Handmade Tanks - Singh Precisions
- Thread starter SvenSven
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midnightlamp
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- Joined
- May 2014
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- 139
Those tanks are actually made out in pakistan. I have one, it's still being painted, but it does look absolutely stellar, and fits with an original cap no problems and doesn't leak at all. Was very happy with the purchase.
You may be getting a better product with an EMGO one like what is available from bonneville shop, etc..., but both are still 100% better than a rusty old tank, and I'd rather save the $140-150 difference between the tanks and put it towards things that matter more on the bike (seat, shocks, etc...).
You may be getting a better product with an EMGO one like what is available from bonneville shop, etc..., but both are still 100% better than a rusty old tank, and I'd rather save the $140-150 difference between the tanks and put it towards things that matter more on the bike (seat, shocks, etc...).
Singh has still not got back to me after numerous emails etc. Ironically, he was the one that volunteered to use me as an honest channel onto this forum. Idea was to share the quality of his work, schedule and costs etc with a 100% no question guarantee from the onset of the project with pictures, progress, etc. That way I could share with you the details in a relatively unbiased manner.
Nothing to date after he kicked off the project well over 3 months ago. To be fair perhaps his health condition will explain all of this. However, seems he has returned and is communicating with some customers. I guess the downside of my honest brokerage is the transparency; the part I'm sharing here. Should it change, I'll convey that again as well.
SvenSven
-->FJ
Nothing to date after he kicked off the project well over 3 months ago. To be fair perhaps his health condition will explain all of this. However, seems he has returned and is communicating with some customers. I guess the downside of my honest brokerage is the transparency; the part I'm sharing here. Should it change, I'll convey that again as well.
SvenSven
-->FJ
rx7171
MEMBER
- Joined
- Oct 2007
- Messages
- 656
SvenSven said:
After what you've gone through so far even if he eventually comes through for you, which my doubts are increasing, I'd not want to be put through the delay and frustrating lack of communication you've gone through. How hard is really if he reads your e-mail to spend 10 seconds with at least a reply and apology for the delay.
My guess is at some point he will not reply any more. I hope for your sake I'm wrong.
Sort of like when you keep calling a girl asking for a date and she keeps telling you something like she needs to wash her hair that evening.
She really doesn't want to date you.
Hi,
I've been bothering Singh about this problem and he sent me this this morning. I haven't personally seen his tanks yet. I almost had some jelly mold tanks built, but I had problems getting my old Duc single into India (oddly enough, the problem was on the Australian government side). I wanted my bike there to see if they'd fit and work. Also, AN blocks Korea and Vietnam from viewing. I had to use VPNs there, so I understand if email from India goes straight to their spam box.
-Dave
Here's the message from Singh:
Hello All,
Firstly I want to thank my old friend Dave for informing me about this thread and helping me post my reply here. I signed up for a new AN membership (waiting approval since 20+ days) as I lost the info about my old username.
As you all already must have read, Mr Farrokh aka SVENSVEN contacted me a few months ago about a custom Commando tank.
We exchanged several emails and I tried to answer all his queries & concerns, which were primarily about the transaction's security if an order is placed. In the span of 10+ days & a dozen emails, We discussed my return policy where one can ship the item(s) back to my Facilities in Vegas or Portland and get a full refund + return shipping and other the Paypal's security & refund/dispute options along with my product’s quality.
The Following is one of my replies in detail –
Hey Farrokh,
I have read thru your mail(s) in detail and as i understand, you as a buyer wish to purchase my product(s) but are reluctant as we have not dealt before and my reassurances on the issue of quality do not hold any weight until you see my products in person.
On the other hand, as a seller, I am absolutely certain of the product I hand make, but again, since we have not dealt earlier, my quality claims are just Verbal/email claims.
Allow me to suggest a more efficient way of moving forward with this deal -
I will now go ahead and start the work on your Lyta tank. Traditionally a buyer has to place a 50% advance before I start the work. But I will let go of this advance payment in our case as, Firstly, I trust you as a fellow motorcyclist & Norton enthusiast and secondly, I have learnt a lot from the Access Norton forums over the years. I think I can do as little as this much in return for the access Norton forum & community.
I will send you detailed pics thru the build and will simultaneously explain the process along the pics. That way you can be a part of the build and also suggest any changes if needed at any stage. Once the tank is all set, I will send you the final pics, in proper daylight condition, from all angles, close up of the welds, fuel taps, mounts etc. Once I get your final approval I will go ahead and ship the tank & provide you with the tracking info.
