States' Rights? Trump to Ban California from Making Its Own Laws

I think maybe we have some Russian “bots” on this forum they seem to be programmed to dispute and shout down anything negative posted in reference to the current leader of the USA .... who happens to be the subject of ridicule , astonishment and laughter for most of the inhabitants of earth that can read and use their brain ..... Here in Canada we have a federal election campaign going on now , very entertaining seeing all the dirt the participants dig up on each other .... who cares ‘bout good gov. when shoveling shit works better,eh
 
jbruney said:
Yeah and ' Have Gun Will Travel' is on now.
Click to expand...
Have Gun is Shakesperean. Way ahead of it's time, but it dovetailed with all the other cowboy hero programs.

My father-in-law's army buddy Hal Needham got his big break being Richard Boone's stuntman. Boone liked him enough to give him other roles, some speaking, some not even credited (anytime there was a fistfight) and even a few feature characters.
 
o0norton0o said:
I had to quote this because it's a great example of how unhinged some people are. You forgot to add that "He steals candy from a laughing baby's mouth".

So, IF I liked Trump more than Obama, it would be because I "screw porn stars while my wife is pregnant"?? and I'm a racist?
Perhaps this sort of thinking illustrates how unhinged the anti-trumpers are. Do you think Dr. Ben Carson works for a racist president.

I like how he got in Hillary's space to make her uncomfortable. You think she should have committed assault? I suppose she could do it without getting arrested. She's admitted to other criminal acts and not been prosecuted. You know that? Right?

What proof are you talking about? that Corey Booker called him a racist? Corey Booker called Joe Biden a racist too.. Joe Biden, Obama's Vice president... Did you know that Obama has a racist

VP?... Where have you been?? lol
Click to expand...

I think Ben Carson may have been a wonderful brain surgeon, but like many very intelligent specialists, his brain filled up with doctor stuff and left no room for common sense. From my experience working in schools and universities, the higher degree, the emptier the head.

And I also think you should start your own threads instead of constantly trying to change the subject and defend your buddy Trump by bringing up crap nobody cares about. Go ahead, start an Obama sucks or Hilary's a bitch thread or whatever. Trump will still be a giant asshole and an embarrassment to democracy.
 
Actually Danno, my point isn't that Trump is such a "great guy". My point is that he is a "warts and all" guy who's persona isn't a facade to hide his agenda. He tells you what he thinks is right and wrong. I think a lot of his staff wish he would be more of a politician, to craft a more likable image. We all know that he doesn't do that.

Personally, I don't think most democratic policy positions are realistic. Everyone is a racist if they don't want open borders. Where I live the democrats voted in favor of handing out FREE needles to drug addicts and having safe shoot up zones. There's a lot more of this kind of insanity on the left, and I think there's a point where you look at common sense as a middle ground, and have to decide who's policies are closer to what makes common sense. Much of the time I think it's trump.

In regards to greenhouse gas regulation the Chinese have double our output and are going through their industrialization phase. I'm pretty sure the california issue is aimed at depicting Trump as a pollution criminal, not making a significant difference in CO2 emissions.

Do you know who reputedly has the house with the largest square footage in the state of Tennessee? Yeah, Mr Greenhouse Gas himself... telling everyone our energy consumption is killing the planet...

*I like that you call Trump, "my buddy" as if I had to like the guy to point out the consistent incongruities of the unrelenting media attacks on the guy. I've said many times,... All presidents have made, and will make, mistakes when we look back at their administration. I think we're at an age where the power of the media influence on people has grown so much that certain media outlets report in a way in an attempt to effect policy, or at the very least undermine the character of people who's policies they disagree with. The media has always been a force to bring light to the actions of powerful people, but I think they have become players in the game themselves now, rather than fair arbiters of events.

I'd like to add that I respect anyone who expresses their opinion on a subject, but I don't think posting a link to an anti-"anybody" article is respectable without some of the person's own comment on the subject. In essence, if you don't have an opinion of your own, then you defend no ground of your own. You just hold up someone else's opinion and if it attacks someone you don't like, then someone else has done the dirty work for you...

