***IMPORTANT PLEASE READ (but don't panic)***

Ok before everyone starts running around like a chicken with its head cut off with this issue and while there may be an issue please keep the sky is falling to a minimum until we know there actually a problem. With that said I have checked three different motorcycles with varying mileage with the most being 8500 and none had anything wrong. One of the bikes has seen heavy track day use as well so lots of brake loading etc

If you are concerned and want a good way here is a quick method to check yours:

1- get a can of Aervoe crack detection or magnaflux crack detection or whatever you want to use

2-get a cheap high power UV flashlight off of amazon. (you should have one anyways as they are awesome for leak detection because they pick up the phosphorus in oil etc.)

3- Cover your wheels with cheap towels before you spray

4- spray and check

Its that easy. P.S. clean your hubs first if that wasn't self evident


Now to address the cracks. One of the first and usually the main reason for the cracks is improper tension on the spokes. Loose spokes will cause this more than a tight spoke. I'm sure not one person here except Stu, Tony, Ken and maybe Voodoo has checked there spoke tension. If you have ever got a wheel from Woodys or Buchanan's then you have seen the tag on the wheel about checking tension.

Lastly I have seen cracking like this before only to find out is the powdercoat or whatever coating so you may need to dig deeper if you find a crack.

Also you can get a wheel stand from amazon or EBAY to check the wheel for any out of true conditions as well which can contribute to this issue as well.

THIS ISSUE IS NOT UNCOMMON TO CAST HUBS AND ALUMINUM HUBS from any manufacture etc. You see this on adventure bikes and MX bikes along with sport bikes that see heavy use.

So for about $150 you can answer this question plus add some tools to your garage that you can use in the future

That's my 2 cents for today so before you start with I saw a 900-foot Jesus in Tulsa Oklahoma, check your own and let us know what you find out.
 
Who knew you could tighten spokes:oops:! How do I do it on my carbon wheels!?

Thankfully I think mine are ok!😉

5E3DDD05-375F-42BF-99C7-E5C1070AC4F3.jpeg
 
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City Garage said:
Ok before everyone starts running around like a chicken with its head cut off with this issue and while there may be an issue please keep the sky is falling to a minimum until we know there actually a problem. With that said I have checked three different motorcycles with varying mileage with the most being 8500 and none had anything wrong. One of the bikes has seen heavy track day use as well so lots of brake loading etc

If you are concerned and want a good way here is a quick method to check yours:

1- get a can of Aervoe crack detection or magnaflux crack detection or whatever you want to use

2-get a cheap high power UV flashlight off of amazon. (you should have one anyways as they are awesome for leak detection because they pick up the phosphorus in oil etc.)

3- Cover your wheels with cheap towels before you spray

4- spray and check

Its that easy. P.S. clean your hubs first if that wasn't self evident


Now to address the cracks. One of the first and usually the main reason for the cracks is improper tension on the spokes. Loose spokes will cause this more than a tight spoke. I'm sure not one person here except Stu, Tony, Ken and maybe Voodoo has checked there spoke tension. If you have ever got a wheel from Woodys or Buchanan's then you have seen the tag on the wheel about checking tension.

Lastly I have seen cracking like this before only to find out is the powdercoat or whatever coating so you may need to dig deeper if you find a crack.

Also you can get a wheel stand from amazon or EBAY to check the wheel for any out of true conditions as well which can contribute to this issue as well.

THIS ISSUE IS NOT UNCOMMON TO CAST HUBS AND ALUMINUM HUBS from any manufacture etc. You see this on adventure bikes and MX bikes along with sport bikes that see heavy use.

So for about $150 you can answer this question plus add some tools to your garage that you can use in the future

That's my 2 cents for today so before you start with I saw a 900-foot Jesus in Tulsa Oklahoma, check your own and let us know what you find out.
Click to expand...
Solid advice. Great to have these sorts of contributions to the forum.
 
concours said:
People in the US should report that here: https://www.nhtsa.gov/report-a-safety-problem#index

That hub failing is real shit right there. And, if it would likely poop while making a panic stop, hard steering avoidance.
Click to expand...
PLEASE DONT DO THAT.

