69 Center Stand Fix Ideas

Can you re-tig weld new pivots on ? But tig on some shaped 25 x5 first then tig on some new pivots , sorry was thinking it had round bits up there ! , even easier to extend the flat bar and re-drill, ....touch it up with some of that VHT barrel paint , I used some of that on my norton oil tank and it's got the right look , black and shinny sort of ,but looks thicker . You'd never see it up there . Cheers.

Shelby-Right said:

Can you re-tig weld new pivots on ? But tig on some shaped 25 x5 first then tig on some new pivots , sorry was thinking it had round bits up there ! , even easier to extend the flat bar and re-drill, ....touch it up with some of that VHT barrel paint , I used some of that on my norton oil tank and it's got the right look , black and shinny sort of ,but looks thicker . You'd never see it up there . Cheers.

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Since it's basically a triangle, lengthening the legs won't work unless you widen the stance, and that bottom brace would require two cuts. A good fabricator could handle that, but I would find it very difficult. The idea of changing the flat parts to longer is good, but again would require more welding skills than I have and getting the up and down stops right would be a PITA. Adding "feet" would seem the easiest and I thought some weld build-up would do it, but it requires too much.

I thought about switching to 90/90-19 tires which would give me about .45" - the bike has 100/90-19 now, but I can't find any rear tires in that size. Besides, it really should have 4.10x19 tires when shown and that are a slightly larger diameter that then Avon tires on it now.

I'm really wondering if this stand is made wrong. Several people have said that their tire touches and some have said that they have a small gap. With everything I've already done, the bike is somewhat stable on a hard surface but cannot stand on a thin oil mat.

With the front end tied down and the rear jacked up just enough for the rear wheel to turn, and the spring removed from the stand to allow it to hang straight down, there is about a 1/4" gap under that stand. With the stand in the normal position, the gap is over 1/2". If the bottom of the feet to the center of the pivot were 9" the bike would at least be as stable as that stand ever is.

What about adding a nice rounded section on each foot even if it's got gap you could add a side plate , it would look OK, sure you'd get 20mm ? Cheers.

Shelby-Right said:

What about adding a nice rounded section on each foot even if it's got gap you could add a side plate , it would look OK, sure you'd get 20mm ? Cheers.

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I may try it if I can figure out how to form the half-circle to weld on.

I just designed a replacement pivot as you suggested to be made by eMachineShop.com. Could cut the old off and weld these on on. However, it's $398 for two. If I thought I could sell them, at qty 24 it's $38 each - I don't think people would pay $76+shipping.

marshg246 said:

I may try it if I can figure out how to form the half-circle to weld on.

I just designed a replacement pivot as you suggested to be made by eMachineShop.com. Could cut the old off and weld these on on. However, it's $398 for two. If I thought I could sell them, at qty 24 it's $38 each - I don't think people would pay $76+shipping.

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Cut a piece of pipe in half , flatten a tad if required .

Best thing I ever done was get rid of the centre stand altogether, when I had the Commando it just got in the way of pushing it through the tight twisties and leaning over it sometimes dug in and lifted the back wheel, not very good when pushing hard, when I built my 850 Featherbed no centre stand at all in fact I went about 20 years with no stand at all, I now have a clamp on side stand, I don't need a stand to kick my Norton to life I have the knack, even when I had my Norton from new it didn't take long for the centre stand to show wear and the spring was also losing it spring and tension, so to me was just getting in the way and that extra-long side stand, nearly killed me one.
Using any stands to kick your Norton over will wear them out real quick they aren't design to be used for kicking, for parking only or lifting the back wheel off the ground when need to.

Ashley

ashman said:

Best thing I ever done was get rid of the centre stand altogether, when I had the Commando it just got in the way of pushing it through the tight twisties and leaning over it sometimes dug in and lifted the back wheel, not very good when pushing hard, when I built my 850 Featherbed no centre stand at all in fact I went about 20 years with no stand at all, I now have a clamp on side stand, I don't need a stand to kick my Norton to life I have the knack, even when I had my Norton from new it didn't take long for the centre stand to show wear and the spring was also losing it spring and tension, so to me was just getting in the way and that extra-long side stand, nearly killed me one.
Using any stands to kick your Norton over will wear them out real quick they aren't design to be used for kicking, for parking only or lifting the back wheel off the ground when need to.

Ashley

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Yes just get rid of the damn thing. Unless you trailer it around to shows and want to collect awards. If so , make sure the footing is solid and flat.

ashman/Torontonian,

Why not start a "I hate center stands" thread and leave this one to people trying to give me ideas to solve my problem?

I probably hate the early stand more than you, but it does not change the fact that I must make it work and I'm getting some good ideas!

