Problem with new Andover wiring harness

Back in Feb 2012 I bought, direct from Andover in the UK, a suite of new wiring harnesses (5 total) for my MK III. It has taken me a while to get to the place where I am finally installing the wiring.

I began at the taillight and routed the main harness up to its termination point near the head stock, then began connecting "branches". The replacement main harness has some shortfalls.

Some parts are OK -- the connections to the headlamp harness, the tail-lamp/turn-signals, the zener diodes, the rectifier, the solenoid, the rear brake switch, ignition sub-harness, and the battery are all the proper length and properly placed.

However, the wire length for the horn, alternator and neutral switch are all too short to reach their target (about 8-12 inches). The wiring bundle for the assimilator branches out at the same junction as the connectors that go to the headlamp harness and the ignition sub-harness at the head stock -- a long way from in front of the battery where the assimilator is mounted.

I suppose it is possible there is enough wire inside the loom's main brach to reach the proper locations (as on the original equipment wiring), but without splitting open the loom I do not know how to verify.

I see several alternatives: (1) remove and send back to Andover (slow, assuming they agreed to exchange); (2) Split the wire wrapping and if sufficient wire is there, fix and re-tape the loom; and (3) make jumper wires (from my old harness) to bridge the gaps. Might have to do #3 anyway if #2 was attempted and failed.

Your advice on how you would proceed would be greatly appreciated. I have today e-mailed Andover asking for their recommended course of action, but highly value the opinions I find on this site.

Option #3 would be my choice, just fill in the gaps. I am assuming you are not a concours purist type who enters display awards shows where people walk around in circles criticizing your lack of attention to detail. Those people dont ride and make life tedious at times.

lbridges said:

The wiring bundle for the assimilator branches out at the same junction as the connectors that go to the headlamp harness and the ignition sub-harness at the head stock -- a long way from in front of the battery where the assimilator is mounted.

Click to expand...

Move the assimilator?

Do you have the original harness or another 75 to compare the new harness to?

Two things: You have not placed the harness in the same position as the original one or the new harness is incorrect. I would verify the former before assuming the latter.

Things haven't changed.

Reggie had the same problem with the assimilator wiring of a new Mk III harness in 2006.

post10689.html

I have the original harness to compare against. The old OE assimilator bundle exits the main loom just aft of the grommet below the main frame tube (carb area) and is about 15 inches in length. The new assimilator bundle exits the main loom at the same place as the headlamp harness connectors (10-12 inches in front of the grommet - almost to headstock) and is 4 inches in length.

I am not a purist. I can make jumpers using wire from the original harness, preserving the color scheme.

I could move the assimilator, or adapt a replacement like the LS-11 lo-voltage sensor.

If I make jumper wires, which of the following would be advised (or some other way)?

1. Cut a new connector end off, splice in old wire in middle.

2. Get some new bullet connectors and make add-on wires.

EDIT: L.A.B. Nice to know they haven't fixed a problem known for 6 years.

And a final bit of frustration to help top off the day, just backed the wife's Toyota 4-Runner out of the garage for some working space and scratched up the left front fender.

Be sure to send a PM to member ZFD. I'm sure he'd like to hear concerns about his wiring harnesses.

1-Send it back. If people keep fixing their errors they will never get it right. (I know the wait time is painful)

2-Ask for a discount at least for your labor and materials.

I was about to order one from them for my bike. Going to wait and see what happens on this issue.

lbridges said:

If I make jumper wires, which of the following would be advised (or some other way)?

1. Cut a new connector end off, splice in old wire in middle.

2. Get some new bullet connectors and make add-on wires.

Click to expand...

If you do decide to do this, my vote would be #1. You can do good solder connections with heat shrink protection and still get to use the new connectors. #2 adds extra non-soldered connections and uses the old connectors on the affected devices to boot.

Option #3 lets him get up n' riding for a later season. BTW the horn position sucks bad so a shorter more open positioning (for a modern horn) may save your and others lives. Purists may flinch now.

I think that it is more important knowing that the wires and connections are fresh and new. A little tweaking here or there is minor compared to the bigger picture.

It is ashame that it is not right but it sounds like you're almost home and you need to get a ridin.

In the end, it's your comfort level and your descision.

I heard back on a PM to ZFD. States he will look into it, notes that he has not been getting complaints from other sales of the main harness (will ask some dealers he trusts if they had problems). I will report back if any new developments happen.

