1973 Combat?

Q

quawk

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As being a relatively new Norton owner, and not knowing much of the history, I've asked in past posts about the Combat model. Other members informed me the Combat came and went in 1972. There is an upcoming auction in my part of the country (midwest U.S.) that has about 50 bikes to be sold. One is listed as being a 1973 Combat. I assume this is incorrect. I doubt it was listed to be misleading as this bike shop/dealer has been around for quite a while. I suppose someone may have done the mods to duplicate one, but can others weigh in here, and comment on/verify that there was no 1973 Combat origially.
 
There has been a lot of discussion in this forum on this type of subject.
One thing that can happen is that a bike that was built late in the year doesn't get registered / titled until the following calendar year after it has been exported and sold by a dealer. Sometimes that causes the calendar year to appear on the bike's paperwork.
I suggest you ask to see a photo of the certification label on the steering head. It should show the month and year the bike was built.
 
quawk said:
I've asked in past posts about the Combat model. Other members informed me the Combat came and went in 1972. There is an upcoming auction in my part of the country (midwest U.S.) that has about 50 bikes to be sold. One is listed as being a 1973 Combat. I assume this is incorrect.
Click to expand...

Yes, the Combat series ended from 211110 in 1972 and there are no Combat parts in what can be considered the '1973' parts book, only 'Low' and 'High' (not as high as the Combat) compression 750 cylinder heads.
 
quawk said:
As being a relatively new Norton owner, and not knowing much of the history, I've asked in past posts about the Combat model. Other members informed me the Combat came and went in 1972. There is an upcoming auction in my part of the country (midwest U.S.) that has about 50 bikes to be sold. One is listed as being a 1973 Combat. I assume this is incorrect. I doubt it was listed to be misleading as this bike shop/dealer has been around for quite a while. I suppose someone may have done the mods to duplicate one, but can others weigh in here, and comment on/verify that there was no 1973 Combat origially.
Click to expand...
Most likely just titled in 73 by the dealer. As mentioned several times, Norton did not have "model years". If the serial number is higher than 211110 it did not leave the factory as a Combat. Turning a 750 with a serial number above 211110 into a "Combat Spec" is simple.
 
One thing I found was not all 1972 bikes got the date stamp on the VIN plate.
I haven't seen this on any other model year
 
L.A.B. said:
Yes, the Combat series ended from 211110 in 1972 and there are no Combat parts in what can be considered the '1973' parts book, only 'Low' and 'High' (not as high as the Combat) compression 750 cylinder heads.
Click to expand...
Interesting to note the 064097 High compression head is 'marked RH6', and the 'original' 060988 750 head is stated as 'marked RH1'
I presume any head actually stamped RH1 would be from this year?
 
I have a '73 Combat. It's a Combat motor and matching gearbox placed in a '73 frame. The registration is off the data on the frame, so it's a '73 despite not leaving the factory that way.
 
B+Bogus said:
Interesting to note the 064097 High compression head is 'marked RH6', and the 'original' 060988 750 head is stated as 'marked RH1'
I presume any head actually stamped RH1 would be from this year?
Click to expand...
I don't believe any head was stamped RH1, but the designation is usually used to identify any pre-1972 Combat (with the 'C' stamp. RH2 was a factory race head and RH3 was the Combat head. Stamping the RH number began with the 1973 RH4 850 head.
 
Here are three head stamping. Ask auction house to ck. 1st has a C and is a Combat head 2nd is a 73 high compression head with a RH6 3rd is later just to show that stamping location has changed

DSC05747.JPGDSC05750.JPGDSC05749.JPG
 
B+Bogus said:
One thing I found was not all 1972 bikes got the date stamp on the VIN plate.
I haven't seen this on any other model year
Click to expand...
I've also found them stamped 1972 (4 digits) and often in the wrong place and using a different font on the label. I also have one marked 1972 MAR in the wrong place. See the pictures. Both have nothing in the top field. 205576 has 1972 stamped over the serial number and MAR next to it. I have no idea of the history of that bike. 204786 has 1972 stamped where shown but it is so poorly done that the "1" is missing and the bottom half of the "9" is missing. The font is smaller. I bought that bike form the original owner and he said that the label was never changed.