I could post every day here with a "fox news" link and not give any opinion at all... and someone else could post a link to the huffington post every day and do the same. That's not a forum discussion, it's posting propaganda.
 
Nice day here in the Coastal bend... Might have an occasional scattered shower or lying politician show up on the news attempting to sow even more discord.
 
I think everyone should try and see big picture and think for themselves not really into defending or pulling down anyone .... closed mindedness is not a likeable attribute .... having anybody try and defend the indefenseable while heroic ,gets lame and “bot like” in a hurry .... time for a break alteady ! ... plus I either have a dying battery (7yrs) or an issue in charge department.... great day for a ride as well , plus football and rugby on the TV....
 
No, we are the United "states" of america, so there is a division of authority based on each state and their state law and federal law. The most dramatic illustration of States rights was the american civil war where the southern states tried to secede from the USA, but there are plenty of differences in laws from one state to another and federal law too. Sometimes the federal government challenges the state laws, sometimes they decline to act. In a few states in the USA, Marijuana is legal for recreational use. In other states it's not legal. It's still federally illegal, yet the federal government hasn't acted against people using weed in those legal states.

The sanctuary city laws violate federal law. Non-cooperation with ICE is a violation of federal law which some state officials violate. There's a lot of friction, especially with california and the federal authority because of their ideological differences.
 
Fed law tops state law. I believe that was pretty much settled at gunpoint in 1865. Things were amended to remove a state's right to secede at that time also, so for better or worse it shall continue to be one big happy dysfunctional family..... up to & including gunpoint. We still do our fireworks every 4th of July, silently dreaming of cannon pointing N & S, and have a great time.
 
It’s about jobs in the auto industry. Jobs lost in other states because of California.

Big auto is shutting down/discontinuing entire model lines of cars. They’re converting to electric too. Among the reasons is this California problem.

There used to be Big Three auto making in this state. They got out long ago. Aerospace too has largely disappeared. Regulation has consequences

California’s two faced Democrats don’t care about union jobs lost in other states. They care little that their laws destroy jobs in coal or auto. They care more about posturing as environmental heroes.

This is more of Trump’s wedge, splitting blue collar folk away from their politicized union hall Democrat leadership.

It’s a paradigm shift, a tectonic crack in the political landscape. We see a similar phenomena in the Yellow Vests and Brexit
 
Well it's early in the morning and I'm drinking too much coffee again. Wanted to look at the site to find out about tuning my VM34. Just got a new ignition from Old Brits and the bike starts like years ago when I had a '66 with a mag. And I stumbled on this thread.... Before my current career I drove a tractor trailer -- an "owner operator". And we Hated driving into California! There were fuel stops just outside the state where you got the whole engine and transmission sprayed clean because if they found any -- ANY -- dripping oil you got nabbed for it. There you are rolling down a road made of asphalt, billions of tons of it thrown down BY THE STATE on the "sacred" earth, so revered by indigent surfers and sunbathers and the holier than thou english majors and they don't give a flip about that. But your two drips of oil sends them into a frenzy of hypocritical wrath. They are outraged! How dare you defile the purity of their sactimonious lives. All I've seen by the federal government in all this is an attempt to restore some normality to interstate and intrastate business dealings. States rights has a strong place in our federation. It's there to insure regional interests are not ignored, but not to the detriment of a cohesive smoothly functioning country. We fought a civil war over that issue once. California is beautiful and so important, but some of the people who live there are just full of it.
 
What happened to the thought that if you don't like it here, don't come/move/do business here? Isn't that the ideological reasoning for not making a gay couple a wedding cake? Which way do you want it?

California didn't regulate vehicle emissions because of some eco-dogma. The geography of the place makes vehicle emissions (which we can all agree are toxic, right?) hang around and make people sick. Smog is a real measurable thing, not a boogieman dreamed up by the leftist global elite. California still has some of the worst air in the country, due to the carbon dependent industry, infrastructure, geography, and scale, but we have no input into the healthiness of the air we breathe? How the privately-run car industry deals with the California rules in other states is capitalism in action.

