MCN still love the Commando

Well what can I say, this is one of the best videos I have seen about Commando MCs and the best thing about it he rode it like they should be ridden, although not stock as how many are these days without some mods done, to survive for 50+ years and still look good and handle like they should, when I brought my New 74 850 Commando back in the 70s and all my mates where buying Honda 750 4s, they all put shit on me but hey I still own the 850 but not in Commando form but my mates of the time who brought the Honda 4s still try to rub it in but all I say to them, "well where are your Honda 4s" and yet mine still don't drop oil all over the place as they use to say to me about owning a Norton and being unreliable British crap, they soon get put in their place by saying those few words "where are your Honda 4s" and I use to run circles around them back in the days and looked better as well, but the best thing they sound so much better than a Honda 4 with that 360 swing crank.
Anyway I enjoyed that video and was well presented with some good points.

Ashley
 
The Commando can be a race winner, properly set up and ridden very few can keep up with one, with a few simple mods on the basically stock bike. I've seen my streetable bikes beat F -750 and Super Vintage bikes that had bigger engines, disc brakes and racing frames. And my bikes were very low tech and used easily sourced 1970s parts from junkyards. At the old original Laconia track and at NHIS , real old time racers and fans saw what a Commando could do. They thought the bikes just show ponies but the Commandos showed them what they were made of. To see Jerry Wood, Greg Nichols and Yvon Duhamel and all the others ride my Commandos was like watching a Willy Shoemaker ride a stallion like Man O' War. My bike ridden by Jerry Wood even took an FIM #1 plate by beating a 1000cc Guzzi with dual disc brakes in Heavy weight Super Vintage. Great racers gravitate to great bikes and can-do great things on them!
 
I rode a CB750 when they first came to Australia, If I had never ridden a motorcycle they might have been OK. It felt like riding a brick. All of my Triumphs had race cams and handled better than the CB750. My best Triumph was actually a Tribsa 650. The BSA Gold Flash was a useless motorcycle, but my Tribsa had the fork yokes from a 1963 Bonneville with the BSA frame. My first race bike was a Triton - it did not handle as well as the Tribsa 650. But the CB750 was disgusting.
I don't think Norton sold many Atlas 750s. My mate had a Manxman - it was excellent.
 
There is a thing which many people do not seem to know about road racing - if a race circuit is half corners and half straights - when your bike is 15 MPH quicker in corners - to stay ahead of you, the others have to be 15 MPH quicker down the straights - but quicker in the corners gives a head-start down the straights. I used to race my 1958 Triton 500 against Z900 and H2 Kawasakis and still stay near them. Most of my racing was between 1969 and 1975. On a really big circuit, it becomes a different game. But my horror was about coming into corners too fast behind other bikes. With my bike, I could not back-off in corners.
 
acotrel said:
There is a thing which many people do not seem to know about road racing - if a race circuit is half corners and half straights - when your bike is 15 MPH quicker in corners - to stay ahead of you, the others have to be 15 MPH quicker down the straights - but quicker in the corners gives a head-start down the straights. I used to race my 1958 Triton 500 against Z900 and H2 Kawasakis and still stay near them. Most of my racing was between 1969 and 1975. On a really big circuit, it becomes a different game. But my horror was about coming into corners too fast behind other bikes. With my bike, I could not back-off in corners.
Click to expand...
This is about a ROAD bike - not about racing (again!!)
 
acotrel said:
I rode a CB750 when they first came to Australia, If I had never ridden a motorcycle they might have been OK. It felt like riding a brick. All of my Triumphs had race cams and handled better than the CB750. My best Triumph was actually a Tribsa 650. The BSA Gold Flash was a useless motorcycle, but my Tribsa had the fork yokes from a 1963 Bonneville with the BSA frame. My first race bike was a Triton - it did not handle as well as the Tribsa 650. But the CB750 was disgusting.
I don't think Norton sold many Atlas 750s. My mate had a Manxman - it was excellent.
Click to expand...
Al, the thing is, the CB750 is different and needs to be learnt. It will impress as you explore it more. That said, I've no idea how good the original shocks were on the Honda vs. the Commando.

I watched this video earlier this evening. I enjoyed it until it started on the old cliches, trying to compare with the Japanese CB750. Owning both bikes and very much enjoying both, I think it's just lazy journo myth.

My Commando's rear shocks had lost their damping. So I'm unable to compare handling straight out of the box. My Commando's rear was bouncing and wallowing, not handling at all well. New Hagons and a fork flush, now all's well. My CB750K6 was a poor handling bike when it came to me. I expected it, as that's what was said at the time. However, fore-armed with my Commando experience, I gave it a try and gave it a fork flush and put Hagon shocks on it. It now handles as well as my Commando at anything over 30mph. Below that it feels a bit more top heavy. Above that and I can flick it about, not like an R1, but in relative terms, it's nice.

