Commando head to barrels studs - too short?
- Thread starter Staytite
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Hi All,
Thanks very much for all the replies. Please remember we are all Norton owners
trying to sort out the issues left to us by our forebears. Some of the correspondence
is a little rude towards each other. Please show respect for each other.
I have had a fiddle with my head.....
- The studs I have a are little longer than the specification kindly given to me by Andover Norton
- The rear stud in the Commando engine I built 24 years ago nearly comes though the long nut
- Amazingly I put the rear nut on with no washer and the chamfered side towards the head.
- There is about 5/16" of thread exposed for both the sleeve nuts and the long read nut.
- I am using a composite gasket so the gasket thickness is not the problem
- there is plenty of room to put the head on with longer studs
- It is the pushrod which cause the difficulty in putting the head on
- With the rockers slackened off and with elastic bands it is fairly easy to put the head on
- The holes in the head will allow a longer threaded portion on the head end of the stud without bottoming in the hole
- The space when putting on the head will allow about 1/4' of extra thread for the nuts
- I have ordered some bolts which I will get made into longer studs.
- I will let you know how I get on......to be continued
Now....the subject of washers seems rather interesting....hopefully I will have some
space to fit washers if I want to.......comments gratefully received....
Thanks
Staytite
Thanks very much for all the replies. Please remember we are all Norton owners
trying to sort out the issues left to us by our forebears. Some of the correspondence
is a little rude towards each other. Please show respect for each other.
I have had a fiddle with my head.....
- The studs I have a are little longer than the specification kindly given to me by Andover Norton
- The rear stud in the Commando engine I built 24 years ago nearly comes though the long nut
- Amazingly I put the rear nut on with no washer and the chamfered side towards the head.
- There is about 5/16" of thread exposed for both the sleeve nuts and the long read nut.
- I am using a composite gasket so the gasket thickness is not the problem
- there is plenty of room to put the head on with longer studs
- It is the pushrod which cause the difficulty in putting the head on
- With the rockers slackened off and with elastic bands it is fairly easy to put the head on
- The holes in the head will allow a longer threaded portion on the head end of the stud without bottoming in the hole
- The space when putting on the head will allow about 1/4' of extra thread for the nuts
- I have ordered some bolts which I will get made into longer studs.
- I will let you know how I get on......to be continued
Now....the subject of washers seems rather interesting....hopefully I will have some
space to fit washers if I want to.......comments gratefully received....
Thanks
Staytite
- Joined
- Nov 20, 2004
- Messages
- 20,120
ludwig said:Back on topic :
LAB : you where eager to go and check the length of your back stud and seemed to find it adequate .
Surely the amount by wich these studs protrude from the cyl. head face can vary somewhat ( stud length , shaved head , etc ..)
But the question is , are they up to the job ?
I challenge you ( and every one else with std fitted studs ) to do the following test :
Make a torque wrench like this :
It is easy to make and likely more accurate than any cheap Chinese torque wrench .
It does not have to look exactly like this , but I am shure you understand the principle .
Use your imagination .
Put it on each of your stud nuts .
With a lever length of 50 cm pull to 8 kg on the scale .
Or maybe easier for you : lever length 2 ft and pull 15 lbs .
( torque = 30 ft/lbs , or 4.15 kgm )
Keep it there for 10 secs , or the time to take a picture .
Do it as 'specified ' by the book : loosen the nut first , then tighten .
actually you should oil the threads , but let's not make it too difficult .
(maybe spray some WD40 on the nut ..)
I showed you mine , now show me yours ..
I invite everyone interested ( aren't we all? ) to do the same .
Waiting for the pictures ..
TODAY
FINALLY! (it's a l-o-n-g story - the details of which I shan't bore you with) I was able to torque test the nuts/studs - all of which successfully held a constant 30 ft. lbs. (15 lb. @ 2 ft.) without drama or any studs pulling out. There are no photos-so you will just have to take my word for it, in any case, if I intended to deceive, then I could have easily faked the photos.
Hi All,
I have my new longer studs back from the engineers, but have not had time to fit them.
Sadly, the chores tomorrow include decorating the Christmas tree and going to the pantomime....not too bad then!
Might even fit in a few beers as well.
However, I was just wondering what they did in the works or what the professionals such as Mick Hemmings, Norman White
and Norvill do to tighten their nuts!. A normal torque wrench will not fit as there is not enough space. Perhaps they
and the works in the 70's used a similar system to that proposed by Ludwig. I have used a similar system
for decades, but usually a straight spanner and a spring gauge. But it seems strange that the works and professionals
would use a similar system.
Hi Ludwig,
Do you come form Belgium?
I lived there many years ago, but had to leave or I would have had to buy a Harley....The Belgium beer and chocolate,
although fantastic, was not good for my waistline!!!
Cheers
Staytite
I have my new longer studs back from the engineers, but have not had time to fit them.
Sadly, the chores tomorrow include decorating the Christmas tree and going to the pantomime....not too bad then!
Might even fit in a few beers as well.
However, I was just wondering what they did in the works or what the professionals such as Mick Hemmings, Norman White
and Norvill do to tighten their nuts!. A normal torque wrench will not fit as there is not enough space. Perhaps they
and the works in the 70's used a similar system to that proposed by Ludwig. I have used a similar system
for decades, but usually a straight spanner and a spring gauge. But it seems strange that the works and professionals
would use a similar system.
Hi Ludwig,
Do you come form Belgium?
I lived there many years ago, but had to leave or I would have had to buy a Harley....The Belgium beer and chocolate,
although fantastic, was not good for my waistline!!!
Cheers
Staytite
- Joined
- Nov 20, 2004
- Messages
- 20,120
Staytite said:
Mick Hemmings says in his NOC engine restoration DVD as he tightens down the head: "...and you don't need a torque wrench-just use good spanners and tighten them [the nuts] sensibly...". He goes on to say: "......these front ones, don't go too heavy on them, 'cause it's common for them to strip, problem is, there's more thread in the head than there is on the stud"
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