still a strip of gasket forming a seal.

If not I am guessing that a vacuum is required to have the carb operate properly, and that if air gets into the carb thru the damaged gasket the carb will run lean. Does that seem right? Can I damage the motor by running the bike with the damaged gasket?
 
Chris, is that the red gasket we can see on the float bowl.
No, that does not operate at a vacuum - but it does keep the fuel in the float bowl !!

Your fav-o-rite spares shop could probably supply them off the shelf, probably for less than a few bucks.
Or readily off the internet, mail order.
They are not that difficult to install yourself either, although some/minimal mechanical skills are required for this.

Check carefully, if fuel starts leaking there its a potential fire hazard.
 
Thanks Rowen - I will order replacements ; but in the mean time I assume that it should be ok to slather some gasket goo on the outside to discourage a leak?
 
Chris T said:
Thanks Rowen - I will order replacements ; but in the mean time I assume that it should be ok to slather some gasket goo on the outside to discourage a leak?

Yes. :)
 
Make sure the new gasket does not foul the float and don't use any sealent cheers baz
 
Chris T said:
Thanks Rowen - I will order replacements ; but in the mean time I assume that it should be ok to slather some gasket goo on the outside to discourage a leak?

If it's not currently leaking, it's not likely to anytime soon, so forego the goo and wait for the new gaskets to arrive. What came off is probably just excess since if the gasket came completely out from between the carb body and float bowl, you'd have continuous leakage of fuel.
 
I'd appreciate some further input into this issue.

I got a new gasket the other day to replace the faulty one - Amal 622/073 Float Bowl Gasket - MK I Amal Concentric Carbs. This is a genuine Amal part, but is different to the old gasket and the one on the other carb - which I assume to also have been a genuine Amal part as it was attached to the new Amal 930 carbs that were installed when the motor was rebuilt a few years ago; the float bowl has never been removed until now. On one of the vendor sites that I looked at there were several different part numbers for gaskets, with a statement "use 622/073"; so I wonder if there were different forms of gaskets produced by Amal in the past, now all replaced with 622/073.

I don't have a photo of the new gasket but below are pictures of the two carbs; one with the original gasket which is visible and red; the other with the new gasket installed which is narrower and thinner and invisible.

Carb gasket

Carb gasket




The issue that I now have is that with the new gasket in place the float bowl is leaking petrol past the gasket onto the outside of the float bowl. This has happened when the bike is on the side stand, so that the level of petrol may have gone above the gasket, but I didn't feel like starting the bike with petrol dripping so close to the cylinder block. If it leaks on the side stand presumably it will leak when the bike is leaned; even if it does not when the bike is upright.

It seems to me that the issue is that the new gasket is thinner than the one that it has replaced. It is possible that the float bowl has formed itself to the prior thicker gasket, and that there is a slight curvature in the bowl; the photo suggests that at the point where the screws attach the bowl the gap between the bowl and the carb is less than around the body of the bowl.

I have emailed Amal to ask about this; and have received a pretty prompt reply asking for more information, and expressing surprise, so this enquiry to members is running in tandem with my communication with Amal.

When I took the float bowl off the float came out, so I have had to reinsert it. It is possible that I have mucked up the level of the float, but I don't think so, I just put back the little pin and hooked the float to it, and made sure that the rod running through the float was in proper position.

So the question is how to stop the leak. I am assuming that there is no replacement Amal gasket that is thicker like the last one was.

Subject to what Amal suggests I suspect that I have the following alternatives:

1. See if I can bend down or file off the part of the float bowl where the screws attach the bowl to the carb - the gap between the bowl and carb at these points is less than around the rest of the bowl; but that might just be a function of the bowl bowing when the screws are tight;
2. carefully rub down the float bowl on sandpaper over glass to try and get the bowl absolutely level - a variation on 1.
3. try using two gaskets together instead of one. That would be my preference, as it would be the easiest solution. But would it work? Would there be a potential leak between the two gaskets? Is the thickness of the gasket of essential importance for the operation of the carburettor i.e. would the level of the float be compromised?
4. Get a non original thicker gasket. Is there such a thing?

Thoughts appreciated.

Isn't it typical with these old bikes that a minor issue - in this case touching a $2 part, can cause hours of communication and frustration sourcing a part and weeks of the bike being off the road (as it happens I ordered the gasket from one NZ supplier with some other things; the order was processed and the gasket omitted - out of stock despite the website stating it was available - and the other non essential stuff arrived - I had to reorder from another supplier - so a week or more lost right there).
 
Chris T said:
I don't have a photo of the new gasket but below are pictures of the two carbs; one with the original gasket which is visible and red; the other with the new gasket installed which is narrower and thinner and invisible.

If it's "thinner and invisible" then it doesn't sound like a genuine Amal gasket?
If it's grey/black and/or didn't come in a sealed 'Amal' bag, then it's unlikely to be genuine Amal.

This is the current type genuine 622/073 gasket.
Carb gasket



Chris T said:
1. See if I can bend down or file off the part of the float bowl where the screws attach the bowl to the carb - the gap between the bowl and carb at these points is less than around the rest of the bowl; but that might just be a function of the bowl bowing when the screws are tight;
2. carefully rub down the float bowl on sandpaper over glass to try and get the bowl absolutely level - a variation on 1.