I'm more confused now. It took a while, but I dug out another 69S I have. It is more or less stable on the stand. I took the stand from it - it has no signs of wear. Put it on the bike I'm fighting, and it does not touch the ground with the bike sitting on its tires. I'll have to study the difference.

Someone mentioned to me that they thought the front tire was smaller on the pre-71. When I look them up, it says 4.10x19 front and rear. This bike has 100/90-19 Avon Super Venom which are supposedly slightly smaller diameter that the originals. I can certainly put 90/90-19 on the front and would consider 90/90-19 for the rear but can't find any rear in that size. The 90/90-19 are almost 1/2" smaller in diameter.

It's an expensive PITA to do - anyone have a pre-71 that sits OK on the center stand? What tires do you have?

Another thought is 12.4" rear shocks instead of the 12.9" Norton normally uses.

marshg246 said:

Someone mentioned to me that they thought the front tire was smaller on the pre-71. When I look them up, it says 4.10x19 front and rear.

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I mentioned (in the 'Rear Shocks' PM discussion we had in July) that the original tyre/tire sizes were 3.00 (x 19) front, (also 3.50 x 19 rear) and that the standard length shocks were 12.9" - 13.0".

4.10 rear apparently introduced sometime during '69.




4.10 front and rear were supposed to have been introduced in January '71 from serial number 141783.

marshg246 said:

So, long story covered in another thread, but the engine is out of the bike right now and last night I noticed the rest of the center stand problem. The frame is bowed upward a small amount on the timing side, and about 3/8" on the drive side. This causes the crossmember and center stand mount to be higher than they should be.

So, now I need to rig up a way to pull the frame back to true. I'm pretty sure I can make something to do it, but if you know of any tubing straightener bar that would fit I would like to hear it.

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L.A.B. said:

I mentioned (in the 'Rear Shocks' PM discussion we had in July) that the original tyre/tire sizes were 3.00 (x 19) front, (also 3.50 x 19 rear) and that the standard length shocks were 12.9" - 13.0".

http://www.classicbike.biz/Norton/Brochures/1960/69CommandoBrouchure2.pdf

4.10 rear apparently introduced sometime during '69.

http://www.classicbike.biz/Norton/Brochures/1970/70Norton.pdf

4.10 front and rear were supposed to have been introduced in January '71 from serial number 141783.

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I don't remember the PM but thank you very much - that surely explains the problem! I thought I had all the available manuals - guess not

Update: Looking around at the bikes I have I found a bit of bitsa. Later frame and center stand, built as a Long Range but with a 20M3S type engine with bolt-through cylinders and replacement cases. It had
a 3.00x19 Ribbed front tire and 3.50x19 rear tire; and the hubs, rings, and spokes are just as pretty as the bike I'm working on. Switched front wheels. With the new stand, the rear wheel touches but not hard and the bike is more or less stable. With the stand I've been working on, I have about 1/4" of clearance. When I swap the rear wheels, the problem should be completely solved!

The correct tires are now installed. With the new, unworn stand installed the rear tire is still lightly on the ground - won't turn easily. With the one I've been working on it clears by 1/8" but the stand is slightly elevated by sitting on a thin metal drip tray which is on a thin carpet anti-slip pad. If they weren't there it would probably have 1/32" of clearance. So, I'll do a little more buildup. It does not need to be much higher, but it must be so that on slightly uneven ground that the stand will stably hold the bike.

Finally, the rear wheel is about 1-1/2" off the ground and the bike is not leaning. Now if I can just get the powder coat off the stand I can paint it and I'll finally be ready to test this bike. To get to this point:
1) Straightened the bottom frame tubes
2) Switched to the correct tires.
3) Built-up the stops on the stand. Chose to do it there instead of on the frame as welding on a more-or-less finished bike is not appealing to me.
4) Built-up the "feet" of the stand. Would have been much easier to do the half pipe suggestion by Shelby-Right and if I ever do it again, I will do that. I felt too deep into weld buildup.

Glad you got it sorted .

Shelby-Right said:

Glad you got it sorted .

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Turned out that I overdid it! The stand is now too vertical and if you try to kick it on the stand it rolls off the stand - at least that easy to fix. The really good news is the bike is off the table, and running and riding great

Greg, any truth to the rumour that you are offering a rebuild service for the these early center stands?

Stephen Hill said:

Greg, any truth to the rumour that you are offering a rebuild service for the these early center stands?

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If you read the write-up on this bike on my site, the next to last entry (today) is this link:

I will never agree to do another pre-71 unless I install the later stand. I will never do a 69S again - the exhaust took too much of my life before the center problems.