European Formula 750

This might interest you guys. It looks to me like the two strokes killed off the four strokes in European F750, then gave the game away. Perhaps race class designers should take technology into consideration ?:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NNkdZSg-m0M

If my memory serves correct Pat and Barry were on 500s in the '77 Race of the Year. Everyone else was on 750s. We had the 500s going nearly as fast or faster than the XR23s (680s) end of '77 and were much more interested in focusing on developing them for the GPs. I believe Pat broke Steve Baker's lap record on the OW31 the previous year by a wide margin. We had pretty much lost all interest in F750 midway thru the '77 season and eventually stopped going to F750 races, as did a number of other riders. The number of GPs was increasing every year and there just wasn't time or resources to compete in both GPs and F750. Following the last GP of '77 (the British GP at Silverstone, which Pat won), all the riders met with the FIM and asked that F750 be killed for that reason. Barry did a great job of representing the riders at that meeting, which was held in a large auditorium. The FIM concurred and that was the end of F750.

It seems sad to me that two strokes were ever allowed to run off the same race grids as fourstrokes, in all the classes in the old days. If they had been kept separate right from the beginning, we'd have really lovely race classes these days, with great spectator appeal. It was obvious right back then that the two strokes would beat everything by miles, however the question must be asked - where are they now ? I don't believe you can even buy a factory built two stroke road racer these days ? In the mean time, bikes with technology similar to commandos and aircooled ducatis etc. are nowhere - dead and gone forever.

Thinking you are mumbling and crying into your beer alone on this one, Aco.
You can't change history, retrospectively even.
And all these eras are associated with all the folks and heroes who were in them, so you can't take away their lives out of the equation.

Maybe you should take up those lawn bowls, and let us ENJOY our motorcycles and motorcycling.
Your Seeley could be made into a wicked road bike ?!

I think money and greed is what always ruined motorsports, whenever it became about making money is when it suffers, just like anything else. In the end the motorcycle manufacturers and others using it to make money end up the losers because they kill what is real or genuine about it and real enthusiasts lose interest.

Whenever racers and riders have had a voice in racing it has always been of benefit to all, but usually they are trumped by the factories and sponsors interests, and anyone else that is making a buck off it.

Class C racing in the USA was initially successful because it was about making it easy for people to race on bikes that had everything to do with production machines. The more time that went by though, the less it had to do with riders and production bikes, it ended up being GP racing, in the 70s racing TZ750s was what it had morphed into, the winner Yamaha had spent the most money on race bikes and riders, it was about money. 2-strokes had a very short time on center stage, coming into their own in the late 60s as light, fast machines. They made great racers but they were not practical street bikes simply because they were dirty and got poor fuel economy compared to 4-strokers.

In the 50s and 60s a poor but resourceful boy could still qualify in the USA AMA or in European GP on a production bike like the Triumph T100 Manx, G50 or look at the Drixton Honda 450 or TZ250. That all went out the window after the 60s.

I folowed GP and Superbike racing until the mid-90s. The GP racing had absolutely nothing to do with production bikes or the common man. In the early 90s you could conceivably buy a GSXR, ZX7RR or RC30 and at least qualify in superbike, that is dead now too I am sure. Some racers started getting a bad attitude too, I remember Scott Russell whining about 'backmarkers" getting in his way, which was bullshit. If it were not for the dozens of amateur riders in racing, it would not exist. No one would want to watch a Daytona 200 with only the 6 fastest riders allowed in it, or only one rider.

The same sort of thing happened to vintage racing in the USA, if you look at the 500-750cc drum-brake classes that are supposed to represent the Golden Age of racing from WWII through the 60s, you can count the number of entries in a class on Five fingers, in the country that sucked up 80% of all motorcycle production during that era.

The problem with hobby motorcycle racing in the U.S. has everything to do with the economy.

The average Joe can no longer afford to drive cross-country just to go play.

That, and the old tracks going away.

...and the new tracks wanting ridiculous money to rent for the weekend.

It's the same here GP.
Easier and cheaper to hang plates on them and ride to the hills for cheap fun.
Graeme

It cost me a ton of money to do 4 road trips in 2008, all for a few chunks of silkscreened particle board.

...but I had the time of my life!

I'm also finding myself in the situation where I cannot afford to race. I was in exactly that place when I was a kid, and still did it. What it takes is to have the will to do what it takes to have fun, and become resourceful. It's a different mentality to what we've become used to. I'm 71 and seriously looking for work, I want to live rather than merely exist, and I will go down fighting. I have a few options - some intellectual, and I will try to exploit them to the max. My Seeley 850 is currently keeping me alive, in the face of severe family difficulties.

I've still got the will, the bike, and the ability, I just don't have the time and/or money.

It might have something to do with having an 8-year-old and a 3-year-old, plus a wyfe that doesn't race, and a list of chores that gets longer every time I look at it (so i stopped looking at it).

Thats what everyone out racing is getting away from ??!!
Including the missus going too...

Did I really say that.

I quote " My Seely 850 is currently keeping me alive "... I can truely relate to those words acotrel. I hadn't had a bike in ten years & was in the late stages of a failing relationship that had made my life a joyless dull affair when one night I had the good scense to look at some used old bike just for fun and found what I thought was my own old BSA Shooting Star up for sale so I bought it! It was a great way to come back to life & that of coarse led to me needing another Norton for longer rides & that led to me rekindling the joy of being alive and several new good friends. And what goes around comes around, the fact that I was riding again brought new joy to a very close friend who enjoys rthe same type of rides & that gave him the desire to " go down fighting " through what could sadly be termanal cancer. My bikes have truely given me the joy of life through some of the hardest years... In years. I hope you keep racing & if not put that bad dragon on the street.. I hope my friend & I live & can ride at 71 ( only 11 years off for him but 19 for me. Sure hop IF I'm alive I can still ride as you are!!! All power to you brother, ride on. Glenn.

DITTO !!!!

graeme

I remarried 12 years ago and emerged from the darkness. I find it difficult to re member much about my previous. However I do remember how good it felt when I raced, and when I used to go surf fishing. There is life after divorce, however at some time in your life , you have to do something just for yourself. I've had 14 marvelous years which I never expected, however now I am facing the same old problem I had as a kid - lack of the readies, and the desire to race again.

Divorce was one of the best things that ever happened to me.

I didn't believe in God until my ex told me she wanted a divorce. I don't hate her, she was severely belted by her father, an ex-serviceman who, as an 18 year old was involved in stopping the Japanese at Kokoda in New Guinea - suffered from PTSD. He didn't make it any easier for me living with that legacy for 32 years. I understand the reason behind mental treatment she handed out, however it is still extremely difficult to forgive.