I decided to cut through the loom tape covering at the junction where the assimilator branch goes into the loom main bundle. Three wires head back to the "proper" location, and undoubtedly the loom cover could be pealed back enough then retaped to be useful; however, two wire colors (White and Red) go forward AND back. Each of these two have 2 wires feeding into female 1/4" blade (Lucar?) connectors (just like the other wires for the assimilator). To fix this would require a cutting out the connector,joining the wire in a solder joint, peeling the loom cover back about 10-12 inches, then cutting and installing a female blade connector in the OEM location, finished with a new tape job.

Maybe I'll just go negative ground - that way the assimilator wires are excess anyway (relocate the horn, and install a Podtronics), then all I need is to make jumpers for the neutral switch.

lbridges said:

I heard back on a PM to ZFD. States he will look into it, notes that he has not been getting complaints from other sales of the main harness (will ask some dealers he trusts if they had problems). I will report back if any new developments happen.

I decided to cut through the loom tape covering at the junction where the assimilator branch goes into the loom main bundle. Three wires head back to the "proper" location, and undoubtedly the loom cover could be pealed back enough then retaped to be useful; however, two wire colors (White and Red) go forward AND back. Each of these two have 2 wires feeding into female 1/4" blade (Lucar?) connectors (just like the other wires for the assimilator). To fix this would require a cutting out the connector,joining the wire in a solder joint, peeling the loom cover back about 10-12 inches, then cutting and installing a female blade connector in the OEM location, finished with a new tape job.

Maybe I'll just go negative ground - that way the assimilator wires are excess anyway (relocate the horn, and install a Podtronics), then all I need is to make jumpers for the neutral switch.

Click to expand...

Thanks for sending the PM. We are very fortunate to have such an accessible supplier.

I like your plan for negative ground. Sounds solid.

Update:

Exchanged several e-mails with AN between the 4th and the 8th of June. A gentleman there kindly sent me a jpg image of a part of the wiring harness layout.

That was enough to confirm the harness I got did not match the drawing. Haven't heard anything more since I answered a set of questions on the 8th.

If I wanted the ignition warning light unit (assimilator) wiring to match up to the OEM location with the harness sent, I would need jumper wires approximately 480mm in length. The harness sent to me has the Ign warning unit bundle exiting the main loom about 250mm to far forward and is missing about 230mm branch length off the main loom. The horn wiring is also short around 25-40mm when compared to the build drawing. I don't know if that is within their expected tolerances or not, but I know I would be rather upset if I disassembled enough of a Norton to fix the horn wiring only to come up an inch short. Not to mention Ign warning unit jumper wires would suck if I was "restoring" my bike. The harness also came in a non-CA mode. There were no wires that would have connected to the Canadian model "Headlamp ON" unit. This does not match their build drawing either.

Haven't heard much else in the way of what they suggest I should do (not too happy about that), so I will use the harness to produce a new negative ground harness. To accomplish that, I cut out a 1 foot by 5 foot piece of plywood, and secured each end of the stretched out main loom with zip ties. Then at each branching off the main I drilled through the board on both sides of the branch to positively locate the branch (using more zip-ties).

I think I'd like to wrap-up and perhaps close out this topic with saying I am pretty disappointed with AN on this subject.

I had a couple of what I thought were very promising and supportive e-mail exchanges with them. Then it was like they dropped off the face of the earth.

No offer to replace, refund, partial refund nothing - all communication ended after the following exchange (the exchange really has no explanatory content, repeated here only to show we seemed to be getting on quite well):

***** the last e-mail from either side, that being one from me to Keith at AN ***********************************

Keith,

Yes. Using a single small bolt, spacer and nut near the forward edge of the the battery carrier tray.

It is arranged so the device is mounted horizontally, with the electrical connections facing rearward. The part number, 06-6393, is on the top of the unit along with the logo of what each connections is for, e.g., two marked AL for alternator, one marked E for earth, etc.

Lee

-----Original Message-----
From: Keith Calder
Sent: Friday, June 08, 2012 4:52 AM
To: 'Lee Bridges'
Subject: RE: Andover Norton Parts Acknowledgement

Hi Lee,

Thanks for the details. Can you tell me where your ignition warning light unit was/is mounted on your bike?

