Spark Plug Life......

kerinorton · Nov 30, 2014

I have been using N9Y, N(YC Champions for years with no problems. It is hotter than recommended , but then I don thrash the shit out of my engines. I mentioned that I have not looked at my plugs for nearly 2 years. I checked the other day and found the N9Y plug had worn to nearly 40 thou gap and still working. The N9YC in the other cylinder had worn to 30 thou gap.

I learned the hard way about 45 years ago and [ before I was a mechanic ] that going with the manufacturers recommendations was not always the best option. In those days I had a little Suzuki 150 twin, and the plugs fouled up after about a weeks running. I was frightened into believing I should stick with the speced heat range. I spoke to my dad [ a mechanics ] about it and he made me put hotter plugs in it. It scared the shit out of me because of warnings about burning hole in pistons. I never did burn a hole in a piston and I never did foul plugs again.
Ad Ripley said. "Believe it or not"

Dereck

dennisgb · Nov 30, 2014

kerinorton said:
I have been using N9Y, N(YC Champions for years with no problems. It is hotter than recommended , but then I don thrash the shit out of my engines. I mentioned that I have not looked at my plugs for nearly 2 years. I checked the other day and found the N9Y plug had worn to nearly 40 thou gap and still working. The N9YC in the other cylinder had worn to 30 thou gap.

I learned the hard way about 45 years ago and [ before I was a mechanic ] that going with the manufacturers recommendations was not always the best option. In those days I had a little Suzuki 150 twin, and the plugs fouled up after about a weeks running. I was frightened into believing I should stick with the speced heat range. I spoke to my dad [ a mechanics ] about it and he made me put hotter plugs in it. It scared the shit out of me because of warnings about burning hole in pistons. I never did burn a hole in a piston and I never did foul plugs again.
Ad Ripley said. "Believe it or not"

Dereck

If you happen to be running a little lean and you do that... :shock:

kerinorton · Dec 2, 2014

gtsun said:
Just a thought about your fuel, you said you buy jerry cans of it and also only put 30 miles on the bike every other week or so.. If you have the miserable ethonal crap fuel we do here that alone could be your problem. If my BSA sits like that the vented cap allows the ethonal or whatever it is to evaporate over a month or so & starting & preformance are noticeably bad.. Might be part of the equation?

I understood that ethanol has a much higher vapour point than petrol. That's why you have to heat the fuel to make it vapourise when you run an ethanol engine. Ethanol does attract water though.

olChris · Dec 2, 2014

kerinorton said:
gtsun said:

Just a thought about your fuel, you said you buy jerry cans of it and also only put 30 miles on the bike every other week or so.. If you have the miserable ethonal crap fuel we do here that alone could be your problem. If my BSA sits like that the vented cap allows the ethonal or whatever it is to evaporate over a month or so & starting & preformance are noticeably bad.. Might be part of the equation?

Click to expand...

I understood that ethanol has a much higher vapour point than petrol. That's why you have to heat the fuel to make it vapourise when you run an ethanol engine. Ethanol does attract water though.

Here in "Western" Australia ethanol is very rarely found in petrol. I have never knowingly had it in fuel. Over on the east coast i believe it is more widely available.. Not sure but other will inform us correctly!

comnoz · Dec 2, 2014

kerinorton said:
I have been using N9Y, N(YC Champions for years with no problems. It is hotter than recommended , but then I don thrash the shit out of my engines. I mentioned that I have not looked at my plugs for nearly 2 years. I checked the other day and found the N9Y plug had worn to nearly 40 thou gap and still working. The N9YC in the other cylinder had worn to 30 thou gap.

I learned the hard way about 45 years ago and [ before I was a mechanic ] that going with the manufacturers recommendations was not always the best option. In those days I had a little Suzuki 150 twin, and the plugs fouled up after about a weeks running. I was frightened into believing I should stick with the speced heat range. I spoke to my dad [ a mechanics ] about it and he made me put hotter plugs in it. It scared the shit out of me because of warnings about burning hole in pistons. I never did burn a hole in a piston and I never did foul plugs again.
Ad Ripley said. "Believe it or not"

Dereck

That is one way to do it.
The other way would be to use the correct plug and jet for a leaner mixture. Then you could enjoy a few more horsepower, a cleaner engine and better fuel mileage. Jim

davamb · Dec 2, 2014

dennisgb said:
I pulled the plugs out of my 2004 Colorado with Iridium and individual coils at 140K Miles...the gap was about .150" You might want to check those in your Sienna

Subaru Forester I recently bought started running like a dog couple of months after purchase. Had good service history and only 120k ks. Plugs were the last thing I suspected, but sure enough, they were the original Iridiums and had a gap large enough to ride a Harley through. Running like a charm with new ones.

olChris said:
Here in "Western" Australia ethanol is very rarely found in petrol. I have never knowingly had it in fuel. Over on the east coast i believe it is more widely available.. Not sure but other will inform us correctly!

It is available at every petrol station over here Chris, but I never use it in my bikes. Accidentally put it in the TRX one day and it ran so bad I drained the fuel as soon as I got home and put it aside for the lawn mower. Never again and never in the Norton! I always use high-octane fuel in my bikes, but didn't realise that this was achieved by adding ethanol in some petrol brands. It was clearly signed thus but I didn't take it in at the time.

Hobot · Dec 2, 2014

Ethanol evaporates easier than gasoline so if an engine for some strange reason needs its ethanol fuel heated its to over come ethanol's refrigerant effect.
Any idea on ignition power thresholds that erode gaps faster than advertised?

kerinorton · Dec 2, 2014

comnoz said:
kerinorton said:

I have been using N9Y, N(YC Champions for years with no problems. It is hotter than recommended , but then I don thrash the shit out of my engines. I mentioned that I have not looked at my plugs for nearly 2 years. I checked the other day and found the N9Y plug had worn to nearly 40 thou gap and still working. The N9YC in the other cylinder had worn to 30 thou gap.