This is usually worth doing (regardless of gasket type).
17-CurvedFloatBowl.jpg
 
As L.A.B. says - the float bowl usually distorts after a while, so it's well worth checking and fixing. Also, the gasket can trap the float pin if you aren't careful with alignment.

Regarding the fuel leaking when the bike is cornering - all the lateral forces generated by going around a bend are resolved through the bike's centreline - that's why it has to be leaned over.

In other words (and purely theoretically), if you had a bucket of water fixed to the top of the fuel tank, you'd see that as you went around a corner the water would stay parallel with the bottom of the bucket.

So, while your carb may have a leak, it won't get any worse simply because the bike leans in a turn!
 
Just to clarify things though - don't try to bend the screw lugs on the float bowl. Do the abrasive paper on a flat surface thing instead to level off the mounting surfaces.
If you do try to bend the lugs, they may well break off, which will mean replacing the bowls.

Actually, that's also a solution I suppose... :)

This is a common problem on Amals, together with bowing the mounting flange to the manifold.

Good luck,
Steve.
 
This is why I always say, "If it ain't broke, don't fix it" No leak before, replace gasket, leaks now.
 
I had a hunt around on the internet for Amal carb part stockists in Auckland and found a photo of what I think you have been sold.

The gasket is a bit thinner and grey - correct? And it doesn't seem to be sold in a Amal branded packet?

I have seen these gaskets in the light brown material as in LABs photo above and also in green. I have used both with no issues.

I haven't used the grey gasket but you should be able to sort it anyway.

This is honestly a really simple issue and should be fixed in 10 mins max.

First as stated above check your bowl surface is flat. Rub it on a flat surface with sandpaper to get it flat.

Check the tabs on the bowl where the screws go are not cracked.

Check the screws go fully home into the carb body. Sometime the threads can be damaged and the screws don't properly tighten.

Check to make sure you don't have the remains of the old gasket on the carb body.

If the gasket you have is thinner then use two. I have raced for years and often the carbs start leaking at the wrong time and I've used two gaskets lots of times.

Don't use any sealant

It can sometimes be a little tricky to get the bowl offered up to the carb body. The pin that holds the float in place can move so be sure everything is in place before tightening the screws.

From your photos I think you have small spring washers on the screws which is correct.

Generally you cannot over tighten with a screw driver but dont get carried away either.

Allen screws are also available for this purpose and these are much more easily over tightened - but also easier to use.
 
Wassell float bowl gaskets are excellent they do seem to seal better

slightly thicker material and they do not compress or loose shape like the new AMAL replacements


i know they are only a few pence each but they can be a real pain when they leak
 
Thanks for the input guys; all good. From the responses it seems that I should attempt to level off the top of the float bowl with sandpaper; and if necessary try two gaskets instead of one - I did buy two so that is not a problem.

LAB - thanks for the photo; I am confident that the gasket that I have is a genuine Amal; it came in that Amal packaging; and made from the Amal stamped cardboard. I purchased it from http://www.britishmotorcycleparts.co.nz. John - is that the site that you were looking at? If not are there other Auckland based parts suppliers you could advise me of?

Where could I buy Wassell gaskets from? Their website suggests that they do not deal direct with the public. Interestingly I've just looked at their page http://www.totalbikebits.com/new-products. Although I am confident that my carbs are Amals - I still have the Amal brochure that came with them - the gasket on the Wassell copy of the Amal 900 carb appears to be the same as were originally on my carbs; so I wonder if mine have Wassell gaskets - which would be a bit odd - unless my engine builder took the trouble to replace standard Amal gaskets with Wassell gaskets - or unless the Amal gaskets at the time were different to now.
 
Hi Chris,
some suppliers will substitute wassall or other knock off's for "original" unless the buyer insists otherwise, so the previous owner may just have worked with what he was given.
I bought a selection of main jets a while back from an NZ reseller and received a mixture of amal and wassall ones.
I usually order direct from Amal these days, their turn around is normally pretty quick.
iain
 
I purchased it from http://www.britishmotorcycleparts.co.nz. John - is that the site that you were looking at?

Yes - that's the one.

I generally buy from British spares in Nelson but they are not as easy they used to be when they were located in Wellington and John Saywell worked there. Still they should only take a day to get things to you.
 
Thicker float chamber gaskets may have caused the problem as they encourage over tightening of the screws and have more material to compress. If the surface of the float chamber is flat the Amal gasket seals perfectly well and will be made to the correct thickness intended in the original design of the carb.
 
While you have the float bowls off it would be a good time to check the float levels. (There are previous posts on how to do this from DogT.) You can also see if the gasket could be holding down the float.

If a piece of your existing gasket came completely out from between the bowl and carb then it indicates to me that the bowl surface is really warped and needs sanding on a flat plate.

Russ
 
I'm with Danno !

"This is why I always say, "If it ain't broke, don't fix it" No leak before, replace gasket, leaks now. "

The bike ran fine before.

I don't see the argument for getting into float levels.

I tried to give a step by step way to solve the only issue identified. Not dig a deeper hole :roll:
 
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