There doesn't have to be the partisan rancor that is so apparent around these issues. One side wants something only because it's what the other side doesn't want. If we were children, our parents would have stopped the car long ago and given us all the ass-whooping we deserve. We've used up our good faith by planting our flags on only somewhat relevant social issues, meanwhile the Amazon burns.

Say what you want about how we got here and who's to blame, but here we are and at the end of the day this is only about not shitting where you eat, life rule #1.
 
While Joe and others have valid points, their broad brushed view of what California represents demonstrates that they never
lived in or visited the Los Angeles basin in the mid 1950's when smog was so bad EVERY DAY from auto emissions and factory smokestacks
that your eyes would sting and water. A grey haze limited visibility to a quarter of a mile. Breathing the toxic air from poorly tuned
and primitive automobile engines caused headaches. Many industrial operations would dump toxic materials into public waterways.
Who hasn't ever heard of the Cuyahoga River in Ohio catching fire in 1969. Unregulated use of DDT nearly caused the extinction of
our national symbol, the bald eagle as well as other raptors. Environmental regulations were meant for and have enhanced the ability
of the majority of citizens to enjoy breathing clean air and drinking clean water. California led the way in those endeavors. Unfortunately,
the ultra liberal politics in California allowed the radical left to ramrod ever stringent regulation to the point where common sense became
the baby thrown out with the bathwater. And, yes, a lot of industry left the state due to the strangulation of forms, applications, fees,
obsessive oversight, litigation, etc. But I, for one, would never want to go back to the environmental free for all that once was.
Consider the parable of the motorcycle that is only original once. With 40 million people, the majority of whom live in 4 distinct
urban areas (LA, SF, SD and Sac) life would be chaos without the lubricating oil of social regulation. Folks who want to live their lives
free from excessive governmental oversight should head on up to Alaska, Montana, Wyoming where hardly anyone lives.
 
lazyeye6 said:
While Joe and others have valid points, their broad brushed view of what California represents demonstrates that they never
lived in or visited the Los Angeles basin in the mid 1950's when smog was so bad EVERY DAY from auto emissions and factory smokestacks
that your eyes would sting and water. A grey haze limited visibility to a quarter of a mile. Breathing the toxic air from poorly tuned
and primitive automobile engines caused headaches. Many industrial operations would dump toxic materials into public waterways.
Who hasn't ever heard of the Cuyahoga River in Ohio catching fire in 1969. Unregulated use of DDT nearly caused the extinction of
our national symbol, the bald eagle as well as other raptors. Environmental regulations were meant for and have enhanced the ability
of the majority of citizens to enjoy breathing clean air and drinking clean water. California led the way in those endeavors. Unfortunately,
the ultra liberal politics in California allowed the radical left to ramrod ever stringent regulation to the point where common sense became
the baby thrown out with the bathwater. And, yes, a lot of industry left the state due to the strangulation of forms, applications, fees,
obsessive oversight, litigation, etc. But I, for one, would never want to go back to the environmental free for all that once was.
Consider the parable of the motorcycle that is only original once. With 40 million people, the majority of whom live in 4 distinct
urban areas (LA, SF, SD and Sac) life would be chaos without the lubricating oil of social regulation. Folks who want to live their lives
free from excessive governmental oversight should head on up to Alaska, Montana, Wyoming where hardly anyone lives.
Click to expand...
I grew up in Pittsburgh. It had been the "smoky city". My mother would tell me stories about the street lights being on at noon on a cloudless day. They endlessly scrubbed everything including themselves to get rid of the deposits coming out of the sky from the steel mills. But that was over by the mid 50s. The mills were still there, but the owners of the mills put "scrubbers" on the stacks. I only remember blue skys (if it wasn't raining or snowing -- or night lol). But if you parked right next to J&Ls mill on the southside, and left your car there for two weeks, there would be a thin film of red dust. When finnaly the mills left for cheap labor in South America and Japan the red rust was gone -- and so were the jobs. How the new mayor chortled that those depicable factory jobs were gone. And she promised a new era of prosperity. But that never came about. Only welfare came about. And slowly but surely the city righted itself until a visitor saw none of that. The factory workers no longer had jobs that supported a family, paying for college tuition and all the things they were used to. And what does this have to do with California? Sure, there are things that need cleaned up and can be, but going off the deep end with all of it poorly serves the people but only shows a self centered conceit that says, "The hell with everyone else, it's my way or the highway."
 
