tire tube nut(s)

Douglass Harroun · Oct 1, 2016

The tube is supplied with two nuts- do I use both, one on each side of rim, or locked against each other on outside?
Thanks
Doug

L.A.B. · Oct 1, 2016

Douglass Harroun said:
The tube is supplied with two nuts- do I use both, one on each side of rim or locked against each other on outside?

One inside one outside is what would I do, especially if there's a washer: https://www.accessnorton.com/NortonCommando/fitting-inner-tube.20175/

concours · Oct 1, 2016

one inside, one outside.

Danno · Oct 1, 2016

The valve stem is threaded all the way down. One nut goes on the inside to keep the second nut on the outside from pulling the stem up too far against the inside of the rim and possibly damaging the tube.

pete.v · Oct 1, 2016

The nut on the inside secures the valve to the tube, the other secures the stem from the outside to the rim by jamming against the inside nut.
Just to be clear, the inside tube nut needs to be secured to the valve stem system and is not there simply to secure the tube to the rim. That is its secondary purpose.

acotrel · Oct 1, 2016

I'd keep the nut which secures the valve to the tube. Drill the hole in the rim for the valve bigger, then fit an aluminium rim lock elsewhere and rebalance the wheel. If you bolt the tube to the rim and the tyre creeps and pulls the tube, you can get an air-leak at the valve where it fits into the tube. Particularly if your bike has loads of torque.

Triton Thrasher · Oct 2, 2016

Both outside, locked together, halfway between the rim and the dust cap.

Matchless · Oct 2, 2016

Years ago when tyres were run at lower pressures, the factory test riders used to use one nut & leave it loose. If the valve started to cock over at an angle they could see if they had any tyre creep. If the valve nut was tightened this wouldn't show until the tube ripped. With todays higher pressures this may no longer apply, but proves that the nut doesn't need to be tight.

Martyn.

Triton Thrasher · Oct 2, 2016

Matchless said:
Years ago when tyres were run at lower pressures, the factory test riders used to use one nut & leave it loose. If the valve started to cock over at an angle they could see if they had any tyre creep. If the valve nut was tightened this wouldn't show until the tube ripped. With todays higher pressures this may no longer apply, but proves that the nut doesn't need to be tight.

Martyn.

Low pressure in tyres has not been eliminated!

Danno · Oct 2, 2016

Matchless said:
Years ago when tyres were run at lower pressures, the factory test riders used to use one nut & leave it loose. If the valve started to cock over at an angle they could see if they had any tyre creep. If the valve nut was tightened this wouldn't show until the tube ripped. With todays higher pressures this may no longer apply, but proves that the nut doesn't need to be tight.

Martyn.

,

If you don't tighten the outer nut against the rim, the tube can spin, ripping it to shreds and ruining the tire from the inside in the process. I have seen this happen. There's a reason these nuts went from a knurled wheel to an actual hex nut.

cjandme · Oct 2, 2016

I think that it would be good to mention Baby powder here. My Pops taught me to use talc on the inner tube, he said that the tire will "walk" on the rim and if the tube is stuck to the tire then you begin to get problems. Also---(and I cut and pasted this part from the web)--- if an inner tube isn’t installed properly, it can fail. Using talcum powder on the inner tube during installation will reduce friction between the inner tube and the tire’s carcass to help the tube last longer. Adding a little air to shape the inner tube before mounting the tire can help prevent pinches during tire installation.

Triton Thrasher · Oct 2, 2016

Danno said:
If you don't tighten the outer nut against the rim, the tube can spin, ripping it to shreds and ruining the tire from the inside in the process. I have seen this happen. There's a reason these nuts went from a knurled wheel to an actual hex nut.

The valve can't hold the tube in place, if the tyre spins or creeps.

Danno · Oct 2, 2016

Triton Thrasher said:
Danno said:

If you don't tighten the outer nut against the rim, the tube can spin, ripping it to shreds and ruining the tire from the inside in the process. I have seen this happen. There's a reason these nuts went from a knurled wheel to an actual hex nut.

Click to expand...

The valve can't hold the tube in place, if the tyre spins or creeps.

Then what's your theory for why the stem nuts even exist?

Triton Thrasher · Oct 2, 2016

Danno said:
Triton Thrasher said:

Danno said:

If you don't tighten the outer nut against the rim, the tube can spin, ripping it to shreds and ruining the tire from the inside in the process. I have seen this happen. There's a reason these nuts went from a knurled wheel to an actual hex nut.

Click to expand...

The valve can't hold the tube in place, if the tyre spins or creeps.

Click to expand...

Then what's your theory for why the stem nuts even exist?

My theories aren't worth much, though at least they're not wrong. You can phone Michelin and they may tell you.

Anyway, seeing as you asked me, a nut is handy when you're fitting a tube. It stops the valve disappearing into the tyre before you get it inflated.

Triton Thrasher · Oct 2, 2016

This is attributed to an email from Michelin, on an Ariel forum:

The conical washer sits over the inner tube valve stem and should follow the contour of the valve so that the convex side sits against the wheel rim when fitting.

Once fitted to the wheel the two lock nuts sit on the valve cap side of the wheel rim. After fitment and inflation to the correct pressure, the two nuts should be backed up towards the valve cap, and locked against each other.

This is not usually an issue on correctly inflated road going tyres, but should there be any slippage of tyre on the rim, during heavy braking or acceleration for example, the inner tube could be pulled around slightly with the tyre and if the inner tube is bolted to the rim the valve can be ripped out. If the lock nuts are raised towards the valve cap then inner tube has some leeway to move before this happens. Any movement is thus obvious as the valve stem will no longer be straight and pointing at the centre of the hub, but will be pulled round at an angle.

http://forum.arielownersmcc.co.uk/viewtopic.php?t=3880&start=10#p25405

Matchless · Oct 2, 2016

Looks like those factory testers really did know their stuff!!

gripper · Oct 2, 2016

I used to always leave the nuts loose and rely on the security bolt to stop creep. The MOT tester would always tighten the nut up and comment on it.

Triton Thrasher · Oct 2, 2016

gripper said:
I used to always leave the nuts loose and rely on the security bolt to stop creep. The MOT tester would always tighten the nut up and comment on it.

Did he think the tyre would fall off?

I've had same comment. I said I like it like that.

acotrel · Oct 2, 2016

The only time it probably matters if the tube is bolted to the rim, is when you drop the pressure to cope with riding in the wet - half wet, half dry is the problem. When I first raced the Seeley, it immediately pulled the valve out of the rear tyre.

gripper · Oct 2, 2016

I saw a novel way to stop tyre creep on a motocrosser many years ago. 8 or 10 self tapping screws through the edge of the rim into the tyre bead. Probably standard practice in the scrambler world in those days.

tire tube nut(s)

Douglass Harroun

L.A.B.

Moderator

concours

Danno

pete.v

acotrel

Triton Thrasher

Matchless

Triton Thrasher

Danno

cjandme

Triton Thrasher

Danno

Triton Thrasher

Triton Thrasher

Matchless

gripper

Triton Thrasher

acotrel

gripper

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