Follower scar oil tests (2018)

Status
Not open for further replies.
So Red Line does know how to make an oil
__________________________________________________________
Red_Line_SAE60_Synthetic_Racing_Oil
Follower scar oil tests (2018)

421 Lbs load
1.96 heat from high pressure shear
.001 heat from friction

Great result -too bad it's not good for street use -no detergents.
 
Last edited:
i used that Redline initially in my race engine , although after a tear down noticed there had been a lot of heat around the piston crowns and small ends and blamed the oil , hence the reason i went to the Driven.
It maybe that at one race I was stuck on the dummy grid during a very hot summer and there was a bike recovery from the previous race and the bike got really hot while stationary and also I may have had to much advance in the ignition.
Looks good in this test.
Regards Mike
 
The Redline racing oil looks good, thanks for testing this one Jim as it was one I was considering in my new motor, and now I still am!

So... question about detergents... if we run a reasonable filter and change the oil more frequently than a ‘normal’ road user, say every 1000-1500 miles, does lack of detergents matter?

In layman’s terms, what do they do? And why did they leave them out? Any thoughts ??
 
Dear Jim, you are indeed out of your mind. And I positively love that!

Although I completely understand your reason for doing away with it, the 'recommended for Norton' column was actually quite useful for this chemistry Neandertal.
Could I suggest a system where each oil would be 'approved' or 'not recommended' for the most common Norton usages on this forum:

- Racing.
- Fast road with occasionnal track days.
- Slow (normal) regular road use.
- Occasionnal road use only.

Thank you again for being that crazy.

Bruno
 
Fast Eddie said:
The Redline racing oil looks good, thanks for testing this one Jim as it was one I was considering in my new motor, and now I still am!

So... question about detergents... if we run a reasonable filter and change the oil more frequently than a ‘normal’ road user, say every 1000-1500 miles, does lack of detergents matter?

In layman’s terms, what do they do? And why did they leave them out? Any thoughts ??
Click to expand...

The detergents stop the crap in the oil from settling out so they remain in suspension to be transported to the oil filter for removal, so using an oil with no detergents risks sludge build up, not a problem in the oil tank or probably the sump (as long as it not a 72) and you clean these out regularly but the crank sludge trap will fill up faster than when using a detergent oil and there is no access unless you do a complete strip down.
 
kommando said:
The detergents stop the crap in the oil from settling out so they remain in suspension to be transported to the oil filter for removal, so using an oil with no detergents risks sludge build up, not a problem in the oil tank or probably the sump (as long as it not a 72) and you clean these out regularly but the crank sludge trap will fill up faster than when using a detergent oil and there is no access unless you do a complete strip down.
Click to expand...
Got it, thanks.
Next question... how realistic is the risk?
In normal use where folk leave their oil in for many 1000s of miles and it turns to sludge, it’s kinda obvious, But if it’s changed every 1500 miles or so, I’m thinking any ‘stuff’ would still drain as it hasn’t had time to compress and stick.
 
The problem is not the settling out you get when the bike is parked up and cooling down, it's the continual extraction of the sludge forming crud by the centripetal forces inside the sludge trap. Now this may be minor as the oil has been back to the tank via the filter and has not yet been spurted out of the crank into the cases to be contaminated with the metal from wear and the products of combustion from blowby. But who wants to be the tester ?
 
kommando said:
But who wants to be the tester ?
Click to expand...

Well, maybe me (I said maybe)...

I’m thinking thus: the oil gets dirty and contaminated etc, during a lubriction ‘cycle’ but after the ‘cycle’ on its way back to the tank it’ll get filtered.

That filtered oil then enters the next ‘cycle’. So, the engine will only ever be fed clean, filtered oil. There is no sludge to build up.

Add to that, the very frequent oil changes, and I’m kinda struggling to see the down side in a ‘low mileage - filter fitted - frequent oil change’ environment.
 
Using an oil that lacks detergents doesn't sound like a good idea for an Oil in Frame application either!
 
Brooking 850 said:
i used that Redline initially in my race engine , although after a tear down noticed there had been a lot of heat around the piston crowns and small ends and blamed the oil , hence the reason i went to the Driven.
It maybe that at one race I was stuck on the dummy grid during a very hot summer and there was a bike recovery from the previous race and the bike got really hot while stationary and also I may have had to much advance in the ignition.
Looks good in this test.
Regards Mike
Click to expand...

I have ended up sitting over an awful lot of heat in holding areas.....usually a formation laps allows things to cool a little, but the damage may already be done. In France and belgium I have been waiting longer than in the UK, but it happens every where. This drives away from the prospect of using oil for up to 3 meetings and suggests that a change after every meeting is a good policy if you hae been held in a holding area fr any significant time!
 
SteveA said:
I have ended up sitting over an awful lot of heat in holding areas.....usually a formation laps allows things to cool a little, but the damage may already be done. In France and belgium I have been waiting longer than in the UK, but it happens every where. This drives away from the prospect of using oil for up to 3 meetings and suggests that a change after every meeting is a good policy if you hae been held in a holding area fr any significant time!
Click to expand...

I’d come to the same conclusion as a result of following this thread Steve!
 
Detergents counteract the anti-friction/anti-wear additives in the oil.
If your using non-detergent oil you should change it after every weekend of racing.

I wouldn't use it on the street. A filter only removes the big stuff. Sludge is made up of small stuff.

But I would use this.

___________________________________________________________
Bel Ray EXP 4 parts / Red Line Racing 1 part
Follower scar oil tests (2018)

333 lbs load
2.21 heat from high pressure shear
1.521 heat from friction
Low friction
Low heat
 
Last edited:
Interesting Jim!

I get the message now from y’all: don’t use race oil on the road!

I’m still in suspense awaiting the Bel Ray Thumper oil...
 
Jagbruno said:
Dear Jim, you are indeed out of your mind. And I positively love that!

Although I completely understand your reason for doing away with it, the 'recommended for Norton' column was actually quite useful for this chemistry Neandertal.
Could I suggest a system where each oil would be 'approved' or 'not recommended' for the most common Norton usages on this forum:

- Racing.
- Fast road with occasionnal track days.
- Slow (normal) regular road use.
- Occasionnal road use only.

Thank you again for being that crazy.

Bruno
Click to expand...
+1 – as a fellow chemistry-Neanderthal, I've been focusing on that 'approved' vs 'not recommended' aspect. Misguidedly, perhaps, but it's the kind of thing I want to see. Although, I think Bruno's second and third categories overlap. On fast roads, I like to ride fast (legally, but often with a smidgen extra), but to get to the fast roads I have to spend a fair bit of time pottering slowly. Commandos were considered fast road bikes in their day, so I'd include 'fast road' with 'regular road use'. Track days belong with racing, IMHO. So I'd merge the middle two categories and tweak accordingly. YMMV, of course …
 
Last edited:
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top