Regards,

Keith

-----Original Message-----
From: Lee Bridges
Sent: 08 June 2012 00:24
To: 'Keith Calder'
Subject: RE: Andover Norton Parts Acknowledgement

Keith,

Thank you for the drawing. I can send a photo for comparison if that would help, but I would need guidance concerning exactly what you wanted photographed. In the meantime I will provide a few measurements contrasting the loom provided with the drawing image you sent.

The drawing you provided shows a wire bundle leaving the main loom that terminates in the Neutral Indicator and Alternator connections, with a side branch that splits into the Powerpoint wiring and Headlamp Warning Unit or Ignition Warning Light wiring.

In my case the Neutral Indicator/Alternator branch plus the Powerpoint branch come off the main loom in one leg then split with lengths close enough to be within expected tolerances for a wiring loom. However, the Ignition Warning Light unit wires are not as imaged and exit the main loon approximately 10" or 250mm away in the direction of the front of the motorcycle (to the left in the image you sent), and has a branch length of approximately 4" or 100mm.

At first I thought the Headlamp/Ignition warning unit wires had simply been wrapped up in the loom to the wrong exit point and I could split the loom covering, returning the wires to their proper position. However, there are two leads in that bundle (confirmed on your image) that each have two wires attached (a red wire and a white wire set of leads) - one of the pair in each goes forward, the other aft. As a result, I cannot simply split the loom covering, pull the wire to the correct place, and then retape the loom.
It might be worth noting that only 5 wires are in that bundle, not 7 as shown in your image. My loom seems to be Ignition Warning Light unit-only capable. The Blue and Brown/Green wires that would be used for the Canadian model are either absent or wrapped up somewhere inside the loom. As I have a USA model, this is really of no concern, just an item for your consideration.

To extend the headlamp/ignition warning wire to its proper position would require extension cable with appropriate connectors and of approx 0.5m in length (250mm back to the expected branch point, then the 230mm length of the branch, plus a little for the secondary branch length.

I have the extra horn lead you mention. The new harness seems short of the necessary length of the horn wiring even with the extension, but your supplier produced a loom accurately matching the drawing. Note: my original loom has a horn wire length of about 125mm, perhaps this is within expected specs, but wires that come up slightly short seem somehow more frustrating than the larger errors.

Although I can't verify against missing parts of the loom in the image you sent, the rest of the loom appears to be approximately correct based on my early trial fit.

I feel I should note I have the original loom, and I both removed that loom and will be the installer for the new loom, so there was no hand-off from one owner, or shop, to another that might introduce confusion.

Sincerely,
Lee

********** there were other, earlier exchanges, but repeating them doesn't ad anything to this story *****************************************

I have since cut up their harness and routed the wires to where I need them as well as switching over to negative ground (which means the main problem - length of wire for the ignition warning unit - was OBE).

So, on the one hand I have a running bike with all new connectors and wiring in the proper colors to match the OEM diagram (except for the pos/neg earth swap thing), while on the other if I was still waiting for them to rectify the bad product - shipped direct from AN to my house - my bike would be non-functional.

First Post on here so saying hello to one and all. 8)
Nearly completed a total nut and bolt rebuild on my MK3 and had the same problem with the wiring harness and wished I'd spotted this thread sooner as I thought it was something I got wrong? To get around the problem a good mate of mine sorted the assimilator issue by moving it forward which i think looks okay but time will tell, and a replacement horn (Not a Norton part but good ole Halfords at £12.99 as the old one was completely knackerd anyway) was located inside the empty coil bracket and fits and works perfectly.


Bikes nearly finished now but not without other problems (poor parts mainly) but it started up second kick so we're getting there?

Uggy, that's a neat job. Also the bike looks nice too. 8) 8)

Having had the same issue with an A.N. wiring harness in 2006, on my bike, I mounted the assimilator onto the frame using one of the holes that the head steady plates would normally use.
I have a Dave Taylor head steady fitted and therefore these mounting holes onto the frame for the headsteady are not used for that purpose.

Real nice resto/rebuild Uggy! Concours!

Snorton74 said:

Real nice resto/rebuild Uggy! Concours!

Click to expand...

Appreciate your comments guys 8) but not quite. It was built to ride so apart from the wiring issues, it has front and back 13mm AN brake cylinders, straight through Black Caps and a pair off Premier MK1 carbs. But otherwise It's pretty much standard. :wink:

Uggy,
Saweeet, welcome. Always room for more advice and proven options to getting the job done.

Chuck