First off there is no one here to fix it if it REALLY is an issue and second that will tank the value of an already depressed market on these. THERE IS NO USA PRESENCE OF NORTON EITHER .

Please stick to the commando forum and don't stir the pot here chicken little.
 
City Garage said:
PLEASE DONT DO THAT.

First off there is no one here to fix it if it REALLY is an issue and second that will tank the value of an already depressed market on these. THERE IS NO USA PRESENCE OF NORTON EITHER .

Please stick to the commando forum and don't stir the pot here chicken little.
Click to expand...
I gut your chicken little right here.
 
Don't any of you spin your wheels and run a small stick, I use half a clothes peg, over the spokes as a routine check? Must be getting old!
 
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Surely the hub design does not let the spoke head do its job, nothing to do with tension. If the neck area of the spoke under the head where it sits in the hub is tight in the hole then it is doomed to fail as the spoke can't move.
 
Fast Eddie said:
Looks to me that that hub design is designed for the spokes to pull straight.

In that plain they’d be pulling on very thick alloy.

But they’re not pulling straight, they’re bent and therefore leveraging on the thin part of the alloy. No wonder they broke…
Click to expand...
Exactly.
 
Al's#5 said:
Don't any of you spin your wheels and run a small stick, I use half a clothes peg, over the spokes as a routine check? Must be getting old!
Click to expand...
Unfortunately most bikes these days are only coming with a sidestand, so not so easy to do that. The 961 isn't particularly light either so I would hazard a guess that it's not a common occurrence on these and many other spoked wheel bikes. Even if it were easy to do you would not be able to detect a hairline crack in the hub as the tension would be maintained until it failed completely. As @City Garage said careful visual inspection is the only real answer, but to be honest the thoughts of sinking another $150 only to find I need to spend another $$$$? (if I can get one) to rectify it when I find the hub is defective is not appealing in the current climate.
 
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It was not my intention to cause panic just to inform (as it seems others have failed to do unfortunately). Funnily enough though when I was in Tulsa recently I saw a - oh but that's another story ;) . Anyway, we are all well used to surprizes when it comes to 961 ownership, so I think panic would be hard to generate here.

It seems to me the Talon hubs on the earlier bikes which are most at risk of failure @Panetone may be able to shed some more light on this as he has had two replaced already.

Some observations:

  • If we look at the picture I copied from Facebook which is a Talon hub like mine and compare the sidewall of the spoke socket to the thickness of the spokes which are 4mm, that sidewall can be absolutely no greater (in my estimation) than 1.5mm at it's thickest point.
  • The set in some of the spokes appears to be too close to the mushroom head and inside the socket which makes the spoke press on one side as it exits causing outward pressure on the socket as the spoke is tightened. This stress will only be exasperated as the bike goes through it's normal daily cycle during riding.
  • It may be the camera angle but some of the spokes appear to be straight and some not. As mentioned earlier, does the hub actually match the rim?


1671832001055.png


By way of a comparison I took a photo of the front hub on my 24hp Enfield Himalayan. The spokes are a similar gauge, and you can see that there is approx. the same thickness of sidewall material as the spokes on either side of, and above them. The set in the spokes also happens well outside of the socket.



1671830874875.png



I have already contacted Talon and they have said they are unable (or unwilling?) to supply me a replacement hub, so hopefully as part of the new TVS spares arrangement they will be available. If not I will consider breaking mine for spares, as I could not knowingly ride it or sell it on.
 
cliffa said:
It was not my intention to cause panic just to inform (as it seems others have failed to do unfortunately). Funnily enough though when I was in Tulsa recently I saw a - oh but that's another story ;) . Anyway, we are all well used to surprizes when it comes to 961 ownership, so I think panic would be hard to generate here.

