crank triggered ignition

Is there such a thing as a crank triggered electronic ignition for a Commando where I could still use the alternator?

Check these links
http://www.rexcauntracing.com/pages/contact.html
http://www.ignitech.cz/en/

Regards Mike

Try Electrexworld.co.uk

Jim Commstock was doing something a while back I think .

There is a Boyer Micro Power crank triggered "racing" set.

I found it very fussy and gave up on it.

If its for road use Electrex world do a unit:

STK-102D- Digital Lighting/Ignition Alternator Kit


£235.00 / €298.45

BSA: A50, A65
Royal Enfield: Interceptor
Triumph: 3TA, 5TA, T100, T110, T120
Norton: Commando, Atlas, Dominator - STK102D

Steve Maney lists one on his web site. No idea if this is compatible with an alternator though...

Hi.
Jim has delivered an MSD ignition system to me. And this are a quality item!
There are possibilities for two separate ignition curves and it's easily to switch between these with a switch (this is smart to have during dyno testing). I've palace min under the fuel tank.
Jim delivered with an ignition curves that give the engine some more hp, but it's easy to create new curves with a laptop. The speed limiter is easy to adjust. Ignition is very stable and does not kick back at the start. Bike starts 1 or 2 kicks cold and 1 warm.

I had to create space for the hall vane sensor within the original cover. What I did was go over to double (duplex) chain from Andy (another quality product that I would recommend to anyone) and moved the alternator so close the sprocket as possible. Then I made a steel disk with recess to trigg the hall vane sensor and of course a mounting bracket for the sensor.



In the future, I'll switch to belt on the primary and then I get a new challenge, but this challenge I will gladly take. For this is the ignition system I will use in the future and I would recommend it to anyone who has the opportunity to make adjustments yourself or ask Jim nice if he can do this for them.

peter12 said:

If its for road use Electrex world do a unit:

STK-102D- Digital Lighting/Ignition Alternator Kit


£235.00 / €298.45

BSA: A50, A65
Royal Enfield: Interceptor
Triumph: 3TA, 5TA, T100, T110, T120
Norton: Commando, Atlas, Dominator - STK102D

Click to expand...

This looks very interesting, I'm wonder if there's a provision for strobe timing as the destructions don't make it clear... anyone have experience with this kit?

http://www.electrexworld.co.uk/acatalog ... r_Kit.html

A friend of mine fitted a crank triggered ignition system off a VT750 to a Ducati 750 SS. He said it advanced up very nicely after he had spent a lot of time fiddling with the triggers. He said the bike ran much smoother when the ignition advanced and retarded.

You need to see that its secuely secured securely . thingo's in NZ was not , and he got a postively ventilated crankcase as the bottom end expolded .

thought we'd better mention it .

The Electrex world crank triggered setup has a very small output for lighting

gripper said:

The Electrex world crank triggered setup has a very small output for lighting

Click to expand...

This is what I've found as well

65 watt single phase is not going to keep a proper headlight going and it's not cheap.

gripper said:

65 watt single phase is not going to keep a proper headlight going and it's not cheap.

Click to expand...

It might light an LED.

Kvinnhering said:

I had to create space for the hall vane sensor within the original cover.

Click to expand...

Interesting setup, I'm tinkering with something similar but I'm trying to put the steel disc between the sprocket and the crankcase and modify the inner primary.

I'm surprised that the Hall sensor isn't disturbed by the alternator at this position. Good to know.

In the future, I'll switch to belt on the primary and then I get a new challenge, but this challenge I will gladly take.

Click to expand...

If you use a Gates Carbon GT (like CNW does in their new design) the challenge will be rather manageable.


Tim

One of the nicest crank triggered setups I've seen was on Martin Adams Commonwealth Norton racer. It was made for him by Mistral Engineering (who have recently ceased business, I think) back in the mid '80s. It used a Hall Effect sensor, much like the one Jim used for his setup) and was triggered by a similar large gap in a steel disk fitted as the inner flange on the crank pulley for the belt drive. The sensor was mounted to a slotted bracket held to the crankcase by small screws. The race bike didn't have an alternator, but the system could have been used with one, as long as the belt drive allowed for an alternator.

You can see the sensor and trigger wheel in this picture, although the detail is a little fuzzy. Taken back before we all had high res cameras.



The electronics was a Lucas box from the period, but I don't recall which one. One of the nicest features of the system was a test box that could be used to set the timing statically. It had a small indicator light that came on when the sensor was triggered as the cranks was turned by hand.

Interesting story about it's installation. Martin told me that when he got the system from the main man at Mistral (sorry, I've forgotten the name), it included the dimensions for the trigger wheel, so he made one out of aluminum to save weight. He was embarrassed to discover that it didn't work, and was told he needed a ferrous material to trigger the sensor. He made another one out of steel, and it worked just fine.

Ken

Thank for positive comment Tintin .
I haven't tried ordinary Hall sensor, only Hall Effect Vane Senor. I took mine out of the distributor to an old Audi engine and this works OK.
VR-sensor has also been tried, but it didn't work. Ignition ran amok and the engine did not exceed 4500 RPM. There was interference from the alternator that caused this.

The Hall Effect Vane Sensor functions as image below shows.



I am unable to add PDF file with more information in her. But I can send it by e-mail to people who are interested.

To Icrken.
One of the nicest features of the system was a test box that could be used to set the timing statically. It had a small indicator light that came on when the sensor was triggered as the cranks was turned by hand.

MSD-ignition system has this feature built in as well. Very easy to set ignition static then check the ignition with the timing lamp at idle (fascinating to see how stable ignition point are). Not necessary with 4000 RPM as many other ignition systems must have.

I agree that this is a smart way to mount the sensor, but unfortunately this solution can't be fit inside original primary cover.
The sensor that is used by Marti Commonwealth must been Hall Effect Vane Sensor see in the picture above, so we understand why it had to be ferrous material (iron)

Anyone had any more experience since last post regarding Electrexworld 65w Ign/charging unit. It seems the power is split into AC and DC, Wouldnt it be better to convert it all to DC to the battery. Electrexworld are not the best at replying to questions. Then if using all LED's I think it may suffice.

2 or 3 months ago I saw a post saying Electrex were releasing a more powerful alternator output version within a month but no sign of it, even with LEDs and no ignition to power 65W seems too little unless it produces the 65W at low revs.