Superbike 7, March 1970 Cycle Magazine performance test

[gortnipper]

I have bought/ridden most years of Z1, kZ900, KZ1000, Honda 750 fours and mid 80s VF750.

I owned early and mid eighties variants of the 750F and VF750 long term. Bother of these were faster than the, Commando, as you would expect. The VF750 handled well, but suffered from a poor cam chain tensioner design.

The early/mid 70s was not the same and a good Commando is far superior in most regards.

Also included in the bought /ridden list are most of the common 550-1100cc Japanese bikes from early 70s to mid 80s. Many of these bikes had very low miles, most ~10k range and would qualify as garage queens. I liked the GPz.

I still have my Commando.

 

[olympus]

A local dealer (mostly Jap & modern European) had always lusted after a 750/4 and he finally got hold of a fully restored one a few years ago.
He was honest enough to admit it was utter cr@p.
Norton's West Coast Rep Brian Slark freely admitted one Road Test Commando was very far from 'out of the crate' - the head was ported by a famous tuning shop, and alloy valve collars were fitted - I don't recall the details.
Some articles from back in the day showed that the journalists were quite rigorous in establishing how standard these 'Standard' bikes were, to their credit.
Norman White's 'unbelievable' standing quarter times on a Combat were challenged by the US magazines, and he was sent out to the US to prove the numbers; story below...

Love the gear lever mod..

 

[johnm]

In NZ in the 70s we had the Castrol Six Hour Crosby and the Z1.

Graeme Crosby – KawasakiZ1.com

kawasakiz1.com

No Commando was going to get a lookin.

Plus the bike gang lowlifes stole every Brit bike they could find. Including mine but fortunately the cops found it before they broke it up.

 

[Alan L]

Hi,
Obviously Triumph Bonneville didn’t get a gong to compete in the Superbike Shootout.
would it have been too far behind the pace? I would have thought it would have been up there.
If I recall a Bonneville won in inaugural Castrol 6 hour race at Amaroo Park in Australia in 1970 (or there abouts).
I always found my wife’s 78 T140V to be a match for a 750/4, what it lacked in acceleration it made up for with nimble handling. It was fitted with discs of course and therefore had excellent braking for it’s time.
I know this is a Norton forum but we’re kind of all in this together.

If the test was carried out in 1972 how would a well sorted combat have faired, providing the engine hung together?
regards
Al

 

[Richard Tool]

If the test was carried out in 1972 how would a well sorted combat have faired, providing the engine hung together?
regards
Al

Obviously it would have won everything since it is the greatest motorcycle ever … just sayin’ … wink wink
( what was it I posted earlier about bias ? )

 

[concours]

now how is it possible to deliver a bike to a road test, the results of which the entire future of Norton could hinge on, with a blocked fuel tap. In fact I’m surprised that the tester wasnt performed with both taps open to ensure sufficient fuel supply?
It’s surprising on how many tests on British bikes the bike was found to have some really basic faults that affected the results.
Anyway, it was a great performance by the Norton. It’s hard to understand why the R3 was a little slower than the T150.
so many ‘if onlys’ when dealing with that period of the British bike industry.
When I bought my Trident as an 18 year old in 1978 pommie bikes were all gone amongst us young kids, just a distant memory . I spent most of my youth proving to mates that old pommie iron was still a force to contend with
such a shame. Reading reviews like this one does my heart good
al

Perhaps some ill-willed little doofuss tossed an (unlit) cigarette in the tank "by accident", which did it's job well.
Begs the question.

 

[Alan L]

Obviously it would have won everything since it is the greatest motorcycle ever … just sayin’ … wink wink
( what was it I posted earlier about bias ? )

Yes Richard, I take your point.
but it is interesting just how well Norton performed in the test with an old, albeit well sorted design. In fact, so well, that I’m surprised that the Triumph and BSAs triples don’t do quite as well, which leaves one wondering why Hele etc didn’t extract extra HP from their ‘semi’ new design, just to be noticeably ahead of there local opposition.
As a serious question, surely a Bonnie rider in the late 60s, early 70s wouldnt have felt outclassed (or should I say out performed) by a Norton?

As an aside, it’s amazing what I don’t know about the screaming Japanese two strokes. By the time I became ‘bike cognisant’, say 1976 they had mostly had their day. Yes, we were aware of these wailing banshees that went like stink and were reputed to be hinged in the middle but they weren’t really on our radar. Other than my rather unusual interest in pommie bikes (and cars) it was the Z900 or 1000 and perhaps the 860 Ducatis that filled our world.
Alan

 

[MichaelB]

1973 SUPERBIKES pg1

Can't tell which 750 is in this test. Combat 750 or detuned 750.

 

[Alan L]

Perhaps some ill-willed little doofuss tossed an (unlit) cigarette in the tank "by accident", which did it's job well.
Begs the question.

Seriously, yes a distinct possibility. It was all very high stakes for all involved. I suspect it was very cutthroat with everyone cheating as much as they thought they could get away with.
I recall Stirling Moss’s Triumph Dolomite Sprint being sabotaged at the Bathurst 1000 (or was it 500 then) with gunk in the oil.
al

 

[worntorn]

Hi,
Obviously Triumph Bonneville didn’t get a gong to compete in the Superbike Shootout.
would it have been too far behind the pace? I would have thought it would have been up there.
If I recall a Bonneville won in inaugural Castrol 6 hour race at Amaroo Park in Australia in 1970 (or there abouts).
I always found my wife’s 78 T140V to be a match for a 750/4, what it lacked in acceleration it made up for with nimble handling. It was fitted with discs of course and therefore had excellent braking for it’s time.
I know this is a Norton forum but we’re kind of all in this together.

