ABS Benefit?

That is interesting, thanks for posting.

There is no doubt at all in my mind that this is due to ‘Risk Compensation Factor’. This effects everything and always has to be taken into account... but seldom is. Politicians don’t like to as they like the “look at me I’m doing something” headlines. And they’ll keep hiring different statisticians until one finds a way of proving a benefit.

Cut back the foliage to increase visibility... no brainer right? Got to improve safety? Not necessarily, folk will just go faster.

Lower the speed limits? Folk will concentrate less.

Fit speed bumps? People accelerate and brake harder in between.

Fit speed cameras? People go fast everywhere else and slam brakes on ‘for the camera’.

Fit ABS? Folk will brake harder and later (ie go faster), they will also disassociate bad weather with the need for greater care.

Fit traction control (and wheelie control on bikes)? Folk will simply learn to gas it FULL everywhere in the knowledge that the computer will protect them. Irrespective of the conditions. Manufacturers will also make products that would previously have been considered too powerful and dangerous.

I was told by an automotive industry guy in 1992 that ABS is a performance aid and not a safety aid. I don’t get him at all, but I do now.

I forget who it was who first said that IF governments were serious about road safety they would outlaw all on board safety features (inc seatbelts etc) and make it compulsory to fit a razor sharp 12” steel spike in the centre of the steering wheel.... just imagine how slowly and carefully we’d all drive then!

Risk Compensation Factor is at the root of why motorcyclists used to single about Volvo drivers as the most dangerous, because Volvo drivers felt the safest... and drove accordingly. Volvo drivers may have been replaced in this regard by SUV drivers... but the issue is the same.

Still doubtful? Ride your favourite road in full armoured leathers, back protector, air vest etc. Then ride it again in nothing but swimming trunks with no helmet. And note how much slower you are...
 
I saw this comment below the article, says it all

I have a bike fitted with abs and I can say from personal experience that they DO help! what these studies do NOT show is the near misses that never get reported for example I have been travelling along when the car in front of me has stopped suddenly so I have had to emergency stop and I have felt the abs kick in and was able to stop in time. How ever if I did not have the abs I am sure I would have locked up and gone straight into the car in front so would have ended up as one of the statistics. But because of the abs I have not.

The ABS saved him from his own stupidity, you always leave a distance between you and the vehicle in front so if they brake suddenly you can stop safely, its called the 2 second rule.
 
I was also thinking of the steel spike on the steering wheel remark when I read this article. Was it a bit within comedian Eddie Izzard's routine?

This all makes my case for "downgrading" my current modern car (Mini Countryman) to a classic Mini Cooper with no safety features other than seatbelts. I'll be safer in it :D
 
Tornado said:
I was also thinking of the steel spike on the steering wheel remark when I read this article. Was it a bit within comedian Eddie Izzard's routine?

This all makes my case for "downgrading" my current modern car (Mini Countryman) to a classic Mini Cooper with no safety features other than seatbelts. I'll be safer in it :D
Click to expand...
I was considering the same before I bought my modern (2018) Mini Cooper. I had a test drive in a classic Mini Cooper and nostalgia makes you forget... the ride is harsher than I remembered ( I had a mini in the 80s) and getting in and out at an older age is not quite as easy/fun as it used to be!
 
Eljahara said:
I was considering the same before I bought my modern (2018) Mini Cooper. I had a test drive in a classic Mini Cooper and nostalgia makes you forget... the ride is harsher than I remembered ( I had a mini in the 80s) and getting in and out at an older age is not quite as easy/fun as it used to be!
Click to expand...

The one I'm considering had recently been upgraded with coil springs and High-Low adjustables to replace the much harsher/wear-prone rubber cone suspension. Never had a real mini in the past so no nostalgia for the old days to compare with. My reasoning is to get away from the "black-box" of the modern Countryman, which is now almost ten years old. Working perfectly but I'm very weary of it starting to have issues down the road that I cannot address myself. Even swapping the battery out took me hours of researching how to remove all the ancillaries...there is no published service manual for it so you're at the mercy of the dealerships and all the joy that $150/hr labour rates can bring you. Plus, the 10 foot length of the classic will mean I can fit two bikes and the mini in my single parking spot and still have room to fettle with them.
 
There is definitely a lot to be said for the “keep it simple stupid” mantra - as is evidenced by the issues (electronic) with the 961. I had my mini serviced last week for the first time, the technician sat about 2 metres from the car and used a computer to identify what needed to be done, in addition to oil and filter change so I know where you are coming from
Just think how we will cope when the entire vehicle is electronic!
 
My Ducati is 11 yrs old , it has the usual ECU engine management and abs .... so far no issues , a friend has a 2014 BMW GT 800 , no manual available for it and zero fuses to be found anywhere on the bike .... that is cause for worries .... I got shop manual for Duc online and lots of fuses in use .....
 
Think I'll fit one soon:

ABS Benefit?
 
kommando said:
I have a bike fitted with abs and I can say from personal experience that they DO help! what these studies do NOT show is the near misses that never get reported for example I have been travelling along when the car in front of me has stopped suddenly so I have had to emergency stop and I have felt the abs kick in and was able to stop in time. How ever if I did not have the abs I am sure I would have locked up and gone straight into the car in front so would have ended up as one of the statistics. But because of the abs I have not.

The ABS saved him from his own stupidity, you always leave a distance between you and the vehicle in front so if they brake suddenly you can stop safely, its called the 2 second rule.
Click to expand...

I disagree. I ride very safely and always keep a safe distance between me and any other vehicles around. I value my life more than I value riding unsafely. My Triumph has ABS and traction control. Both have come in handy without me doing something stupid. The ABS kicked in once in much the same situation as above. Some woman didn't stop and came out of a side street and never saw me. ABS probably saved me from hitting her SUV broadside. Without it I probably would have locked up the front wheel and dumped the bike or worse!

Ride like you're naked and invisible!
 
What do you disagree with Kris? I don’t think anyone here is saying ABS has nothing good to offer (it’s saved my bacon in a car before).

What I’m saying is that it ain’t all roses, there is a very real and very big negative effect that effects the masses.

I think that good drivers / riders who drive as if they would without it, will get the benefits of it.

Trouble is, the majority of people on the road don’t seem to fall into that category...
 
KNorton said:
I disagree. I ride very safely and always keep a safe distance between me and any other vehicles around. I value my life more than I value riding unsafely. My Triumph has ABS and traction control. Both have come in handy without me doing something stupid. The ABS kicked in once in much the same situation as above. Some woman didn't stop and came out of a side street and never saw me. ABS probably saved me from hitting her SUV broadside. Without it I probably would have locked up the front wheel and dumped the bike or worse!

Ride like you're naked and invisible!
Click to expand...
The comment showed that the writer had stopped riding a safe distance or maybe never had and was using the ABS to ride closer to the vehicle in front. So in his case the ABS was not making him safer, I never said ABS did not work but pointed out it wasn't in his case. What was worse was he still wasn't aware and posted it on a public forum.
 
Safety is about managing the risks. If you are risk conscious, you don't ride a motorcycle on public roads - road racing is much safer if you want to proceed at a reasonable speed. It is a long hard road to become a competent motorcycle rider. Some idiots even use TLS brakes. You can only go as fast as you can stop. The brake on the front of my race bike is operated by my forefinger, it will stop the bike like hitting a wall, and when it is released - it lets go immediately. If it doesn't, that is when you get steered off the bitumen. When I race, I am flat strap from whoa to go.
ABS is designed to help people who are brainless.
 
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