Once you get the tank, you can try it on your frame, ride with it and then post a review on the access Norton forum (as honestly as you prefer). Thereafter, if the quality of the tank is upto your satisfaction, you can purchase the tank by sending a payment my way.
However, if the tank is not upto your expectations, you can re pack it in the same package as it came in and I will have it picked up from your address and have it shipped to my Facility in Portland or Vegas.
As you can understand by now, I am willing to bear the expenses and spend the 18 days needed to custom hand make a tank and ship it your way for NO advance payment. But however, Needless to say, being in this industry for over a decade, I often interact with people who have great plans in theory but are not upto the task when it comes down to financial transactions. Therefore, as an assurance for both of us, I would greatly appreciate if we can get at least 2 other Access Norton forum members to vow for the Terms of this transaction on the forum thread, and ensure that this transaction will be taken care of as discussed above if the tank is up to the satisfactory mark.
I hope you understand my perspective as well.
Sincerely,
Singh
After the discussion, Mr Farrokh was traveling overseas for a while and I was occupied with other projects, thus we were out of contact. He did send me several emails recently but I suffered a stroke (minor one thankfully) and was out of action for over 5 weeks. (Sorry Farrokh). Anyways, things are better now and I am almost back on track, making up for the delay in the pending orders.
Coming back to the prime question – Can you trust what Singh Precisions offers you?
I have been involved with motorcycles since as long as I can remember. I own a variety of motorcycles from all over the world for which I often order several parts from eBay & foreign sellers. I have been Duped, Overcharged and cheated several times, I know the buyer’s perspective inside out.
I am thankful to Dave & Steve who have purchased / seen my products and posted an honest review here on this thread. Being in this industry for long, I can get more clients/buyers to post their reviews here. However, I suggest a lot more efficient way of moving further on this topic -
I am still very much open for the same option I offered to SvenSven (Farrokh). I am willing to send a Tank or any other of my product, all on my expenses, including shipping, to Farrokh or any person users of this forum collectively agree upon. Once the tank is delivered, it can be inspected, tested and a Bare knuckle honest review should be posted here on AN for everyone. Once the review is complete, I will pay for the return shipping and have the Tank picked up and sent to my Facility.
If this sounds Fair enough, I am ready to roll
Sincerely,
Singh
[Broken Link Removed]
I've been bothering Singh about this problem and he sent me this this morning. I haven't personally seen his tanks yet. I almost had some jelly mold tanks built, but I had problems getting my old Duc single into India (oddly enough, the problem was on the Australian government side). I wanted my bike there to see if they'd fit and work. Also, AN blocks Korea and Vietnam from viewing. I had to use VPNs there, so I understand if email from India goes straight to their spam box.
-Dave
Here's the message from Singh:
Hello All,
Firstly I want to thank my old friend Dave for informing me about this thread and helping me post my reply here. I signed up for a new AN membership (waiting approval since 20+ days) as I lost the info about my old username.
As you all already must have read, Mr Farrokh aka SVENSVEN contacted me a few months ago about a custom Commando tank.
We exchanged several emails and I tried to answer all his queries & concerns, which were primarily about the transaction's security if an order is placed. In the span of 10+ days & a dozen emails, We discussed my return policy where one can ship the item(s) back to my Facilities in Vegas or Portland and get a full refund + return shipping and other the Paypal's security & refund/dispute options along with my product’s quality.
The Following is one of my replies in detail –
Hey Farrokh,
I have read thru your mail(s) in detail and as i understand, you as a buyer wish to purchase my product(s) but are reluctant as we have not dealt before and my reassurances on the issue of quality do not hold any weight until you see my products in person.
On the other hand, as a seller, I am absolutely certain of the product I hand make, but again, since we have not dealt earlier, my quality claims are just Verbal/email claims.
Allow me to suggest a more efficient way of moving forward with this deal -
I will now go ahead and start the work on your Lyta tank. Traditionally a buyer has to place a 50% advance before I start the work. But I will let go of this advance payment in our case as, Firstly, I trust you as a fellow motorcyclist & Norton enthusiast and secondly, I have learnt a lot from the Access Norton forums over the years. I think I can do as little as this much in return for the access Norton forum & community.
