Going Racing

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storm42 said:
Hi Al,. it is a five speed TTI, I was advised to go for the extra heavy duty 5 speed when I mentioned I wanted to go racing on the roads.
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When I was buying the 6 speed box from Bruce, I asked him whether it would cop 80 BHP. He said it would, easily. But you are pulling two guys and a much heavier bike. The TTI box is a lot longer than a standard Norton box, so the gears are almost as wide, and the materials are probably better.
 
acotrel said:
But you are pulling two guys and a much heavier bike. The TTI box is a lot longer than a standard Norton box, so the gears are almost as wide, and the materials are probably better.
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No he’s not, and no he’s not.

There’s handling the power and there’s handling the power though.

A serious racer is happy if it handles the power but needs replacing every season.

Lesser mortals (like me) want their £3k+ gearboxes to last a bit longer.
 
Fast Eddie said:
No he’s not, and no he’s not.

There’s handling the power and there’s handling the power though.

A serious racer is happy if it handles the power but needs replacing every season.

Lesser mortals (like me) want their £3k+ gearboxes to last a bit longer.
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I thought he was racing a sidecar - not a solo ? Quaife 6 speed boxes were used in 50 BHP Manx Nortons in the 1950s and 1960s - another 15 BHP is not a big stretch, if the bike is about the same weight Although I must admit that a 6 speed box was usually only fitted to a 350 Manx, so we might be talking 40 BHP. A TTI box should be better than a Quafe considering the steel which was available back then. Most of it would have probably been pretty dirty, because there was no vacuum degassing back then . Most gear failures are probably due to sulphur and phosphorus inclusions in the steel, particularly when bar stock is used as the basis in manufacturing. I think Bruce would be right on top of those sorts of details.
 
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Considering Super Nero probably used a Norton box, a TTI box should be able to cop a pretty big beating. One thing I always do - if I want to raise the overall gearing, I add a tooth to the engine sprocket, then if it is too high, I lower the gearing on the countershaft and rear sprockets. It makes the gearbox turn faster, so the internal loads are less.
 
Al, like Nigel says, I have a 78bhp solo, I think the confusion comes from a thread by champy72 about the best gearing for speed that I commented on.
 
Got it ! I thought you were the guy with the sidecar. Can you post a photo of your bike, or is there one here already ?
 
acotrel said:
Got it ! I thought you were the guy with the sidecar. Can you post a photo of your bike, or is there one here already ?
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There are, page 5 of this thread has 3, I will take a static one tomorrow for you.
 
What I really like is that guys such as yourself are still doing this stuff with old bikes. In Australia, it is becoming steadily less possible. The fees and charges are ridiculous. When I was racing as a kid, I could race with almost no money. Motorcycling Australia runs Broadford Bonanza each year. Lot's of guys bring very interesting bikes, but the entry fees and costs of paying for shelter in one of their sheds is horrendous. There are no races, only fast parades. In effect, if you go there you pay a motza to provide the entertainment.
 
That sounds like what we have been doing this weekend at the Beezumph, a club (TR3OC) organised event that is a bike rally with track access on the Friday. Not racing but you can go as fast as you like and there are some really nice bikes at these events.

The track last weekend was Cadwell park which is one of Britains best tracks for most, they even run BSB there. I have done a bit of video for you to look at (sorry Nigel, one got past:(). Just after dinner there was a small parade which included an MV 500 3 cylinder as ridden by Ago, a couple of Trident based bikes, a space framed Norton and an ex Carlos Checa world super bike, that last bike is what I am chasing in the vid, why it was out with us I will never know but nice to be on track with it. Good job Carlos wasn't on it though.

I know it isn't racing, but the enjoyment factor is high.

Home made and very trick, notice the concentric chain.

Going Racing


Metal Malarky, Just right. No isolastics.

