Another kind of glue, please

pierodn · May 7, 2013

I used the Wellseal to match the two engine crankcase valves.
I am not satisfied and I'm worried.
The wellseal after a month is still sticky and I fear that when the engine will be hot and under pressure.
Now I have another engine to match and would like to use another glue.
Please I would like to receive suggestions on which new glue use.
Ciao.
Piero

guest76 · May 7, 2013

Wellseal is a non-set sealer, so will never go off.

Great for rocker boxes, inspection covers etc... but not what I would recommend for crank case halves that will be continually immersed in oil.

For the crank case, I use Loctite 5699 Premium Silicon Sealer - it sets up, but remains a little flexible so won't go brittle.
It is a nice grey colour, so doesn't look terrible.
Temperature resistance seems pretty good too!

Peter R · May 7, 2013

If you use a silicone sealer, make sure you apply it in a very thin layer.
You may get a lot of different answers to your question, personally I prefer Loctite 510 for this application.

L.A.B. · May 7, 2013

pierodn said:
I used the Wellseal to match the two engine crankcase valves.
I am not satisfied and I'm worried.
The wellseal after a month is still sticky and I fear that when the engine will be hot and under pressure.

Yes, it always remains sticky and soft, but I think you are worrying over nothing as the Wellseal will not melt or blow out, and it is what many professionals use and recommend.

gtiller said:
Great for rocker boxes, inspection covers etc... but not what I would recommend for crank case halves that will be continually immersed in oil.

Having used Wellseal on many such crankcase joints without any subsequent leakage whatsoever I can only disagree with that.
Excess Wellseal can easily be removed from the joint afterwards with thinners, petrol, etc..

madass140 · May 7, 2013

I'm a 3 Bond man, I think originally Yamaha. its not like silicone and can be wiped of as L.A.B said with thinners,
and coz its grey in color you can never see its existence, I'd never use silicone.
when I was very young and in to Triumphs, a well known Triumph tuner Alan Chance who I'm very grateful to
said that (and he was referring to Triumph engine builds) that silicone ( which back then was only available in toothpaste type tubes) should only be given to motorcycle mechanics on prescription. back then the bodgers thought that this new black stuff would cure all their oil leaks , it would end up creating one big leak via a hole in the crankcase due to oil pump failure due to little black balls of silicone stuck in the ball valve/seats.
Alan Chance taught me a lot.

DogT · May 7, 2013

Hylomar Blue Racing Formula works good, it's a bit hard to put on because acetone is the thinner. I put it on right out of the tube. I think it's made by Permatex. Not cheap at $13 for a little over an oz, but it will do a whole bike. It won't last long in the tube once opened.

But like L.A.B. says, you are probably worrying too much.

Dave
69S

pierodn · May 7, 2013

Dear All,
Thanks a lot.
Ciao.
Piero

Throber · May 7, 2013

I have used ordinary epoxy two pack glue to join cases on Triumph's, BSA's etc, and never had a leak. Just the regular stuff you get at the hard ware store for fixing broken things about the house. Use the 6 hour cure version.
When you need to split the cases a sharp tap on one case with a rawhide mallet will crack the joint ( behave ) and they will come apart. Like splitting a Coconut.
A side benefit is that some epoxy will get into the bolt holes, those bolts won't vibrate lose.
Radical, maybe. But it works.
Clean the mating surfaces with paint thinners to remove any oily substance prior to applying sealant.
And don't oil the bolt thread's.
Use APR assembly stuff.

Matt Spencer · May 7, 2013

There was a story of a certain drongo who was being sought by a notorious pack of hoodlums ,for assembling their engines with Ayraldite . :lol:

No Leaks . Permanently fixed securely , undismantleably . :lol: :lol: :shock:

In N.Z. the Brit Bike outfit in the big smoke used PLIOBOND with excellent results , & reputation - as gasket sealant / Joint mateing compound .

Intresting , as its a useless glue as a adheshive . The old weap behind the base flange takes about 10.000 miles to appear with this , if the joimts
are all cleaned with solvent , such as acetone .