I will send you detailed pics thru the build and will simultaneously explain the process along the pics. That way you can be a part of the build and also suggest any changes if needed at any stage. Once the tank is all set, I will send you the final pics, in proper daylight condition, from all angles, close up of the welds, fuel taps, mounts etc. Once I get your final approval I will go ahead and ship the tank & provide you with the tracking info.
Once you get the tank, you can try it on your frame, ride with it and then post a review on the access Norton forum (as honestly as you prefer). Thereafter, if the quality of the tank is upto your satisfaction, you can purchase the tank by sending a payment my way.
However, if the tank is not upto your expectations, you can re pack it in the same package as it came in and I will have it picked up from your address and have it shipped to my Facility in Portland or Vegas.
As you can understand by now, I am willing to bear the expenses and spend the 18 days needed to custom hand make a tank and ship it your way for NO advance payment. But however, Needless to say, being in this industry for over a decade, I often interact with people who have great plans in theory but are not upto the task when it comes down to financial transactions. Therefore, as an assurance for both of us, I would greatly appreciate if we can get at least 2 other Access Norton forum members to vow for the Terms of this transaction on the forum thread, and ensure that this transaction will be taken care of as discussed above if the tank is up to the satisfactory mark.
I hope you understand my perspective as well.
Sincerely,
Singh
After the discussion, Mr Farrokh was traveling overseas for a while and I was occupied with other projects, thus we were out of contact. He did send me several emails recently but I suffered a stroke (minor one thankfully) and was out of action for over 5 weeks. (Sorry Farrokh). Anyways, things are better now and I am almost back on track, making up for the delay in the pending orders.
Coming back to the prime question – Can you trust what Singh Precisions offers you?
I have been involved with motorcycles since as long as I can remember. I own a variety of motorcycles from all over the world for which I often order several parts from eBay & foreign sellers. I have been Duped, Overcharged and cheated several times, I know the buyer’s perspective inside out.
I am thankful to Dave & Steve who have purchased / seen my products and posted an honest review here on this thread. Being in this industry for long, I can get more clients/buyers to post their reviews here. However, I suggest a lot more efficient way of moving further on this topic -
I am still very much open for the same option I offered to SvenSven (Farrokh). I am willing to send a Tank or any other of my product, all on my expenses, including shipping, to Farrokh or any person users of this forum collectively agree upon. Once the tank is delivered, it can be inspected, tested and a Bare knuckle honest review should be posted here on AN for everyone. Once the review is complete, I will pay for the return shipping and have the Tank picked up and sent to my Facility.
If this sounds Fair enough, I am ready to roll
Sincerely,
Singh
[Broken Link Removed]
Singh:
I've emailed you 5 times about this directly.... 2x in the past week. In my direct emails to you, I left you my home address and my various telephones so we can talk. I even requested your phone number to call you at my expense. Soon as you can complete the direct contact that we can proceed.
Regards,
SvenSven
-->FJ
I've emailed you 5 times about this directly.... 2x in the past week. In my direct emails to you, I left you my home address and my various telephones so we can talk. I even requested your phone number to call you at my expense. Soon as you can complete the direct contact that we can proceed.
Regards,
SvenSven
-->FJ
gdickie
MEMBER
- Joined
- Jul 2014
- Messages
- 14
Hi Guys
I'm still here downunder waiting for my Norvil tank from Singh. After waiting over 4 months it was promised to be delivered first week of January, although I was hoping for an early Christmas present last year! I have seen a number of progress photos and it looks right, just waiting for the mailman.
Maybe Singh forgot to write the address up side down and it has gone to the North Pole. Anyway, if, and when it arrives this site will be the first to know.
I'm still here downunder waiting for my Norvil tank from Singh. After waiting over 4 months it was promised to be delivered first week of January, although I was hoping for an early Christmas present last year! I have seen a number of progress photos and it looks right, just waiting for the mailman.
Maybe Singh forgot to write the address up side down and it has gone to the North Pole. Anyway, if, and when it arrives this site will be the first to know.
phillyskip
MEMBER
- Joined
- Sep 2013
- Messages
- 246
Beautiful work on that Vincent project. Very Impressive!
