Primary chain death

Is this shedding of chain rollers a known issue with the Norton primary chain?

I have not heard of this before.

It is, with cheap chain.

Queue Andychain...

Yes, it happens to the original chain too:

http://www.accessnorton.com/NortonCommando/primary-chain-life-expectancy.10751/#post-148779

Happened to me a few years ago, bought the new one below from Steadfast and it is holding up fine so far...

http://www.steadfastcycles.com/cart/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=89_208&products_id=4638

BrianG said:

Is this shedding of chain rollers a known issue with the Norton primary chain?

I have not heard of this before.

Click to expand...

It is known, to those in the know, that the vast majority of triplex chains available are crap, please note the term majority. Laverda owners found this out years ago and in vast numbers changed to a duplex chain from a Mercedes diesel motor, that was 17 years ago. I sold many chains, into the thousands of pounds and have sold few since, with many of them fitted to race engines and high mileage road bikes. A few years ago on this forum I offered the same product to Commado owners with very limited take up. Just google The Chain man and talk to me, I will tell you the advantages. Also those who have taken the chain please give me some feedback. Virtually every belt drive drive on any bike gives issues although people spending many hundreds of pounds tend not to admit it, and Harley owners are changing back to chains.

andychain said:

Also those who have taken the chain please give me some feedback.

Click to expand...

I have bought a cam-, primary- and drive chain from you Andychain. I am very pleased with all of them. I am particularly pleased with the primary chain, because it reduces the moment arm of the crankshaft and gear shaft.

I converted to Andy's chain after I had trouble with the chain from an authorized supplier after only 600km. Now I have been driving for two years without a problem. My engine is modified and has a good torque. I recommend everyone to use Andy's chains on your Commando. Have a nice problem free day.

Virtually every belt drive drive on any bike gives issues although people spending many hundreds of pounds tend not to admit it
------------------

Through the years of Andy posting on this forum I have nothing but respect for his knowledge of chains.
However, I have to assume Andy is referring only to bikes with the main rear drive having belt problems, and not primary belt drives.
One of the very best upgrades I have done is switch to a no leak, no clutch plate fouling, lighter weight, smooth, quiet, belt primary.
I recently replaced my primary belt with 24,000 miles on it not because it needed to be replaced but just out of principle that I should.

1up3down said:

One of the very best upgrades I have done is switch to a no leak, no clutch plate fouling, lighter weight, smooth, quiet, belt primary.

Click to expand...

I'm agreed about this. But IF you want chain, your man are Andy.

I contacted Andy ("Andy Chain") and bought his 2 row primary chain. The links are visibly stronger and I have about 2000 miles on it with no adjustment necessary.

motorson said:

I contacted Andy ("Andy Chain") and bought his 2 row primary chain. The links are visibly stronger and I have about 2000 miles on it with no adjustment necessary.

Click to expand...

Does it require new 2-row drove sprocket and clutch basket or do you just run it on the stock sprockets?

You fit it to stock sprockets and use the 2 inner rows, got mine but its not fitted, it is noticeably better quality than any other chain I have seen.

kommando said:

You fit it to stock sprockets and use the 2 inner rows, g

Click to expand...

I agree to use the two inner rows. Then the forces move inward and come more in line with the bearing in the clutch hub.

Makes sense. Perhaps someone could chuck 'em up in a lathe and carve off the unused rows? Probably not worth the hassle.

Not sure on the clutch but the engine sprocket is too hard to machine on a lathe, for another reason I took the outer row off an engine sprocket and ground it off.

Those with no problems with belt drives on primaries are not my issue, if you want to use a belt every 20-30,000 thats not a problem however I heard of plenty of problems with belt primaries. I was responding to the question re chain rollers failing. I actually like belts, as a mechanic a belt cam drive is perfect if changed regularly. What I wonder is why people who have had many thousands of miles on original Renold havent figured out that the quality of chains has dropped off a cliff. Simple really........industry the main purchaser of chain runs mainly on price, instead of companies wanting a 5, 10 or longer year chain life they look at the figure at the bottom of the page, no 10 years plans now more like 6 month. Even iwis who I believe make the best product has a plant in China for its Elite brand and I will not sell it. When iwis bows to industry pressure and produces only budget product that is the time I stop selling chain.

Dont forget I can come and bore your club just contact me.

Andy

Ps Thanks for the good comments

Built down to a price to compete with those who make pennies a day is the way of the modern world.

Back in the early 60's, I was a young engineer working for a large corp. Most all the production and packaging machinery in the plant was chain driven. Someone in engineering management decided the company could save lots of money if there was a chain available that would wear significantly longer than all others. I was given the task of researching all the manufacturers of chain to find the best. I was enthusiastic about this assignment as I was the proud new owner of my Atlas, and gaining knowledge of a superior chain would be of benefit to me.

After weeks of research, comparing strength and wear properties, I found chains of all the US manufacturers to be exactly the same. A little reflection told why .... chain manufacturers made the plates, pins, and rollers from steel procured from one or two major steel suppliers. All manufacturers are forced to meet rigid dimensional specifications. Therefore, using the same steel, and making the parts to the same dimensional specs, no manufacturer could gain any advantage over the others. If a chain manufacturer elected to use an inferior steel for plates, pins, or rollers, their product would not meet ANSII strength specs.

Also, back in the 60's, no US chain manufacturer would endorse his product for motorcycle use, as the demands of a motorcycle far exceeded their own recommendations for load limits and lubrication.

Yes, the quality has come down. MC chains need only meet dimensional specs, and the use of inferior steel has become commonplace, either because of choice, i.e save $$, or because Chinese and Indian metallurgy is still in the bronze age.

Best to buy chains from Andy the Chainman, or from industrial suppliers who provide chains with all the appropriate US and Euro certifications. Never tell the counterman, the chain (or bearing) is for a MC, they will often refuse to sell it to you. My standard answer is "it is for an air compressor."

Slick

Has anyone knowledge about andychain? I have emailed him and PMd him here, to no avail.

Give him a ring, he can miss emails.

BrianG said:

Has anyone knowledge about andychain? I have emailed him and PMd him here, to no avail.

Click to expand...

It has taken a couple of tries to make contact with Andy at times, but the end result has always been worthwhile, decent product, good price. Often delivered before I have paid!