Throber · May 7, 2013

Matt,
I wonder who that drongo was mate ?
I was living in London, UK when I did my bikes with epoxy. I never used Araldite.
It comes apart with a sharp whack with a rawhide mallet. I know cause I had to rebuild the damn things frequently.
I will ask my Bikie mates over hear who did their bikes back then. Most of the old bastards are dead or not feeling too well.
Which bike shop did the Brit bike work over here ? White's ? Wankers !
Most of them were useless cause the mechanics hated Brit bikes, knew nothing, didn't care.
My current Norton was worked on by a well known mechanic prior to my buying it. He did shit work if ever a shit job was done. I have the receipts and the shit results of the shit job to prove it. I think he is hiding from me for some reason.

concours · May 9, 2013

madass140 said:
I'm a 3 Bond man, I think originally Yamaha. its not like silicone and can be wiped of as L.A.B said with thinners,
and coz its grey in color you can never see its existence, I'd never use silicone.
when I was very young and in to Triumphs, a well known Triumph tuner Alan Chance who I'm very grateful to
said that (and he was referring to Triumph engine builds) that silicone ( which back then was only available in toothpaste type tubes) should only be given to motorcycle mechanics on prescription. back then the bodgers thought that this new black stuff would cure all their oil leaks , it would end up creating one big leak via a hole in the crankcase due to oil pump failure due to little black balls of silicone stuck in the ball valve/seats.
Alan Chance taught me a lot.

+1

I just took apart a T140 I assembled with Yamabond 3 over 30 years ago. Still leak free.

Hobot · May 9, 2013

Run your Norton hot and hard enough and may find the grey soft clay like stuff becomes more like dry compressed clay that fractures to leaks but remains in place. The tarry stuff gets so thin a hot hard run Norton can flap its seams apart enough to leak in places but rest of the tar glues parts together risking seams to pry apart. I've become a Hylomar and cotton thread sealer now. If engine not wrung out into elastic cartoon character state then most any sealer should do it.
Air craft go through more thermal size changes than our engines so its worth reviewing what they do and use.

Brithit · May 9, 2013

I like Yamabond, or its alternative. I have things clean, ready to join. Then, I paint it on with a small artist's brush. It's kind of stringy, and with that method, I feel I can kind of control the mess. If you apply on the middle of the case joint, it flows out to the edges. I just have plenty of stuff around to clean up the mess - clean rags, solvents, etc. It's never let me down.

comnoz · May 9, 2013

I use Yamabond or the generic equivalent 3 bond. It makes the cases a bitch to take apart but they will never leak. Jim

Bernhard · May 10, 2013

Matt Spencer said:
There was a story of a certain drongo who was being sought by a notorious pack of hoodlums ,for assembling their engines with Ayraldite . :lol:

No Leaks . Permanently fixed securely , undismantleably . :lol: :lol: :shock:

In N.Z. the Brit Bike outfit in the big smoke used PLIOBOND with excellent results , & reputation - as gasket sealant / Joint mateing compound .

Intresting , as its a useless glue as a adheshive . The old weap behind the base flange takes about 10.000 miles to appear with this , if the joimts
are all cleaned with solvent , such as acetone .

If you find your crankcases stuck with araldite adhesive, a common method of softening it is to heat it with a plumbers blowtorch.

swooshdave · May 10, 2013

comnoz said:
I use Yamabond or the generic equivalent 3 bond. It makes the cases a bitch to take apart but they will never leak. Jim

I cringed when i read the epoxy comment. :shock:

http://www.bikebandit.com/threebond-liquid-gasket-1194

Hobot · May 10, 2013

Yeah man Swoohie I've had a 2/3 full tube of that since 2001 and just can't bring myself to use any more of it - on about anything one might consider it in the gearhead stuff common to keep up a dozen acres of homestead. Among those impliments I've come across hardened tar seams that risked the sealing surface to clean off.

Someone should come up with an electrolytic-lyiss goop that set up with one level of current flowed through it and breaks down with even more, so it bonds to the surface metal yet retains some compliance for the lip curling vibes of full bogey joy.

Another kind of glue, please

pierodn

guest76

Guest

Peter R

L.A.B.

Moderator

madass140

DogT

pierodn

Throber

Matt Spencer

Throber

concours

Hobot

Brithit

comnoz

Bernhard

swooshdave

Hobot

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