I was following this thread late last year, because I wanted to investigate getting a new Interstate tank. After having some non-responses from ebay sellers in India, or their local reps (whoever they might be!?) I emailed Singh Precisions direct as follows
" I have a \'73 Norton Commando and I am thinking about an \"Interstate\" tank. I have followed the saga of your health on the AccessNorton forums and I hope that you are fully recovered. The principal issue with tanks from the sub-continent is fit, and IMO a good look at the bottom of a tank gives a pretty good idea of the quality of the construction generally. Can you post or send me a pic of the bottom of an Interstate tank? Also, have you considered making 850 Mk111 side panels? Also very hard to find. Cheers!"
Two weeks later I received the following reply.
"Thanks for getting in touch. Sorry i could not reply to you any sooner. Our Server was down, msgs didn't get thru until today.
I am doing much better now. On medication for 6 months. Thanks for asking , appreciate it.
Attached is a pic of the Interstate tank's underside.
The welds are all TIG. The outer sides are often double passed and the inner holding the under tunnel are single pass.
Once I finish the welding and pressure test the tank, I pressure test it with 5+ PSI of pressure. That’s a lot more than whats needed for leak testing. Just to give you an idea, at 9 PSI, the tank splits open like a pack of chips.
The reason why 5 PSI is my preference is because such high pressure not only reveals any leaks, but it also tests the welds on the entire tank. Many a times, any weak weld or non penetrative weld pops right up the second pressure hits 5 PSI.
Usually, any tank would have 5-6 microscopic leaks after I am done with the welding. Strong welds are not necessarily leak proof. So to seal the leaks, the leaking section needs a small pass( Few cms) again - NOT spot welding.
The particular spot where the leak is fixed may look Botched, but since i don't grind the welds for cosmetic purposes, they withstand the vibrations of the Bike (specially early commandos) far better than the sanded welds.
But however, i can sand the welds and make them look cosmetically pleasing the client orders for it.
I understand your concern about the quality of the Tank, so let me know if you need more pics or info on the tanks or welds."
The photo of the top of the tank looks fine, but would need to be measured and eyeballed to ensure it would paint up well, but what are your opinions about the bottom weld fest. It seems to me that if anyone was fair-dinkum about making these tanks it would not be beyond them to fabricate a basic die to push out one piece formed tank bottoms to avoid the potential problems of a fully welded unit. It would, I assume be much easier and less time consuming to fabricate too. One ebay seller on Ebay/au has a red interstate tank pictured with the original pressed steel tank bottom, but I's bet dollars to doniuts that's not what you'd get if you laid down your hard earned! Some resellers (Burton?) advertise tanks that look a bit like this-does anyone know if the bottoms are welded up, or presssed??
Opinions/experiences please.
" I have a \'73 Norton Commando and I am thinking about an \"Interstate\" tank. I have followed the saga of your health on the AccessNorton forums and I hope that you are fully recovered. The principal issue with tanks from the sub-continent is fit, and IMO a good look at the bottom of a tank gives a pretty good idea of the quality of the construction generally. Can you post or send me a pic of the bottom of an Interstate tank? Also, have you considered making 850 Mk111 side panels? Also very hard to find. Cheers!"
Two weeks later I received the following reply.
"Thanks for getting in touch. Sorry i could not reply to you any sooner. Our Server was down, msgs didn't get thru until today.
I am doing much better now. On medication for 6 months. Thanks for asking , appreciate it.
Attached is a pic of the Interstate tank's underside.
The welds are all TIG. The outer sides are often double passed and the inner holding the under tunnel are single pass.
Once I finish the welding and pressure test the tank, I pressure test it with 5+ PSI of pressure. That’s a lot more than whats needed for leak testing. Just to give you an idea, at 9 PSI, the tank splits open like a pack of chips.
The reason why 5 PSI is my preference is because such high pressure not only reveals any leaks, but it also tests the welds on the entire tank. Many a times, any weak weld or non penetrative weld pops right up the second pressure hits 5 PSI.
Usually, any tank would have 5-6 microscopic leaks after I am done with the welding. Strong welds are not necessarily leak proof. So to seal the leaks, the leaking section needs a small pass( Few cms) again - NOT spot welding.
The particular spot where the leak is fixed may look Botched, but since i don't grind the welds for cosmetic purposes, they withstand the vibrations of the Bike (specially early commandos) far better than the sanded welds.
But however, i can sand the welds and make them look cosmetically pleasing the client orders for it.
I understand your concern about the quality of the Tank, so let me know if you need more pics or info on the tanks or welds."
