Tried a Different Electronic Ignition System

R

robertv

MEMBER
Joined
Mar 2025
Messages
69
Country flag
I tried a different ei system today. I have been using Pazon for the 850. Twice. Both experienced the same failure mode. Starts off pretty well with the idle always needing attention. Soon it started firing intermittently. Bought another. Set it up correctly and same thing exactly. Was about to return to points/condensers. I felt it was worth a try with the Boyer Brandsen Mark lV.
It is a different bike now, Each piston firing an even bup bup bup bup. Very strong.
I came to a stop sign expecting to fidget with idle. No. It was perfect. I finished my 70 mile test ride and at home it still idled and was cool running at 30lbs oil pressure. Hot.
I also purchased a Tri-Spark. It waits in the wings if needed. At this time however I am very happy with the new version of Boyer. Good job gentlemen. 30 years mechanic. Cheers.
 
robertv said:
I tried a different ei system today. I have been using Pazon for the 850. Twice. Both experienced the same failure mode. Starts off pretty well with the idle always needing attention. Soon it started firing intermittently. Bought another. Set it up correctly and same thing exactly. Was about to return to points/condensers. I felt it was worth a try with the Boyer Brandsen Mark lV.
It is a different bike now, Each piston firing an even bup bup bup bup. Very strong.
I came to a stop sign expecting to fidget with idle. No. It was perfect. I finished my 70 mile test ride and at home it still idled and was cool running at 30lbs oil pressure. Hot.
I also purchased a Tri-Spark. It waits in the wings if needed. At this time however I am very happy with the new version of Boyer. Good job gentlemen. 30 years mechanic. Cheers.
Click to expand...
Strange.

Been using Pazon on my mk2 850 just fine for 6 years. Personally know two other street Commandos using it plus two race bikes. All working fine.

Used a Pazon setup for the Velocette Eldee 250 at the Manx GP. Lapped at around 92 mph. Not bad for a 250.

My guess is you may not have spaced out the pickup correctly. Or else you have a bad connection somewhere. You have either resister spark plug or 5 k resister cap right? But not both ?
 
johnm said:
Strange.

Been using Pazon on my mk2 850 just fine for 6 years. Personally know two other street Commandos using it plus two race bikes. All working fine.

Used a Pazon setup for the Velocette Eldee 250 at the Manx GP. Lapped at around 92 mph. Not bad for a 250.

My guess is you may not have spaced out the pickup correctly. Or else you have a bad connection somewhere. You have either resister spark plug or 5 k resister cap right? But not both ?
Click to expand...
Resistor plugs, yes. I installed both Pazon systems according to the instructions. But no matter, as I have achieved excellent performance (I am knocking on wood of course) without changing anything but the ei. Cheers
 
I swapped out the Pazon Altair for the SureFire to eliminate the kickback. Kickback now gone but now
it is tough to start. Nothing else changed. It does make me think of points....
Bike runs well with either EI once going. Idles fine.
 
Onder said:
I swapped out the Pazon Altair for the SureFire to eliminate the kickback. Kickback now gone but now
it is tough to start. Nothing else changed. It does make me think of points....
Bike runs well with either EI once going. Idles fine.
Click to expand...
I use a basic Surefire. I fitted it in 2015, it's been fine, but I start on rollers. Last weekend the coil failed in extremely hot conditions, though it may have been failing for a while longer.

I am confused by your post. Altair is supposed the be the digital version of Pazon's more basic ignition, and supposedly fixes things bike Kickback?

I think if I did upgrade I would go all the way to the Smartfire.
 
robertv said:
I tried a different ei system today. I have been using Pazon for the 850. Twice. Both experienced the same failure mode. Starts off pretty well with the idle always needing attention. Soon it started firing intermittently. Bought another. Set it up correctly and same thing exactly. Was about to return to points/condensers. I felt it was worth a try with the Boyer Brandsen Mark lV.
It is a different bike now, Each piston firing an even bup bup bup bup. Very strong.
I came to a stop sign expecting to fidget with idle. No. It was perfect. I finished my 70 mile test ride and at home it still idled and was cool running at 30lbs oil pressure. Hot.
I also purchased a Tri-Spark. It waits in the wings if needed. At this time however I am very happy with the new version of Boyer. Good job gentlemen. 30 years mechanic. Cheers.
Click to expand...
Which Pazon were you using?
 
Pazon Altair in my MKIII eliminated the random fire of a the early Boyer when the voltage pulled down by the E-Start. No kickback if kicking but with upgraded alternator and regulator plus new starter parts it starts like any new bike. Been installed for years with no problems. The early Boyer caused my starter sprag issues as discovered by Dyno Dave.
 
Sure Fire is the standard Pazon EI. Altair is the digital model. My problem was kickback with the Altair
drove me nuts. It would either fire first kick or 10th kick or more. Wore me out. Put on the basic Sure Fire
it never kicks back but never starts first kick either. Once running I see no difference between the two.
Yes, at my age I should have an electric leg but the added weight is not congenial. Added complexity
a bother. Cost is not the issue.
 
Onder,

There may be a reason why yours does not start on first kick. In a thread somewhere, maybe outside the forum, I read that at least one electronic ignition has a sleep mode that substantially reduces current draw. I guess this is to stop the unit overheating etc if engine is not running because the current draw is higher through the ignition control unit with engine off than with engine on.

I think that this sleep mode might turned off when you first kick by the ignition rotor magnet triggering the electronic unit.
It is possible that your unit turns on in sleep mode and takes a kick to wake it up.

Dennis
 
My Wassell/Vape ignition needs a signal from the trigger to wake up, then goes to sleep after two seconds.

I have to force the engine through two TDCs with one kick, to make it start. Luckily, it’s only a 650 of another marque.
 
I have a Trispark with my Alton and it seems to start on the first revolution.
Maybe the Trispark does not turn on in a sleep mode, but perhaps turns off if no magnet/sensors pulses received after x seconds.
Actually I do not know..
Dennis
 
The Pazon has one version that needs 2 signals to wake up not just the 1, which means there is a comment in the instructions to not fit it to high compression single cylinder bikes.
 
Onder said:
Sure Fire is the standard Pazon EI. Altair is the digital model. My problem was kickback with the Altair
drove me nuts. It would either fire first kick or 10th kick or more. Wore me out. Put on the basic Sure Fire
it never kicks back but never starts first kick either. Once running I see no difference between the two.
Yes, at my age I should have an electric leg but the added weight is not congenial. Added complexity
a bother. Cost is not the issue.
Click to expand...
Likewise, my Pazon Altair will kick back like a mule if I failed to bring it past TDC prior to turning on the ignition switch. And if it does not fire on that kick, I must shut the key off roll it back just passed TDC turn the key back on and try again.

With the boiler, I could just kick it anytime any place anywhere in the stroke and it would be just fine…
 

Similar threads

Andy Higham
Wet sumping, a different approach
Replies
5
Views
674
kommando
kommando
acotrel
Programmable ignition system
Replies
2
Views
424
johnm
johnm
T
Keihin CR31...what a difference a jet makes....
Replies
19
Views
3,196
acotrel
acotrel
acotrel
  • Locked
Tuning a different way.
2
Replies
35
Views
4,392
acotrel
acotrel
O
  • Locked
Is it worth going from points to an electronic ignition system?
2 3
Replies
40
Views
7,371
acotrel
acotrel
Back
Top