Is there a definitive list of necessary tools?

I have recommissioned a ‘74 850 Interstate. It had been laid up unused for the past 15 years, and in all its time has only covered 10,000 miles. After a quick learning process, with many hints and tips from here, added to that a not inconsiderable outlay for new bits and pieces, it is now back on the road.

I have only covered a few miles so far, perhaps 70 in total and my first impressions are very favourable. It’s quiet, it’s fast, lots of torque and stops almost quite well.

It is oil tight - sort of. Annoyingly the rear of the inner primary case has a dribble where the centre bolt exits - OK, that means clutch off etc. to get it oiltight I assume.

then there is a glistening right in the middle of the front of the engine. The top 2/3 fins of the barrels appear to be a bit damp. This was definitely dry a few days ago.

Perhaps the head could do with being re-torqued?

OK, now for the actual question - what size of spanners will I need? I have a very comprehensive set of tools built up over the last 40+ years of biking. With the exception of a full set of AF sockets and open/ring combination spanners, all of my gear is metric. Lots of Norton nuts and bolts appear to be Whitworth and I have very few.

what do I need to use on the head nuts/bolts/studs etc. as some of them are hidden away deep in the recesses?

Finally, as it’s now up and running after a long lay up are there any recommendations to consider? Should I drop the oil for more fresh as it’s almost like it’s being run in again, or am I over thinking things?

There is a list of service tools in one or all of the manuals ( owners,parts list , shop manual ) .... basically I got tools as needed as I worked my way over and through my bike .,... good luck

To be honest you can normally get away with metric sockets if you have them going up in 1mm increments, especially for U.N.F. But measure across the flats first is my advice. There are what are called "Metrinch" flank drive sockets, and If I were starting out that's what I'd buy.

There are various threads about accessing the head fastenings. This was that latest i think..


Cheers,

cliffa.

No metric on a Norton. I recommend a full set of 5 Whitworth open end / box wrenches and sockets plus you'll need an assortment of standard SAE stuff. There of course specialty tools like clutch compressor and main sprocket puller that we need too.

Oil leak from the back of the primary is usually the grommet around the alternator wire.

Regarding the oil leak at primary, if it is just the fixing stud in center, then no need to remove clutch to access. The outer cover can be removed to access it. Likely a gob of silicon sealant around it will suffice until you need ot do further work in there. Use some sealant or Hylomar type stuff on the primary rubber o-ring when replacing cover. I use ATF type F as primary fluid instead of engine oil...easier to know what is leaking and doesn't foul clutch plates as much.
You can save $$$ on at least some of the specialty tools. The clutch compressor can be easily fashioned from a bit of ABS or PVC 3" drain pipe cap and a long bolt plus couple of nuts. My Haynes manual even describes this fabrication. Rocker spindle puller can be made using a 6"+ pipe (I used my sparkplug box tube wrench) and suitable threaded rod/bolt with some nuts. Some tools are worth getting, like the exhaust rose nut wrench.

Basic Specialty tools will consist of.
1. Clutch compressor
2. Exhaust collar wrench
3. Sprocket puller for primary
4. Tapered tool for Timing Cover at points seal
These will get you through most maintenance items.
5. There is a slide hammer for the AA and the rocker arm pins.
Not really necessary for the AA, but a Cool Tool.

vice grips hammer double headed screwdriver 7/16 wrench 1/2 inch wrench 9/16 inch wrench spark plug socket shifting spanner

Thank you all for the replies, there are plenty of good ideas there. But, I didn’t word things as well as I should have.

the leak from the primary is definitely from the support stud not the alternator cable, so that will wait till I can not stand wiping it away.

I have a weep, maybe, from the front of the head, what spanners do I need to tighten down the head? Is my diagnosis reasonable with the length of time it’s been off the road?

That head weep is pretty common...usually seen at third fin down. A few possible causes can be the rocker cover gasket; the rocker cover lower stud letting oil wick up/out through threads (locktite to head threads helps); out of flat rocker cover from over torquing nuts (needs flatting on glass plate with wet/dry emery); headgasket leaking near pushrod tunnels (head torquing may help). Another item that reduces all oil leaks, is to run a better crankcase breather. There is a decent reed-valve breather from Yamaha XS650 that folks here like: https://www.mikesxs.net/yamaha-xs650-reed-type-engine-breather-valve-pcv.html.

Thanks Tornado, I have put on 2 new rocker cover gaskets and those areas are still very clean and dry. Yes, I’d agree it’s around the 3rd fin area right out front. I had a breather problem when I was running a turbo on my Busa race bike, overcome by an additional oil scavenge pump - now that’s a bit extreme for this bike. I had a 600 Panther which would also spew oil until I added a simple flapper washer to the crank sprocket nut.

would the engine breather be fitted inline where the existing line comes out of the “mag drive“ part of the timing chest? I wonder if there’s something similar available over this side of the pond, or perhaps what others are using?

Landspeedracer said:

Thanks Tornado, I have put on 2 new rocker cover gaskets and those areas are still very clean and dry. Yes, I’d agree it’s around the 3rd fin area right out front. I had a breather problem when I was running a turbo on my Busa race bike, overcome by an additional oil scavenge pump - now that’s a bit extreme for this bike. I had a 600 Panther which would also spew oil until I added a simple flapper washer to the crank sprocket nut.

would the engine breather be fitted inline where the existing line comes out of the “mag drive“ part of the timing chest? I wonder if there’s something similar available over this side of the pond, or perhaps what others are using?

