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I'm not going to defend 97% of commuter machines as 'enthusiast' territory Matt, as clearly it isn't. But if you've been to the 3rd world and seen dad mum and 3 kids all motoring along on their stepthrough, some of which are now positively ancient, in vast armies, you'd appreciate there is more to building good bikes than just cubic capacity and needing to work on it every weekend...

Things like Villiers lightweights and bantams tapped into this market a good way back, with hordes of euro mopeds, and now the Chinese are seriously moving into this market - there are now more Chinese motorcycle manufacturers, or motorbike makers if you like, than in all of the rest of the world. And Chinese car makers last year made more cars than Japan and USA COMBINED - although the quality varies somewhat apparently !

P.S. remember too that cars produced for the masses arrived in the west only a century or so back, so in the scheme of things they are not actually that far behind. Wanna predict who will dominate in the world of car making in another century ?
Or bikes - did I see that BMW and Ducati are already getting some engines made there. ?

<blockquote data-quote="Rohan" data-source="post: 142439" data-attributes="member: 2471">I&#039;m not going to defend 97% of commuter machines as &#039;enthusiast&#039; territory Matt, as clearly it isn&#039;t.&nbsp; But if you&#039;ve been to the 3rd world and seen dad mum and 3 kids all motoring along on their stepthrough, some of which are now positively ancient, in vast armies, you&#039;d appreciate there is more to building good bikes than just cubic capacity and needing to work on it every weekend...Things like Villiers lightweights and&nbsp; bantams tapped into this market a good way back, with hordes of euro mopeds, and now the Chinese are seriously moving into this market - there are now more Chinese motorcycle manufacturers, or motorbike makers if you like, than in all of the rest of the world. And Chinese car makers last year made more cars than Japan and USA COMBINED - although the quality varies somewhat apparently !P.S. remember too that cars produced for the masses arrived in the west only a century or so back, so in the scheme of things they are not actually that far behind. Wanna predict who will dominate in the world of car making in another century ?&nbsp; Or bikes - did I see that BMW and Ducati are already getting some engines made there. ?</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Rohan, post: 142439, member: 2471"] I'm not going to defend 97% of commuter machines as 'enthusiast' territory Matt, as clearly it isn't. But if you've been to the 3rd world and seen dad mum and 3 kids all motoring along on their stepthrough, some of which are now positively ancient, in vast armies, you'd appreciate there is more to building good bikes than just cubic capacity and needing to work on it every weekend... Things like Villiers lightweights and bantams tapped into this market a good way back, with hordes of euro mopeds, and now the Chinese are seriously moving into this market - there are now more Chinese motorcycle manufacturers, or motorbike makers if you like, than in all of the rest of the world. And Chinese car makers last year made more cars than Japan and USA COMBINED - although the quality varies somewhat apparently ! P.S. remember too that cars produced for the masses arrived in the west only a century or so back, so in the scheme of things they are not actually that far behind. Wanna predict who will dominate in the world of car making in another century ? Or bikes - did I see that BMW and Ducati are already getting some engines made there. ? [/QUOTE]