Swing Arm leaks

But how genuine is genuine?

The original factory fitted swinging arm spindles were not chrome plated. The 750 & early 850 weren't at least, I don't know about MK 3 ones but doubt that they were chromed.

There are also so called 'genuine' pea shooter silencers on that page which are seamless. The factory fitted originals did have seams, so how genuine can those be described?

More important is the difference between good (safe) parts that fit & poor (potentially dangerous) ill fitting parts. I'm sure that Andover Norton's parts are the former but the 'genuine' description maybe open to interpretation.

Ian

Nortoniggy said:

I don't know about MK 3 ones but doubt that they were chromed.

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I have one Mk3 spindle which isn't chromed, but I also have two which are (or at least appear to be) chromed, all are rather old stock, but I have no idea if they are genuine parts, and I've never disturbed my Mk3's 'sealed for life' pivot assembly-so I can't comment about the one that's fitted?

comnoz said:

Use this. It works fantastic. And don't leak. Jim

http://www.jewellamberoil.com/

It is oil not grease and is perfectly compatible with sintered bushings.

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If you didn't look at this, you should!

ok here's my tale of how I decided to go with real cheap grease via real grease zerks. I put specialist built Al cradle in Peel with re newed bushes in a true 850 braced swing arm and filled my foot long 1/2" OD clear tube reservoir feeding through the hollar top fill bolt. I filled it with A NON-FLUID OIL given me by hi end engine shop whose owner chewed my head off when I called it grease, "NO SIR I was loudly told No Grease in our new engines, this is oil that flows but only after heating up."" I put some on a knife blade and hung it up to see how viscous - to find it took 24 hr or so for a drop to from and drip leaving the knife still covered in layer that made STP pour like hot honey. I assembled Peel with the utmost care barely able to get swing arm on for the close and square fit, like shaft in almost interference bore, only correct alignment allows slipping in. Peel hung from rafters over the winter while other parts processed, IE: she had NO motion and temps were averaging freezing to further thicken the Non Liquid Oil. It still ALL drained out for a mess on frame and floor. On pissed off inspection I found begining of rust on spindle.

I re-used s-swing arm and spindle on factory Trixie, after zerks put in and removed it a while back easy and rust free with only a few pumps of grease done a year prior. Trixie had about 3000 miles by then. Peel got RGM swing arm, larger OD spindle and zerks, no mileage yet.

That is right, the amberoil will leak. Anything that will leak into a sintered bushing to re-charge it will also leak out. It just happens very slowly.
If you have enough clearance to pump grease through the bushing to provide impact protection then the bushing is too loose in my book. I much prefer to have a .0005 inch fit and lube with oil. That way the bushing lasts much better.

I tried the grease zerk idea once many years ago with disappointing results. The nice tight bushings and shaft were scored from lack of lube. I have used amberoil in a lot of bikes since and any seepage is so small it doesn't seem to make it to the floor. Of course correct o-rings and a small amount of silicone around the cover is a good idea. Jim

Nortoniggy said:

But how genuine is genuine?

There are also so called 'genuine' pea shooter silencers on that page which are seamless. The factory fitted originals did have seams, so how genuine can those be described?

Click to expand...

Sorry for slight diversion on the thread but that's just incorrect. My 72 combat and also my friend's 71 (both Roadsters) did not have seams. I'm talking about where the reverse end cones are attached. Had the bike since new. AFAIR the seams appeared in later 72 onwards.

Yes not much room for a grease layer. I blocked of spindle weep holes and spiral grooved the swing arm bushes before I had the swing arm-bushes drilled tapped for zerks, to give a full around path for the little grease in there. I give em a pump or two once a riding season. Seems like a sealed bearing would be good but don't care to look further into it anymore. Again I fear rust from sitting up dry more than riding dry later. About to get Trixie going again and will see how long a greaser lasts in use and 5 months cold season storeage.

BTW just pumping in grease in middle of spindle is not a good idea unless spindle vents provided and oil weep hole closed, I'd expect it to fail by rubbing bushes raw, so if that was the prior failed greaser report then don't count to go by in my type greaser mod. My mower deck swing arm works same design as Norton but its got grease zerks not an oil leak system. I'm not so concerned with rubbing friction as I am sealing out water and oxygen.

I used the 75/140 from NAPA. Probably once the grime builds up around the leak area that the leak will slow down somewhat. Speaking of chain oilers. I'll just fab a fitting :idea: into the spindle bolt head for the chain oiler pipe and never have to lube the swing arm ever again,,,,,,,,,,,,,!! Hmmm I might be on to something here, huh? :roll:
Or just use the amberoil............