Initially I thought the Norton was faster, but the Honda needed a thorough going over. Now it would be difficult to say, the Honda's delivery is a creamy, but throaty smoothness, which deceives. It's pretty quick. The Norton is a cruder let rip. Both feel 'vintage', but the Norton gives away its more ancient origins.

Which do I prefer? I actually find the Commando more relaxing, with its torquey vibe. I love it for extracting the most it reliably can from what was old tech, even then. For an adrenalin blast, the Honda above 7,000 revs is a hoot. It represents the state of roadgoing motorcycle tech at the time. I like that too.

Neither have the power, nor handling of my 20 year old Bandit 650 (Hagon monoshock!), but both are more interesting to ride. Both are beautiful. The Honda has the edge on looks for me, but that's a really personal thing and 'in the eye of the beholder' etc.

I love both bikes and wouldn't part with either. They both represent an important stage in M/C history. They are definitely different, but having lived with both, one is clearly not better than the other, in my humble experience.
 
Café au Lait said:
Click to expand...

The video seems a little biased to me. Maybe I am, only have owned Triumphs, Nortons and Harleys. I've loved my Norton for 46 years. Still have it. Blew the doors off of several 750 Hondas, 1100 cc Harleys and such. When I bought my 1996 Harley FXSTC, it was only to haul my GF on the back. 80 foot pounds of torque 80 HP. After riding "Bitch" for a couple of years, She said "Hey Johnny, if I get my license, can I ride the Norton"? I said certainly. We rode together many times. She always said " I'll beat the Sh@t out of that Harley in a race. Meaning Drag. That never happened, but I was always proud of her holding her own with kick starting and all that shite.
 
Yep - but Mr Honda got it very wrong with the CB750.
People joke about the maintenance-requiring flaws of the Commando but it's nothing compared to the CB750's major cock-up.
"let's put the hyvo chain in the middle - you know, between cylinders 2 and 3!"
Changing the Commando's primary chain is an absolute breeze compared to the Honda's primary!
There, you have to pull head & barrel off, then split the crankcases to pull the crankshaft out. I'm not sure if 2 conrods have to be removed to get the chain off the crankshaft, but I suspect so.
It's why you heard so many of them idling with a "chunk-chunka-chunka" as the worn chain snapped tight then loose. Better that than the humungous job to change it.
Kawasaki fixed that with gear-drive to the clutch - which all the other Jappa's then copied in succession - including Honda with the CB750F.
 
robs ss said:
Yep - but Mr Honda got it very wrong with the CB750.
People joke about the maintenance-requiring flaws of the Commando but it's nothing compared to the CB750's major cock-up.
"let's put the hyvo chain in the middle - you know, between cylinders 2 and 3!"
Changing the Commando's primary chain is an absolute breeze compared to the Honda's primary!
There, you have to pull head & barrel off, then split the crankcases to pull the crankshaft out. I'm not sure if 2 conrods have to be removed to get the chain off the crankshaft, but I suspect so.
It's why you heard so many of them idling with a "chunk-chunka-chunka" as the worn chain snapped tight then loose. Better that than the humungous job to change it.
Kawasaki fixed that with gear-drive to the clutch - which all the other Jappa's then copied in succession - including Honda with the CB750F.
Click to expand...
Maybe so, but the brits did that before Honda I believe with the Scott.
 
Come on, both bikes have their maintenance foibles. My CB750 has 45,000 miles on it and the primary chain(s) is original and still in spec on its automatic tensioner. Same for the cam chain.

It took me 5 minutes to change the Honda main drive sprocket. How does that compare ;)
No isolastics to renew, it doesn't vibrate. Undo and slide out the one piece axle and the rear wheel rolls out on the centre stand. The tank is 1 minute to remove: unlock seat and hinge up (stays up); ease clip off single fuel tap and pull off the fuel pipe; roll rubber retainer off rear of tank; slide tank off. Also, the horn is easy reach :p. A great disappointment though, only one oil (serving engine, gearbox and primary / clutch together) to argue about!

But, it has 4 carbs to clean and balance! Although, in fact that's not that tricky, access is easy and the gantry is nicely made and it slots together nice. And the carbs aren't Amals!

I've had the engine out for my restoration. A previous owner had taken off the cylinder head cover with a chisel and irreparably damaged the gasket surfaces. It leaked badly. It was a simple step by step exercise (using the very clear Honda workshop manual) to remove the engine and replace the head and cover (the bores were measured and honed by a local firm and I put new rings in, whilst I was there). I also stripped everything down for the frame etc. to be blasted and powder coated. Parts availability is fine. Ease of process must be good, for me to be able to do it. My rubber band push rod holders remained in the Commando drawer :). Everything went back together like a jigsaw puzzle, even the 4 exhausts, which I was dreading. I did find my mechanical cam chain tensioner was seized. Emery cloth and Autosol on the plunger sorted it.

