6 volt or 12 volt

at the risk of sounding stupid.... The bike in question is the new to me 67 N/15,I've made my mind up to convert this machine to the "Thor spark" electronic ignition kit,they want to know if it's 6 or 12 volt... I've got to run a battery with this system so even if it's s 6 volt I could still
Go with the 12 v system ( more battery option) I'd just have to change all the bulbs ? Right or wrong ? Still
I would like to be able to find out....how or where would I look to find out 6 or 12 volt ?? Next question,comment...I think a good deal of the hard starting is related to this bike wet sumping,I mean in like a
week the oil tank is empty,the motor is full of oil,and I'm trying to spin this thing over with all
That oil to overcome.... ( once the oil is back in the tank it's much easier to start )...Am I thinking right here ? So a anti sump valve is in order...how do I determine the difference between the oil feed line and oil return line ?
I think that this bike...already being a "special"...hybrid, would be fun to play with...IE...alloy tank,nice seat...rear sets,all bolt on stuff,no permanent modifications,no cutting or welding
I wouldn't molest the machine by making. These changes,one thing I'm thinking about is a "cafe style" oil tank,so how would I go about sourcing a oil tank that would adapt to the matchless frame...maybe the
the triton boys could steer me proper,any how,that's it for me for now,I hope someone can be of some assistance here with my questions thanks
Jeff

I think 67's were 12 V, but to be sure look at your battery .... if it has six cell caps it is 12 V. If it is a zero maintenance battery with no cell caps, the voltage should be printed on the battery. If the bike does not have a battery, check your bulbs.

You are correct that if the bike is a 6V system, all you have to do is change all bulbs to 12V.

Re: wet sumping

Do not install an automatic anti sump valve .... that is an engine disaster waiting to happen. Use a manual ball or gas cock with an ignition interlock if you must. Best option is to send your oil pump and timing cover to AMR in Tucson AZ .... $79 plus two way shipping and no more wet sumping, or at worst very minimal, and no worries about forgetting to open the valve.

Re: oil tank

A want ad here on this Forum might find you one, or try Ebay.

Slick

texasSlick said:

I think 67's were 12 V,
Re: wet sumping
Do not install an automatic anti sump valve .... that is an engine disaster waiting to happen. Use a manual ball or gas cock with an ignition interlock if you must. Best option is to send your oil pump and timing cover to AMR in Tucson AZ .... $79 plus two way shipping and no more wet sumping, or at worst very minimal, and no worries about forgetting to open the valve.
Slick

Click to expand...

You will more than likely have 12 volt system in 1967.
Re; automatic anti sump valve- sadly I will have to agree with Slick, why :?:
There appears to be an awful lot of ignorance regarding the automatic anti sump valve units and the ones on the market may not be quite as good as the type fitted on the 350& 500 Velos which work really well as these were a factory fitment and not some aftermarket type.
If you really want to fit one , have you considered a Velo oil tank with a ball valve already fitted, these come with an paper oil filter inside the tank as standard, but be warned you NEED to PRIME the oil pipe between the valve and oil pump for it to work, & DON’T use anything but a clear plastic oil resistance pipe on this section so you can tell at a glance if the pipe has any air in it.

After an engine rebuild and reconditioned oil pump, my WD16H would dump it's oil in a few days. I fitted an anti-wetsumping valve that screws straight into the crank case so it's as near the pump as possible. I could also open the valve easily with my mouth. It's the best things I've done, but the good thing with the WD16H is it has an oil tell tail which lifts up with the pressure, so a quick glance and you can see oil's getting through. You can just see the valve on the top oil pipe in my picture.



I know it can't be done like that on a twin, but put it as near the pump as possible and it should be ok. Velo's had them in the oil tank as already mentioned, and that's as far from the pump as you can get. You can get a Velo type valve that fits straight into a Norton tank, I bought one for my Dommie, but decided against putting it on as it was so far away from the pump. You don't hear of any problems with Velo's though.

I don't think you're ready to convert a bike's ignition.