If the test was carried out in 1972 how would a well sorted combat have faired, providing the engine hung together?
regards
Al

My son-in-law's Dad had a 68 Bonnie and was King of the Hill in town until the first 750 Commando arrived.
He told me that the Commando left no doubt about which bike was quicker.

Glen

 

[B+Bogus]

If the test was carried out in 1972 how would a well sorted combat have faired, providing the engine hung together?
regards
Al

IF you'd read the article in my earlier post you'd see that Norman White Posted a 12.21s Quarter Mile on an 'out of the crate' Combat - following criticism from the US journalists that the Norton Factory's claimed 12.6s wasn't achievable.
It's on the second page...

 

[worntorn]

Perhaps some ill-willed little doofuss tossed an (unlit) cigarette in the tank "by accident", which did it's job well.
Begs the question.

I'm Hardly Able to imagine which group of Cheaters might have done such a thing!

Glen

 

[B+Bogus]

Yes Richard, I take your point.
but it is interesting just how well Norton performed in the test with an old, albeit well sorted design. In fact, so well, that I’m surprised that the Triumph and BSAs triples don’t do quite as well, which leaves one wondering why Hele etc didn’t extract extra HP from their ‘semi’ new design, just to be noticeably ahead of there local opposition.
As a serious question, surely a Bonnie rider in the late 60s, early 70s wouldnt have felt outclassed (or should I say out performed) by a Norton?

Need to bear in mind the Bonneville was still only a 650.
From personal experience a 750 Commando is certainly the faster of the two, and more importantly (to me, at least) does it without feeling like it's having the @rse thrashed off it.
Just wish the Norton had a Triumph gearbox...

 

[MexicoMike]

I had the first Kawi triple two stroke - the Mach III 500 CC. It was my third moto (Kawasaki 125, Honda 350 Scrambler, then the Mach III). Truly went like stink and although I later realized it had terrible handling, at the time, I didn't notice it at all. It was a serious power "upgrade' from my Honda 350 scrambler and I tried to take every turn with the footpegs dragging. Hey, we were all young once and bulletproof!

 

[concours]

Yes Richard, I take your point.
but it is interesting just how well Norton performed in the test with an old, albeit well sorted design. In fact, so well, that I’m surprised that the Triumph and BSAs triples don’t do quite as well, which leaves one wondering why Hele etc didn’t extract extra HP from their ‘semi’ new design, just to be noticeably ahead of there local opposition.
As a serious question, surely a Bonnie rider in the late 60s, early 70s wouldnt have felt outclassed (or should I say out performed) by a Norton?

As an aside, it’s amazing what I don’t know about the screaming Japanese two strokes. By the time I became ‘bike cognisant’, say 1976 they had mostly had their day. Yes, we were aware of these wailing banshees that went like stink and were reputed to be hinged in the middle but they weren’t really on our radar. Other than my rather unusual interest in pommie bikes (and cars) it was the Z900 or 1000 and perhaps the 860 Ducatis that filled our world.
Alan

"WIN on Sunday, SELL on Monday" "Giant Killer" The RD350 was as cheap as chips, went like hell, and responded VERY WELL to some expansion chambers and jetting.
I am a bit biased though...

Great Bikes of the 1970s: Yamaha RD350

Before we had any clue about the myriad dangers of triple cheeseburgers, saturated fat, unburned hydrocarbons and street-going two-strokes, there was the RD350.

www.motorcyclistonline.com

 

[Alan L]

RD 350?
Yes, they were a smaller bike that had our total respect.
Remember we were 18 and self confessed experts on absolutely everything, particularly anything to do with bikes.
Reality check: in reality what we knew could have been written on the back of a postage stamp but we were young unbreakable and full of fun (or was that ‘young, dumb and full of cum)
Little has changed other than now I’m old, already broken and boring.
al

 

[Alan L]

IF you'd read the article in my earlier post you'd see that Norman White Posted a 12.21s Quarter Mile on an 'out of the crate' Combat - following criticism from the US journalists that the Norton Factory's claimed 12.6s wasn't achievable.
It's on the second page...

Just read it, stunning!

 

[gortnipper]

"WIN on Sunday, SELL on Monday" "Giant Killer" The RD350 was as cheap as chips, went like hell, and responded VERY WELL to some expansion chambers and jetting.
I am a bit biased though...

Great Bikes of the 1970s: Yamaha RD350

Before we had any clue about the myriad dangers of triple cheeseburgers, saturated fat, unburned hydrocarbons and street-going two-strokes, there was the RD350.

www.motorcyclistonline.com

View attachment 94302View attachment 94303

Loved those bikes. Went like stink and so light.

 

[MexicoMike]

Had an impromptu drag race with an RD 350/my '71 Commando back in the day. We were both getting gas and one thing led to another and off we went to the nearest local "drag road." He wasn't familiar with "Norton." Wasn't much of a race - Commando by many bike lengths and when we were on the side of the road talking afterward, he told me the Norton looked small and he thought it was a 350 or 400 twin. He was shocked to hear it was a 750.

 

[B+Bogus]

The first 'proper' bike I rode was an RD 350B - totally exhilarating!
I later had a 350LC which was even more fun - just 'want to wheelie? oh, go on, then!'