The photo of the top of the tank looks fine, but would need to be measured and eyeballed to ensure it would paint up well, but what are your opinions about the bottom weld fest. It seems to me that if anyone was fair-dinkum about making these tanks it would not be beyond them to fabricate a basic die to push out one piece formed tank bottoms to avoid the potential problems of a fully welded unit. It would, I assume be much easier and less time consuming to fabricate too. One ebay seller on Ebay/au has a red interstate tank pictured with the original pressed steel tank bottom, but I's bet dollars to doniuts that's not what you'd get if you laid down your hard earned! Some resellers (Burton?) advertise tanks that look a bit like this-does anyone know if the bottoms are welded up, or presssed??
Opinions/experiences please.
Fast Eddie
FULL MEMBER
- Joined
- Oct 2013
- Messages
- 23,413
Just looks to me like you'd be chasing one split / crack another there ... !
B+Bogus
MEMBER
- Joined
- Jun 2009
- Messages
- 2,373
There should be a recess for the latch in front of the filler neck (not sure if it's there?), and some threaded bosses to mount the tank to the bike would be good - although it could be he just hasn't got round to those yet, which would be understandable.
Anybody know how to contact/organise a lobby group for EMGO?
Anybody know how to contact/organise a lobby group for EMGO?
kommando
MEMBER
- Joined
- May 2005
- Messages
- 8,088
But the die does not save you much as the labour is so cheap, yes the die is made using the same cheap labour wise but material costs are much higher as a % as a result as they are Globally priced.
These are small shops doing one offs or small runs so a die is a big expense in their eyes.
You have to forget how we look at things, they have labour by the bucket load.
These are small shops doing one offs or small runs so a die is a big expense in their eyes.
You have to forget how we look at things, they have labour by the bucket load.
I would think the adage of you pay for what you get comes into play here.
Imagine the cost of a hand made tank in the UK or States, an Egli tank would be
possibly thousands and the sam amount of skill would be needed for a Commando
tank.
Having been to India their skill and above all their enthusiasm is obvious however
in many cases the equipment and material doesnt come so high. I agree the top of the
tank looks OK but to get the underside "re-done" would be costly. If you have an
"out of sight out of mind metality" then its fits the bill, but having seen the way
potential buyers go over machines with a fine tooth comb it might cause problems
when you sell.
Andy
PS I have nothing against Indian and Eastern product, if all of was removed from my
Swedish Volvo it would not run
Imagine the cost of a hand made tank in the UK or States, an Egli tank would be
possibly thousands and the sam amount of skill would be needed for a Commando
tank.
Having been to India their skill and above all their enthusiasm is obvious however
in many cases the equipment and material doesnt come so high. I agree the top of the
tank looks OK but to get the underside "re-done" would be costly. If you have an
"out of sight out of mind metality" then its fits the bill, but having seen the way
potential buyers go over machines with a fine tooth comb it might cause problems
when you sell.
Andy
PS I have nothing against Indian and Eastern product, if all of was removed from my
Swedish Volvo it would not run
Singh is still missing in action. I've continued to send him emails and messages to his regular contact [[Broken Link Removed]] [[Broken Link Removed]] Also, to his Facebook Page [https://www.facebook.com/precisions.singh]
Not a single response since he informed me several months ago he had been Ill but is 100% back, taking orders, delivering products etc. However, thus far he has only responded to this forum via Dave. Singh maintains he lost his old User ID and PW for Access Norton. He has requested a new ID and PW several times but still has no access.
Regardless, I have decided I have waited for him for a long long time and been fair. However, there are issues of communication, delivery and such. I wish him the best and I'm moving on.
SvenSven
--->FJ
Not a single response since he informed me several months ago he had been Ill but is 100% back, taking orders, delivering products etc. However, thus far he has only responded to this forum via Dave. Singh maintains he lost his old User ID and PW for Access Norton. He has requested a new ID and PW several times but still has no access.
Regardless, I have decided I have waited for him for a long long time and been fair. However, there are issues of communication, delivery and such. I wish him the best and I'm moving on.
SvenSven
--->FJ
Lastly .. if you see most of his own posts on his Facebook site they are dated by at least 6 months. Most have been posted between May - August 2014, nothing newer. Ironically, 'new posts' are from customers asking Singh to contact them with missing orders and requesting a response for status etc. Not good.
Why is the world like this....? [Rhetorical question!}
SvenSven
--->FJ
Why is the world like this....? [Rhetorical question!}
SvenSven
--->FJ
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