Don't do it Jeff!
Keep the magneto ignition. If its good, it will be super reliable and is totally independent of the rest of the electrical system, so very, very reliable.
If its not good, get it rebuilt. A good specialist will rebuild it to even better than new.
Converting to another system is not an 'upgrade' IMHO in this instance.

Fast Eddie said:

Don't do it Jeff!
Keep the magneto ignition. If its good, it will be super reliable and is totally independent of the rest of the electrical system, so very, very reliable.
If its not good, get it rebuilt. A good specialist will rebuild it to even better than new.
Converting to another system is not an 'upgrade' IMHO in this instance.

Click to expand...

Agree! Well said Fast Eddie. I did not know magnetos were still around in 1967. If you have one Jeff, do as Eddie says.


Slick

Horror said:

the WD16H is it has an oil tell tail which lifts up with the pressure, so a quick glance and you can see oil's getting through. You can just see the valve on the top oil pipe in my picture.

Click to expand...

I had a dommie with the oil gauge in the tank.
It was only when the engine started making funny noises that a glance at the oil gauge showed approx zero,
so good luck spotting that tell tale in time...
Nice 16H, BTW.

Resurfacing all the surfaces in the oil pump in the dommie reduced the flow through the oil pump while standing
down to taking weeks and weeks to wetsump, so your oil pump must have had some generous clearances ??

For zefer, if the oil pump is dismantled (an easy job), all the surfaces in the oil pump can be flatted down,
using wet-n-dry on a flat surface/ glass plate etc. This reduces the internal clearances back to where they should be,
and can CONSIDERABLY reduce the problem of wet sumping.
hth.

If an anti-wetsumping valve was to get stuck for some reason, it's going to do it when standing. So once the engine has started and you have oil pressure opening the ball bearing and compressing the spring in the valve it's not going to suddenly close. I can imagine if a bike is left for a long time with dirty old oil in, the valve could initially stick but once opened it will stay open.

I always recondition my oil pumps in an unknown engine. My 16H pump was lapped in but the oil was getting passed quickly as it probably was worn in the cog housing. With a single the oil then flows out of the hole in the crank case on the drive side, then over the floor. The valve has stopped all this and the oil stays in the tank. Much safer than an oil tap which is an accident waiting to happen, just like disc locks

I must agree about the anti sump valve,I've used them for years with a zero failure rate,if they are so dangerous then why do some well respected and knowledgeable norton people reccomend and sell them,my question is how are the oil lines plumbed ?..... Which is feed and which is return ? I will most likely go with NIgels advise and stay with the magneto.... At least until the wet sump issue is settled... One change at a time...right? However I still think if the technology is available to modernize the ignition.... And it's not a Permanent change... Why not, besides if these magnetos..... That are used with aircraft are so wonderful.... Why does a airplane have 2 ? Not much of a "confidence boost" I'm just fkn around,I know that folks have strong opinions about mags and
Everything for that matter and I certainly respect them All and do appreciate people taking the time to respond to my questions etc.... It's all part of the learning curve and one of the greatest attributes of this forum too.... Any body have any suggestions about the side stand issue ? Can I retro fit... Say a commando side stand to get the bike in a more upright and safer position ?
Jeff

The feed line is the outer one, having the big washer at the oil tank bottom. The return line is the inner one.

While you have the oil drained, and are cutting into the oil line, be sure to pull the screen out of the oil tank and clean it. Just undo the nut under the big washer to get the screen out.

Slick

Thanks Slick !! Any thoughts on a side stand that will get the bike in a more
Upright stance ?

zefer said:

Thanks Slick !! Any thoughts on a side stand that will get the bike in a more
Upright stance ?

Click to expand...

No. Try doing a search on this site. I think it was a topic for discussion at another time.

Slick

zefer said:

Thanks Slick !! Any thoughts on a side stand that will get the bike in a more
Upright stance ?

Click to expand...

Weld a suitable round/square metal tube to the stand’s foot :?: