1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

55,000 miles on a 47 Vincent

Discussion in 'Vincent' started by worntorn, Dec 14, 2018.

  1. 998cc

    998cc "Cheap" is rarely the least expensive. VIP MEMBER

    Joined:
    Oct 1, 2018
    Yes. Saw a picture of one in a magazine in 1972 and just had to have one. In the late 70's I found one, borrowed a trailer, drove just over 2200 miles in the dead of winter and became the owner of a Black Shadow three days before Christmas. Santa was good to me that year!
    ~998cc
     
  2. cjandme

    cjandme

    Joined:
    Feb 5, 2011
    Hi Glen, this is way off topic but I was wondering what your 1360 special weighs in at and how much lighter it is than this bike?
     
  3. worntorn

    worntorn

    Joined:
    Dec 22, 2006
    The Special is 348 without fuel.
    The OZ Rapide is 505 with fuel, so likely about 475 without fuel.
    It has a pannier rack and top box in place that add about 15 lbs.
    So in comparison to a stock Rapide without rack etc, the Special is about 110 pounds lighter.
    The 1000cc standard Vincent twin was a light bike back in the day.
    It's almost identical in weight to my friend's 500 cc Norton model 7.
    460 lbs even today is not a bad weight for a torquey 1000 touring bike.
    Vincent had alloy heads and cylinders in 1946 whereas Norton was all cast iron.
    Here we are in 2019 still trying to get an alloy cylinder to work well on a Norton!

    Glen
     
    Last edited: Feb 28, 2019
  4. cjandme

    cjandme

    Joined:
    Feb 5, 2011
    Nice!! Thanks Glen.
     
  5. 998cc

    998cc "Cheap" is rarely the least expensive. VIP MEMBER

    Joined:
    Oct 1, 2018
    Glen. If I may ask, what size Premiers are you running on your Vin and what jetting, slides, etc.? Stock cams? Mk II? Other? My 53 Shadow has been down for nearly three years for a complete rebuild from the ground up. I used to run Mikuni VM's since the old stock Amals were worn out. I've had the stock Amals bored with new custom slides installed.

    Today, I started the best for the first time since 2012. After a few adjustments, I took it for a short ride and love it all over again. Idling with the stock 276/289 carbs is still problematic, so I am interested in Premiers for everyday riding. Recently put a new set of Premiers on my 850 Commando--what a difference!

    ~Russ, 998cc
     
  6. Fast Eddie

    Fast Eddie VIP MEMBER

    Joined:
    Oct 4, 2013
    Russ, why not keep the Mikunis on? Vins run well on Mikunis IMHO.
     
  7. 998cc

    998cc "Cheap" is rarely the least expensive. VIP MEMBER

    Joined:
    Oct 1, 2018
    Hello Nigel. For starters, the Mikunis have been on the bike for 37 years and were never set up properly; they ran strong but on the rich side which was an "okay" compromise in those days. They are currently being tested on the T-140 as replacements for the old Bing CV's.

    For the Vin, I'd like to keep Brit on Brit as much as reasonably possible. Granted, I have converted to an Alton w/Podtronics and LED lighting which are necessary measures to keep the bike on the road--and safe. Finally, the Mikunis look very out of place and don't require the choke controls on the handlebars unless converted over. Enter the latest Amal concentric on the market--the Premier. :)

    ~998cc
     
  8. Fast Eddie

    Fast Eddie VIP MEMBER

    Joined:
    Oct 4, 2013
    Well, the Premiers are good carbs, I can’t see why they shouldn’t work.

    I have only ever run stock carbs and Mikunis on Vins. I fell out of love with the stock carbs after the bike caught fire!

    The Mikunis started, ticked over and ran brilliantly tho !

    But... they were set up by Patrick Godet on his rolling road complete with his ‘set up pipes’ with sensors in.
     
  9. worntorn

    worntorn

    Joined:
    Dec 22, 2006
    The Premieres are 28 mm, cams are Mk1, 8 to one CR. This is the same as US spec Black Shadow tune. UK Shadows were 7.3 to 1

    . I can't recall the jetting, it was an exact replacement of the old Concentrics.

    Until those carbs wore out, it was an excellent runner and very easy starter, plus very fast.
    I have another Rapide with 9 to ones, lightning cams, 2 front heads, ported to 34 mm with 34 mm Mikunis.
    It is a little harder starting and doesn't have quite as much grunt as the lower tuned bike. A bit less top end as well.


    Glen
     
  10. ericg

    ericg

    Joined:
    Aug 11, 2006
    Because this carbs are totally out of place on any British bike. And also because Amals work very well when in new or in good condition. My twin engined Norvin runs superbly with a pair of Premiers.
    We are lucky enough to have Amals still produced and improved, the old problem of rapid wear is a thing of the past now as the throttle valves are hard anodized but if nobody buy them there will be no more supply.
    Fitting oriental parts, disc brakes, Japanese clutch, etc on a Brit is a NO, NO and on Vins even less than on others and in the end where one will stop with this? Fit a pair of Showa forks, an aluminium diamond frame and a Honda engine? After all they are much better than original bits. But why not purchase a brand new Honda?
    Please note I'm not a purist as I build bitzas (Vincent Comet engine into an A10 frame at the moment) but I always try to keep in the spirit of what could have been done in the period!
    Eric
     
    Dommie Nator likes this.
  11. Fast Eddie

    Fast Eddie VIP MEMBER

    Joined:
    Oct 4, 2013
    Good for you Eric.

    This one of mine had Japanese carbs, Japanese clutch, Italian hubs, French ignition & starter. I know what you’re thinking... a shame to put French parts on... but then again it wasn’t a Brit bike... it was made in France...;) !

    FFC51775-29C6-4463-9ABF-29CE11492338.jpeg
     
  12. worntorn

    worntorn

    Joined:
    Dec 22, 2006
    Nigel , I thought that bike had a Newby clutch?

    Glen
     
  13. worntorn

    worntorn

    Joined:
    Dec 22, 2006
    BTW, British or not, many of the Vin crowd sneer at the Premieres on my Vincent.
    One felt so strongly about the "incorrect" carbs that he suggested they should be removed and then driven over with a large truck so they would be shattered into a thousand pieces.
    Another expressed amazement at how easily the bike started and how nicely it idled with " those shitty concentrics on there"
    Just shows you might as well make it the way you like it and forget about impressing others.

    Glen
     
    Last edited: Mar 3, 2019
  14. Fast Eddie

    Fast Eddie VIP MEMBER

    Joined:
    Oct 4, 2013
    You’re right Glen, it was the Rapide that had a Japanese clutch conversion. Which, for the record, wasn’t very good!
     
  15. ericg

    ericg

    Joined:
    Aug 11, 2006
    But the French parts are made on purpose for the Vincent (by my very good mate François Grosset) as well as the Alton generator from Paul Hamon and can be made virtually invisible.
    Mik's are bits from whatever Japanese brand and are warts on your beautiful Egli, Eddie.
    I've discussed this with the late Patrick, he fitted Amals concentrics on the 1000's but Mik's on the 1200's and 1330's mainly because 1000 series concentrics (that's 34 to 38mm) are no longer available and MK2's are sometimes difficult to find.
    Mine has a Vincent clutch which is so emblematic of the marque, it works superbly if you understand it and set it up properly. And I managed to find a 34mm concentric for the Comet which will be over bored to 600cc.
    Glen, a lot of owners who really use their Vins for long distance touring are using Concentrics, at least that's what I can see at VOC rallies here in Europe. They appeared on Vins as soon as they were released in 1967 as far as I know.
     
  16. Fast Eddie

    Fast Eddie VIP MEMBER

    Joined:
    Oct 4, 2013
    We all draw our lines in different places Eric. Just look at the carbs I have on my Commando (below)... you’ll hate them!

    Look at Glens disc brakes and monshock!

    When it comes to carbs, it is firmly function over form for me.

    Unless you fit TTs or GPs or Gardeners or similar, there isn’t really any such thing as a ‘nice’ looking classic carb when you want 36mm and none of those would make for a nice, smooth running road bike. 1000 series mk 1 concentrics wouldn’t be much better as they have no choke or tickover. Mk2 concentric or Dellorto’s etc are no prettier than Mikunis.

    The only carbs I’d have preferred to have tried instead of the Mikunis would have been some flat slide Keihin FCRs as fitted to my Commando because they are just SO GOOD. But even I would have to admit they would look out of place on an Egli Vincent.

    When I see Mikunis on some bikes, like big Vins or Gold Stars, it says to me it’s a bike built for riding.

    But that’s just me, as I said, we all draw our own lines.




    4F637F20-23F9-4BF2-B617-AA3DA565D70D.jpeg
     
    Last edited: Mar 3, 2019
  17. 998cc

    998cc "Cheap" is rarely the least expensive. VIP MEMBER

    Joined:
    Oct 1, 2018
    Nigel; I too like the Vincent clutch operation--mine needed a bit of experimentation early on but has since worked well unless it oiled up. It has oiled on several occasions over the years. I tried the stock bonded seals, Tony Maughan's o-ring seal, my own concoctions and so forth. For this build, the Ducati clutch kit from John Healy replaces the original. It can run wet or dry and works well, so far.

    I'm re-thinking the carb situation and leaning toward putting the 30mm Mik VM's back on. Just trying to trim costs and expedite getting it permanently back on the road. Will possibly catch h*ll from the purists!

    It's a sunny 75 (F) degree day outside!
    ~998cc
     
  18. Fast Eddie

    Fast Eddie VIP MEMBER

    Joined:
    Oct 4, 2013
    If you’ve got Mikuni’s that you know work well, then fit ‘em and get ridin’ !
     
  19. worntorn

    worntorn

    Joined:
    Dec 22, 2006
    I've got the Ducati aftermarket company VeeTwo clutch on my high usage Rapide. I changed out the sintered bronze plates for Barnett Kevlar. The plates are same dimensions as Kawi 900 and 1000.
    I run it in a bit of ATF and it's it's lovely.
    Two up plus luggage starts in traffic or on a hill, no issue.
    I have the stock clutch on my other Rapide, all new parts and put together by the Vin specialist, John McDougall.
    No issues there but I slightly prefer the Vee Two item.

    Glen
     
    Last edited: Mar 18, 2019
  20. Fast Eddie

    Fast Eddie VIP MEMBER

    Joined:
    Oct 4, 2013
    Mine was from Maughans, at least 17-18 years ago. I think it was based on Suzuki plates but I’m not sure.

    It ran dry, and dust would build up inside, when it did it became very grabby. On one occasion (on the Distinguished Gentlemen’s ride in Oxford, which is just a stop / start slow ride through the city) it got very bad and was virtually an on / off switch, it was frankly dangerous.

    I tried it with ATF but it slipped.

    So I reverted to running dry and cleaning the clutch once in a while.

    Had I kept it I would have gone for the Vee Two clutch.
     

Share This Page