Tickover is even and free of chain slap above 1250rpm. So, that's where I set it. I change the oil 500 miles earlier than the Commando, but otherwise it's as easy to keep on top of as the Norton and just as nice to work on. Haven't found a Whitworth thread yet. I was tempted to put one on a bracket somewhere, to confuse a future owner. :) 👍
 

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robs ss said:
This is about a ROAD bike - not about racing (again!!)
Click to expand...
But, A Commando was considered a race bike to many. The early Norton Factory ads for the 1968 Commando featured racers like Art Ninci and George Kerker road racing them with great success in AMA class racing and they and MC magazines pushed the 1/4 mile and braking abilities of the Commando. Many feel it is the First Superbike. I got into Commandos because of a friend's 1968 beating all comers in street racing, and my used 1970 S went to the 1/4 mile drag strips and was holding it's own against others in the mid1970s. A street bike that can race really earned the name Commando. The bike that stormed into the enemy camps, and took no prisoners. TC really inspired many and proved his Nortons could take on anyone in Top Fuel with his blistering times. For me a Commando is all about racing and winning over new friends and fans and showing how great a street bike can be. I know my bikes and racers impressed the old time racing greats and fans at the old Laconia track for the several years we got to race there.
 
Last edited:
Carl H said:
The Commando can be a race winner, properly set up and ridden very few can keep up with one, with a few simple mods on the basically stock bike. I've seen my streetable bikes beat F -750 and Super Vintage bikes that had bigger engines, disc brakes and racing frames. And my bikes were very low tech and used easily sourced 1970s parts from junkyards. At the old original Laconia track and at NHIS , real old time racers and fans saw what a Commando could do. They thought the bikes just show ponies but the Commandos showed them what they were made of. To see Jerry Wood, Greg Nichols and Yvon Duhamel and all the others ride my Commandos was like watching a Willy Shoemaker ride a stallion like Man O' War. My bike ridden by Jerry Wood even took an FIM #1 plate by beating a 1000cc Guzzi with dual disc brakes in Heavy weight Super Vintage. Great racers gravitate to great bikes and can-do great things on them!
Click to expand...

American Honda had the ad campaign in place before the CB750 came.
It was well promoted.
It is my opinion they outspent the rest of the bike world on advertising.
And yes, they were reliable.
 
Mart UK said:
Come on, both bikes have their maintenance foibles. My CB750 has 45,000 miles on it and the primary chain(s) is original and still in spec on its automatic tensioner. Same for the cam chain.

It took me 5 minutes to change the Honda main drive sprocket. How does that compare ;)
No isolastics to renew, it doesn't vibrate. Undo and slide out the one piece axle and the rear wheel rolls out on the centre stand. The tank is 1 minute to remove: unlock seat and hinge up (stays up); ease clip off single fuel tap and pull off the fuel pipe; roll rubber retainer off rear of tank; slide tank off. Also, the horn is easy reach :p. A great disappointment though, only one oil (serving engine, gearbox and primary / clutch together) to argue about!

But, it has 4 carbs to clean and balance! Although, in fact that's not that tricky, access is easy and the gantry is nicely made and it slots together nice. And the carbs aren't Amals!

I've had the engine out for my restoration. A previous owner had taken off the cylinder head cover with a chisel and irreparably damaged the gasket surfaces. It leaked badly. It was a simple step by step exercise (using the very clear Honda workshop manual) to remove the engine and replace the head and cover (the bores were measured and honed by a local firm and I put new rings in, whilst I was there). I also stripped everything down for the frame etc. to be blasted and powder coated. Parts availability is fine. Ease of process must be good, for me to be able to do it. My rubber band push rod holders remained in the Commando drawer :). Everything went back together like a jigsaw puzzle, even the 4 exhausts, which I was dreading. I did find my mechanical cam chain tensioner was seized. Emery cloth and Autosol on the plunger sorted it.

Tickover is even and free of chain slap above 1250rpm. So, that's where I set it. I change the oil 500 miles earlier than the Commando, but otherwise it's as easy to keep on top of as the Norton and just as nice to work on. Haven't found a Whitworth thread yet. I was tempted to put one on a bracket somewhere, to confuse a future owner. :) 👍
Click to expand...
What I have found in general working on Japanese bikes is they are built like a watch
They come apart like a watch and go back together like a watch
I've not often needed a special tool or had to force one apart or back together
I replaced the primary chain on my fj1200 just because I couldn't stand the jangling and snatching but it did have an extremely high mileage
It was a dead easy job to strip the engine and wrap the chain around the crank
 
baz said:
What I have found in general working on Japanese bikes is they are built like a watch
They come apart like a watch and go back together like a watch
I've not often needed a special tool or had to force one apart or back together
I replaced the primary chain on my fj1200 just because I couldn't stand the jangling and snatching but it did have an extremely high mileage
It was a dead easy job to strip the engine and wrap the chain around the crank
Click to expand...
I did my very modified XS1100 primary drive chain after 36,000 miles of merciless beating.
Split the cases.
 


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