I learned the hard way about 45 years ago and [ before I was a mechanic ] that going with the manufacturers recommendations was not always the best option. In those days I had a little Suzuki 150 twin, and the plugs fouled up after about a weeks running. I was frightened into believing I should stick with the speced heat range. I spoke to my dad [ a mechanics ] about it and he made me put hotter plugs in it. It scared the shit out of me because of warnings about burning hole in pistons. I never did burn a hole in a piston and I never did foul plugs again.
Ad Ripley said. "Believe it or not"

Dereck

Click to expand...

That is one way to do it.
The other way would be to use the correct plug and jet for a leaner mixture. Then you could enjoy a few more horsepower, a cleaner engine and better fuel mileage. Jim

I think at the moment, the 850 is just slightly on the lean side. Getting a few spit backs when its colder [ no choke ]. It seems to run economically when I want it to, and the headers are a good colour [ from what I have been lead to believe.

kerinorton · Dec 2, 2014

dennisgb said:
kerinorton said:

I have been using N9Y, N(YC Champions for years with no problems. It is hotter than recommended , but then I don thrash the shit out of my engines. I mentioned that I have not looked at my plugs for nearly 2 years. I checked the other day and found the N9Y plug had worn to nearly 40 thou gap and still working. The N9YC in the other cylinder had worn to 30 thou gap.

I learned the hard way about 45 years ago and [ before I was a mechanic ] that going with the manufacturers recommendations was not always the best option. In those days I had a little Suzuki 150 twin, and the plugs fouled up after about a weeks running. I was frightened into believing I should stick with the speced heat range. I spoke to my dad [ a mechanics ] about it and he made me put hotter plugs in it. It scared the shit out of me because of warnings about burning hole in pistons. I never did burn a hole in a piston and I never did foul plugs again.
Ad Ripley said. "Believe it or not"

Dereck

Click to expand...

If you happen to be running a little lean and you do that... :shock:

I think you are right.
Dereck

kerinorton · Dec 2, 2014

Subaru Forester I recently bought started running like a dog couple of months after purchase. Had good service history and only 120k ks. Plugs were the last thing I suspected, but sure enough, they were the original Iridiums and had a gap large enough to ride a Harley through. Running like a charm with new ones.

You poor bastard. What a shit of a vehicle to get at the spark plugs. [ or have the made it easier on the later vehicles ]

Dereck

davamb · Dec 2, 2014

kerinorton said:
You poor bastard. What a shit of a vehicle to get at the spark plugs. [ or have the made it easier on the later vehicles ]

Dereck

No Dereck, you are absolutely correct. They could not have made it harder if they tried (but could have made it a hell of a lot easier). I also did the rocker cover seal set at the same time and for a while actually considered taking out the motor just to get the damn rocker covers off! As it is I only had to dismantle the fuel rail! This is a SOHC engine, the DOHC must certainly be a motor out job. Makes working on the Norton a pure joy.

Time Warp · Dec 2, 2014

I'm guessing you haven't changed the plugs on a big block Mustang.

kerinorton said:
You poor bastard. What a shit of a vehicle to get at the spark plugs. [ or have the made it easier on the later vehicles ]

Dereck

kerinorton · Dec 5, 2014

I once told a mustang enthusiast to go away and do it himself. I value my hands being, a musician, and have got a bit pissed off with the garks and narls I have got my knuckles in over the years. Your right. The commando is nice and easy.
All the best. Dereck

dennisgb · Dec 5, 2014

kerinorton said:
dennisgb said:

kerinorton said:

I have been using N9Y, N(YC Champions for years with no problems. It is hotter than recommended , but then I don thrash the shit out of my engines. I mentioned that I have not looked at my plugs for nearly 2 years. I checked the other day and found the N9Y plug had worn to nearly 40 thou gap and still working. The N9YC in the other cylinder had worn to 30 thou gap.

I learned the hard way about 45 years ago and [ before I was a mechanic ] that going with the manufacturers recommendations was not always the best option. In those days I had a little Suzuki 150 twin, and the plugs fouled up after about a weeks running. I was frightened into believing I should stick with the speced heat range. I spoke to my dad [ a mechanics ] about it and he made me put hotter plugs in it. It scared the shit out of me because of warnings about burning hole in pistons. I never did burn a hole in a piston and I never did foul plugs again.
Ad Ripley said. "Believe it or not"

Dereck

Click to expand...

If you happen to be running a little lean and you do that... :shock:

Click to expand...

I think you are right.
Dereck

Dereck,

I think Jim Comstock's comments earlier in this thread are right on. Engine tune is a critical issue and if you are running rich and change to a hotter plug, what happen's when the carbs are tuned right? Or something changes? I try to avoid hotter plugs and concentrate on why the proper heat range plugs are fouling to avoid getting into trouble. I'm more conservative because I have burned some pistons over the years.

kerinorton · Dec 5, 2014

Ok. I just put a pair of BP7ES plugs in the 850. Lets see how she goes. Not going to hurt it.

Brooking 850 · Dec 5, 2014

I run B7ES with 98 pump fuel in the Road bike and B9ES with AVGAS in the race bike .

Regards Mike

Spark Plug Life......

kerinorton

dennisgb

kerinorton

olChris

comnoz

davamb

Hobot

kerinorton

kerinorton

kerinorton

davamb

Time Warp

.......back to the 70's.

kerinorton

dennisgb

kerinorton

Brooking 850

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