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Yes you can fit the breather right where the old mag went. I just connected the new one to the pipe coming out from the timing check. Later, I made it a longer hose so I could place the valve up under the seat near where it connects to the oil tank vent. Some here remove the timing chest pipe and fit the valve direct to the chest.

You will need a set of Whitworth open end/ring spanners, and a set of 3/8 sockets. Basic sets of 6 will do you fine.

But you will need a special tool for the rear head bolt nut, or a ring spanner that is ground down thin

As gortnipper said, the best bet is to just get a set of Whitworh/BS combination wrenches (open end/ring spanners to some) and 3/8" drive W/BS sockets.

More specifically, you will need 1/4W for the head bolts and nuts, as well as 3/16W for the two long nuts at the front. Wrenches or sockets will work for the head bolts, but you will need a 1/4W socket to tighten the center head bolt and the two top front nuts. To tighten the rear nut, you will need a 1/4W box end that is thin enough to fit. That will let you at least tighten them by feel.

To use a torque wrench on two long front nuts and the rear nut, you will need either some sort of crow foot offset adapter wrench or a makeshift offset adapter using wrenches and nuts and bolts. I make mine up by cutting off a box end of the appropriate size and welding a 3/8" drive socket to it. You can then correct the torque readings for the longer reach. It is also possible to use the correct size combination wrench by fitting a bolt with nut screwed on in the open end of the wrench, and fitting a socket on the end of the torque wrench to also fit on it. You can again correct the torque setting for the different torque arm length. If you search the forum, you should find a number of posts with pictures of the special rear nut wrench, as well of discussions on how to torque all the fasteners.

Ken

And if you have not yet already discovered, this site has a sticky page under Technical Information forum of a lot of Norton classic bike literature, including the workshop manuals:

Landspeedracer said:

Thank you all for the replies, there are plenty of good ideas there. But, I didn’t word things as well as I should have.

the leak from the primary is definitely from the support stud not the alternator cable, so that will wait till I can not stand wiping it away.

I have a weep, maybe, from the front of the head, what spanners do I need to tighten down the head? Is my diagnosis reasonable with the length of time it’s been off the road?

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Angled engine, oil settles in the front. Take a peek at the back of the head too.

On my 1974 Roadster I also had a slight leak from rear primary in area of fixing stud. Upon disassembly I discovered a slight hairline crack from around center stud hole caused by – yes you guessed it – poor shimming. There is just not enough ductility in the casting material to allow for deflection to compensate for excessive gap and a hairline resulted. I was surprised that I could get a leak but that was the source.

I had another rear primary that was solid. I properly shimmed (measuring gap of bolted up cover with a feeler gage on an initial trial shim pack, removing cover, and replacing shim pack with initial plus gap measured) and installed new cover. No leak. Will weld-up old cover as back-up.

Hope this is not your problem.

I have cleaned between all of the fins today, not as easy as it seems, threading a cloth between each and tugging it back and forth. It is very apparent that the sides and read of the head/barrel interface are extremely clean and dry. I have sealed both exhaust covers as I originally fitted the new baskets dry, this time using 3bond, both were just starting to seep.

I’m confident the primary is simply a 46 year old, never been moved, dried up gasket or whatever that’s sealing the stud hole. I’m not wanting to remove the perfectly dry outer cover for the sake of a slight weep for now, it can wait till I’m annoyed enough with it.

The rocker covers get mentioned here. Make sure the one in the rear (intake) seals as the oil leaking here can migrate forward and give the illusion of a leaking head gasket.

The idea of retorquing the head after it has sat for so many years makes me cringe. Not that it shouldn't be done but its hard to know if the torque reading is from corrosion and of course one worries about tearing out the studs. The bright side is that if the studs tear out, you get to take the head off, and do it all from scratch. Sorry for bringing it up, but it is all part of the fun.

As for the primary leak, how much oil is in the primary? That stud isn't really prone to leaking from splash.

rvich said:

As for the primary leak, how much oil is in the primary? That stud isn't really prone to leaking from splash.

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Actually, it is. I used to get oil dribble from the outer cover nut.

Landspeedracer said:

I have cleaned between all of the fins today, not as easy as it seems, threading a cloth between each and tugging it back and forth. It is very apparent that the sides and read of the head/barrel interface are extremely clean and dry. I have sealed both exhaust covers as I originally fitted the new baskets dry, this time using 3bond, both were just starting to seep.

I’m confident the primary is simply a 46 year old, never been moved, dried up gasket or whatever that’s sealing the stud hole. I’m not wanting to remove the perfectly dry outer cover for the sake of a slight weep for now, it can wait till I’m annoyed enough with it.

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Be cautious using gasket maker compounds on the rocker covers. Excess can squish out on the inside, leading to bits floating around and getting trapped in oil ways and esp the intake side oil drain hole...which is tiny and hard to clear. I just cured a smoking cylinder issue by clearing that drain. I'm using reusable silicon rubber gaskets on my rocker covers. No sealants.