It seems to me the Talon hubs on the earlier bikes which are most at risk of failure @Panetone may be able to shed some more light on this as he has had two replaced already.

Some observations:

  • If we look at the picture I copied from Facebook which is a Talon hub like mine and compare the sidewall of the spoke socket to the thickness of the spokes which are 4mm, that sidewall can be absolutely no greater (in my estimation) than 1.5mm at it's thickest point.
  • The set in some of the spokes appears to be too close to the mushroom head and inside the socket which makes the spoke press on one side as it exits causing outward pressure on the socket as the spoke is tightened. This stress will only be exasperated as the bike goes through it's normal daily cycle during riding.
  • It may be the camera angle but some of the spokes appear to be straight and some not. As mentioned earlier, does the hub actually match the rim?


View attachment 102267

By way of a comparison I took a photo of the front hub on my 24hp Enfield Himalayan. The spokes are a similar gauge, and you can see that there is approx. the same thickness of sidewall material as the spokes on either side of, and above them. The set in the spokes also happens well outside of the socket.



View attachment 102266


I have already contacted Talon and they have said they are unable (or unwilling?) to supply me a replacement hub, so hopefully as part of the new TVS spares arrangement they will be available. If not I will consider breaking mine for spares, as I could not knowingly ride it or sell it on.
Click to expand...
Why are the spokes in the pictured hubs so deep ? Looks like they are counter sunk into the hub.

Here are mine for comparison.
My spokes have a Norton N on the head.
 

Attachments

  • ***IMPORTANT PLEASE READ (but don't panic)***
    FA46CF3F-2011-4E55-B768-BA11309A3CA9.png
    1.4 MB · Views: 153
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cliffa said:
It was not my intention to cause panic just to inform (as it seems others have failed to do unfortunately). Funnily enough though when I was in Tulsa recently I saw a - oh but that's another story ;) . Anyway, we are all well used to surprizes when it comes to 961 ownership, so I think panic would be hard to generate here.

It seems to me the Talon hubs on the earlier bikes which are most at risk of failure @Panetone may be able to shed some more light on this as he has had two replaced already.

Some observations:

  • If we look at the picture I copied from Facebook which is a Talon hub like mine and compare the sidewall of the spoke socket to the thickness of the spokes which are 4mm, that sidewall can be absolutely no greater (in my estimation) than 1.5mm at it's thickest point.
  • The set in some of the spokes appears to be too close to the mushroom head and inside the socket which makes the spoke press on one side as it exits causing outward pressure on the socket as the spoke is tightened. This stress will only be exasperated as the bike goes through it's normal daily cycle during riding.
  • It may be the camera angle but some of the spokes appear to be straight and some not. As mentioned earlier, does the hub actually match the rim?


View attachment 102267

By way of a comparison I took a photo of the front hub on my 24hp Enfield Himalayan. The spokes are a similar gauge, and you can see that there is approx. the same thickness of sidewall material as the spokes on either side of, and above them. The set in the spokes also happens well outside of the socket.



View attachment 102266


I have already contacted Talon and they have said they are unable (or unwilling?) to supply me a replacement hub, so hopefully as part of the new TVS spares arrangement they will be available. If not I will consider breaking mine for spares, as I could not knowingly ride it or sell it on.
Click to expand...
let me know if you have an issue. I have a few sets of wheels that I might part out for spares. Id really like to sell the whole wheels but.....
 
Voodooo said:
Why are the spokes in the pictured hubs so deep ? Looks like they are counter sunk into the hub.

Here are mine for comparison.
My spokes have a Norton N on the head.
Click to expand...
Wow, that's a nice touch!

It looks like you have the later cast (I believe) hub. No feedback yet about any failure with these.
 
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City Garage said:
let me know if you have an issue. I have a few sets of wheels that I might part out for spares. Id really like to sell the whole wheels but.....
Click to expand...
That's really nice of you & TBH, I'd take a complete wheel if the price was right (for both of us) and it was the later hub. I'll have a closer look at mine next week and get back to you if that's ok?
 
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