Tim_S

Tim_S said:

I used the 75/140 from NAPA. Probably once the grime builds up around the leak area that the leak will slow down somewhat. Speaking of chain oilers. I'll just fab a fitting :idea: into the spindle bolt head for the chain oiler pipe and never have to lube the swing arm ever again,,,,,,,,,,,,,!! Hmmm I might be on to something here, huh? :roll:
Or just use the amberoil............

Tim_S

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Well on my fuelie bike I made a tee for two 1/2 inch and one 1/8 hose. I put it in the vent line from the top of the oil tank and put a K&N breather filter on the end. The 1/8 inch outlet on the tee points down and I attached a 1/8 hose and ran it to a tiny banjo fitting on the end cap of the swingarm spindle. That hose collects just enough oil to add a drop or two to the swingarm and keeps the felts wetted nicely. That was done before I discovered amberoil.

The rest of my bikes and the customer bikes I do get amberoil. Jim

batrider said:

Nortoniggy said:

But how genuine is genuine?

There are also so called 'genuine' pea shooter silencers on that page which are seamless. The factory fitted originals did have seams, so how genuine can those be described?

Click to expand...

Sorry for slight diversion on the thread but that's just incorrect. My 72 combat and also my friend's 71 (both Roadsters) did not have seams. I'm talking about where the reverse end cones are attached. Had the bike since new. AFAIR the seams appeared in later 72 onwards.

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We're probably both right. I bought mine new in 72 & it was an Interstate so had low level exhausts. I never liked the low level exhausts & they fell apart within a year or so & I replaced them with new 'genuine' downpipes & peashooters. These had seams. I was just highlighting the fact that genuine can mean different things & Andover Norton saying they must be seamless to be genuine isn't strictly true. The 'genuine' ones they sell now are seamless but I'm pretty sure they have sold them with seams in the past as 'genuine'.

Ian

Nortoniggy said:

batrider said:

Nortoniggy said:

But how genuine is genuine?

There are also so called 'genuine' pea shooter silencers on that page which are seamless. The factory fitted originals did have seams, so how genuine can those be described?

Click to expand...

Sorry for slight diversion on the thread but that's just incorrect. My 72 combat and also my friend's 71 (both Roadsters) did not have seams. I'm talking about where the reverse end cones are attached. Had the bike since new. AFAIR the seams appeared in later 72 onwards.

Click to expand...

We're probably both right. I bought mine new in 72 & it was an Interstate so had low level exhausts. I never liked the low level exhausts & they fell apart within a year or so & I replaced them with new 'genuine' downpipes & peashooters. These had seams. I was just highlighting the fact that genuine can mean different things & Andover Norton saying they must be seamless to be genuine isn't strictly true. The 'genuine' ones they sell now are seamless but I'm pretty sure they have sold them with seams in the past as 'genuine'.

Ian

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So in 1973 you bought replacement mufflers from, I assume, a dealer and because of the packaging (if you ever saw it) assumed that they were "genuine"? The chances of a dealer selling you aftermarket mufflers and charging you "genuine" prices is far too high.

Joe might chime in but when he talks about "genuine" I believe he refers to parts that are made to the same specification or better from original factory information.

So in 1973 you bought replacement mufflers from, I assume, a dealer and because of the packaging (if you ever saw it) assumed that they were "genuine"? The chances of a dealer selling you aftermarket mufflers and charging you "genuine" prices is far too high.

Joe might chime in but when he talks about "genuine" I believe he refers to parts that are made to the same specification or better from original factory information.

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You think I can remember what packaging they were in 38 years ago?

I have replaced them a couple of times since & always bought them from Les Emery (Fairspares/Norvil) who sells them as 'original'' &, I believe, gets them from Andover Norton. They have all had seams. I would be as interested to know if Andover Norton have sold them with seams. If they have never sold them with seams then one of the main UK suppliers is perhaps being a bit disingenuous.

For me the important thing is that they are good quality. The Andover Norton parts are just that. The 'genuine' tag is still open to interpretaion. Some say Commandos are not genuine Nortons because they weren't made at Bracebridge Street, which just shows how silly some of these arguments can get.

Ian

This is my solution, it would not be brit iron without marking its teritory.

Nortoniggy said:

I have replaced them a couple of times since & always bought them from Les Emery (Fairspares/Norvil) who sells them as 'original'' &, I believe, gets them from Andover Norton. They have all had seams. I would be as interested to know if Andover Norton have sold them with seams. If they have never sold them with seams then one of the main UK suppliers is perhaps being a bit disingenuous.

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Do not assume that anything from Les is as marked or packaged. :|