There is no middle ground once the gov't. gets involved. Industry would be far better off shaving the profit margin and policing itself to prevent self destruction. Because once extremist environmental groups become involved they have to grow in order to survive..... there goes the jobs is all I can say on the subject. I've seen the shrimping industry vanish within 30 years from this crapola. Oh yeah. There's still a small section of it scrabbling about, but it was once huge & now everything is imported farm raised tasting of pure _ _ _ _ . Don't get me wrong I do like a rather clean environment, but don't expect to eat off the ground.
 
There's no doubt that we all need to persue a more ecologically friendly energy path. Sadly, this problem is the ugly side of capitalism, where a person who doesn't consume energy can't really survive in modern american culture. So we all consume energy and generate greehouse gases. If I'm a chair maker and I can make and sell 2 chairs per day, I can barely get by. If I open a factory and consume huge amounts of energy making 200 chairs per day, I can become more wealthy, and gainfully employ some people but there is the cost of higher energy consumption. Unfortunately, energy consumption doesn't just have an economic and a monetary price, it also has an ecological price that may be determined to be much higher that we think somewhere down the road.

This is where we are in our evolution as an energy consumer oriented society. Al Gore won a Nobel prize for his ecological documentary. He also has a private jet and 3 homes, 1 of which I believe is the largest private home in the state of Tennesse. It consumes 21 times the energy of the average american home. Gavin Newsom, Governer of California commutes from kentfield daily to sacramento rather than live in the governer's mansion in Sacremento. Arnold Schwartzenegger Flew home to LA regularly on his private jet when he was the Governer. Even those mounted on the highest horses seem the think they can point the finger at someone else and still make a graceful dismount from their own "horse". We all buy into the energy consumer culture to some degree.

The finger pointing and wrangling between Trump and California is certainly partly a political cudgel, but we are all guilty to some degree of adding to the problem. I don't think we are going to solve it on the regulation side of the equation alone. I think we need a new equation for energy production other than burning fossil fuel. The earlier we start to persue that goal, the less painful the switch over will be. If it takes crazy incentives to get people to "go solar", to decrease much of their fossil fuel consumption, I think it's a smart idea to incentivise it now. It could also be a new american industry providing jobs. I think we could do more now to change the future result of our energy use, by reducing personal consumption and incentivising the development of better technology. I don't buy into the "We have X amount of years before we are doomed" philosophy, but I do agree that we need to change from fossil fuel to cleaner technologies.

Certainly there are international considerations as well. China burns coal for their energy, and they aren't about to cut back because they have a goal to be the world's leading industrial nation. That won't happen for them without burning coal. Incidentally they produce twice the amount of greenhouse gas as we currently do.

I didn't post any links in my comments, because I'm not promoting any political view. Instead I just expressed my opinion.

.
 
Last edited:
Trump claims that patriotism is the alternative to globalisation. However 'patriotism is the last refuge of a scoundrel'. Trump's businesses are global and he profits by exploiting the different laws in various jurisdictions. Perhaps he is just telling people what he thinks they want to hear ?
 
Perhaps he is just telling people what he thinks they want to hear ?

acotrel….that's what politicians do for a living!
 
It is a very fine line between service to and disservice to the people.
That workers can no longer find jobs that will support a family or pay for college education for their kids is not a phenomenon
unique to California. This is a national trend that started in the 1960s when a family began needing two incomes to be middle class.
Now, even two incomes doesn't equate to middle class unless they are professional grade salaries. This is the dumbing down
of American life styles as the rest of the world's life styles are upgraded and a result of globalization. If the USA were to stand alone
as an economy with living wages for all (call it patriotic socialism ;>) ) then prices would rise for the products we consume. We have
gone way too far down the rabbit hole of globalization to ever hope to extract ourselves from it.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top