Going Racing




When we got up the next morning, it was like stepping back in time, the classic sports car meeting for the weekend was in full swing, I didn't know most of this stuff was still around let alone being raced. The place stunk of money though, and they were dropping oil everywhere, If the commentators were to comment on the oil they would have said it was a poor show, not that it would have been on their radar, at one point they were trying to justify £30 corkage in a restaurant, and this was over the tannoy. Nobs.

Going Racing


There was a full grid of these things. This one was pissing fuel because the float was stuck, that is how it went out. :mad:

Going Racing


Home made, 4.2ltr V twin, 1800 max rpm (Google Thunderbug Car)

Going Racing


Going Racing


Who knows

Going Racing


Don't know what this is either. Nice though.

Going Racing


 
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The 500 pissing fuel...the ignorant pillock needs to know he was risking his life. That orange circle above the #67 means he is running Methanol! No one would have noticed him burning to a crisp until it was too late!
 
storm42 said:
know it isn't racing, but the enjoyment fact
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Sorry I didn't get to see you, had to go home Friday morning.
The Metal Malarky Commando belongs to a good mate of mine, 270 crank etc etc. It's in Classic bike soon.
sam
 
SteveA said:
The 500 pissing fuel...the ignorant pillock needs to know he was risking his life. That orange circle above the #67 means he is running Methanol! No one would have noticed him burning to a crisp until it was too late!
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Well spotted, I hadn't noticed the orange, the guy in the car was just warming it up, someone else got in to drive it. It makes my piss boil, we, the bikers have to (and quite rightly) have oil catch trays for safety, that lot couldn't have cared less, and it would be a lot easier and less obtrusive to fit a catch tank to the cars. I know it was raining and that makes the oil look worse but it was still there and on a race track to me that is unacceptable.

This was just the bottom of the mountain.

 
trident sam said:
Sorry I didn't get to see you, had to go home Friday morning.
The Metal Malarky Commando belongs to a good mate of mine, 270 crank etc etc. It's in Classic bike soon.
sam
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Ah, I did look for you. That bike is stunning, the more you look at it the more it draws you in and it is just so right.
 
'
I know it isn't racing, but the enjoyment factor is high.'

Take care ! - When you race, you are more focussed. I don't know how many times I have seen guys crash at race meetings on their way back to the pits after a race has finished. They inadvertently sail past the braking point and then grab a handful of brake too late and down they go.
Even when I ride at a practice session, I always try to ride at race speed. Taking your time and touring around a race circuit is dangerous. You need to keep concentrating or you can get caught out.
 
storm42 said:
Will have to be quicker in the race in September. :)
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Maybe, but 1 minute 50 is a class winning lap time for a big classic twin!

Personally, the only times I was reliably under 2 mins was riding a GSXR750!
 
SteveA said:
Maybe, but 1 minute 50 is a class winning lap time for a big classic twin!

Personally, the only times I was reliably under 2 mins was riding a GSXR750!
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10 seconds, don't know where I would find that :( .

What is a fair lap time for Gedinne?
 
storm42 said:
10 seconds, don't know where I would find that :( .

What is a fair lap time for Gedinne?
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Ask Graham Williams! Or Gary Thwaites. And ask George Hogton how you get under 1:40 on a 750 triple?

My big problem with Cadwell for me is that I rode it a lot in the '70s, I find it hard to improve on what I was doing back then, sort of 'muscle memory' driven....

Watching your video you can buy some bits of time everywhere, but mainly at Copse, go in much deeper and faster, finding a line into the Gooseneck from Chris Curve, the hairpin and Barn! Just to terrify yourself, Jamie Whitham used to say he hit max rpm in top on a superbike on the approach to the Gooseneck!

I wouldn't set any targets for Geddine, just to improve each session like at Chimay. It isn't the sort of place to rush. Arrive too quickly somewhere and it will hurt.

Given a choice I would go there rather than Cadwell. But new adventure at Pau Arnos for me when you are at Cadwell.
 
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