I'm 99% sure that those "dates" were stamped after the label was on the bike.


1973 Combat?
 
marshg246 said:
Most likely just titled in 73 by the dealer. As mentioned several times, Norton did not have "model years". If the serial number is higher than 211110 it did not leave the factory as a Combat. Turning a 750 with a serial number above 211110 into a "Combat Spec" is simple.
Click to expand...
Or prior 1972 750 Commando upgrade to Combat pieces. We've all upgraded the crankshaft bearings. Cam choice, cylinder head intake ports, 32mm Carbs, milling the head or Hi Compression pistons will yield a "Combat Spec" 750 equal to the original 1972 Combat.
As a 1971 750 owner, over time I've come to appreciate that Combats aren't the Holy Grail or Unicorns that some believe them to be.
Add a Fullauto head, Webcam or Megacycle cam and FCR flatslides with electronic ignition and I'd take that anytime over a Combat.
 
marshg246 said:
I'm 99% sure that those "dates" were stamped after the label was on the bike.
Click to expand...
I came to this conclusion too - the VIN is always consistent, as if it was stamped prior to being fitted, i.e. it came down the line with the motor/gearbox assembly.
It also seems that the dates aren't always consistent with the VIN, so maybe they got stamped just prior to dispatch.
I've speculated as such before, but got shot down.
The best thing is we can't be sure either way...
 
B+Bogus said:
I came to this conclusion too - the VIN is always consistent, as if it was stamped prior to being fitted, i.e. it came down the line with the motor/gearbox assembly.
It also seems that the dates aren't always consistent with the VIN, so maybe they got stamped just prior to dispatch.
I've speculated as such before, but got shot down.
The best thing is we can't be sure either way...
Click to expand...
True, but the top picture on this picture proves two things:
1) At that time, the steering bearings were installed in the frame before it went on the line
2) At that time, the certification label was on the frame before it went on the line.

andover-norton.co.uk

Andover Norton Parts Shop Service - Andover Norton Parts Dealer - Genuine Andover Norton Spare Parts - Commando Parts - Andover Norton Instructions - Andover Norton Part Books

Andover Norton manufactures and supplies all Genuine Factory Spare Parts for Norton motorcycles built before 2002. Help and Instructions for Norton Motorbikes.
andover-norton.co.uk

I don't remember, but I'm pretty sure @L.A.B. knows when that line was being setup. What it doesn't prove is when the serial and/or date were stamped but I'm guessing that the serial was stamped when the frame/engine marriage happened, and the date at or near when it came off the line.
 
marshg246 said:
True, but the top picture on this picture proves two things:
1) At that time, the steering bearings were installed in the frame before it went on the line
2) At that time, the certification label was on the frame before it went on the line.

andover-norton.co.uk

Andover Norton Parts Shop Service - Andover Norton Parts Dealer - Genuine Andover Norton Spare Parts - Commando Parts - Andover Norton Instructions - Andover Norton Part Books

Andover Norton manufactures and supplies all Genuine Factory Spare Parts for Norton motorcycles built before 2002. Help and Instructions for Norton Motorbikes.
andover-norton.co.uk

I don't remember, but I'm pretty sure @L.A.B. knows when that line was being setup. What it doesn't prove is when the serial and/or date were stamped but I'm guessing that the serial was stamped when the frame/engine marriage happened, and the date at or near when it came off the line.
Click to expand...
I think it's fair to say that they're pretty much on the line, and certainly arranged as such.
I don't know if 'splitting hairs' is a phrase used across the Pond? ;)
As we both know, there are some jobs that are way more easily done before the motor & frame are mated up.
Good spot, by the way :)
 

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