Camshaft identification

wilkey113 · Jan 20, 2016

I recently acquired this NOS camshaft, and I'm hoping that forum members can help identify it. I was told that it's a Dunstall camshaft, but it doesn't have the "PD" stamping. The stamping on this camshaft are:

3
Y / 288
WFC

I'm having trouble uploading photos right now.

Bernhard · Jan 22, 2016

Never seen a Dunstall cam with pd on it, and I have had at least 3 in my hands.
They were not made by PD, Eddie Robinson was responsible for developing most of Dunstall’s parts, although mass production was farmed out to different places.
If you measure the diameter of the base of the cam and take that sum away from the measurement to the top of the lobe/ base of the cam, you will have the camshaft vale lift, but the timing will have to be checked with a degree disc.

wilkey113 · Jan 22, 2016

Thanks Bernhard, I appreciate the response.
I'll see if I can accurately get those measurements, and see if that helps to identify if it's usable in my motor.

Bernhard · Jan 23, 2016

Don’t be surprised if you have a Dunstall street cam like I did, and find 3 out of the four lobes are out from the correct timing.

J. M. Leadbeater · Jan 24, 2016

And there was silly old me thinking the Dunstall cams were based on the numerous cam forms Mr Hele developed / employed on his Domirace motors which Mr Dunstall ended up with after buying the Dominator race project bits when the Norton factory in Birmingham was closed....silly me.

wilkey113 · Jan 24, 2016

My hopes are that I can use this in a 650ss Norton motor, on the street. I don't really want a hot cam, and the motor will be set up in basically stock form.

Rohan · Jan 24, 2016

wilkey113 said:
My hopes are that I can use this in a 650ss Norton motor, on the street. I don't really want a hot cam, and the motor will be set up in basically stock form.

In that case you should be looking for a stock cam, so you know what you have.... ?

wilkey113 · Jan 24, 2016

Thanks Rohan,
Certainly that makes sense, but until I find such a camshaft, I'd like to still identify what I have. Since I already own it, and it's NOS, it would be ideal if I could simply use what I already own. And if not, I feel that it's best to identify it, so if I trade it, I can properly say exactly what it is.
Since the motor I have, is a 650ss, a mild cam would be fine. I just don't want a hot cam or racing cam, since I'm not planning any other engine modifications.
Thanks
Jeff

triumph2 · Jan 24, 2016

Also remember that the smaller the engine the bigger the cam acts. If the cam is strong for an 850 or even 750 it might be too peaky for a 650 on the street.

bad_friday · Jan 25, 2016

Have a look at Dave Comeau's website: http://atlanticgreen.com/camsurvey.htm.
And here http://www.nortonownersclub.org/noc-cha ... /752745532 is another discussuion about camshafts.

Fritz

Bernhard · Jan 25, 2016

J. M. Leadbeater said:
And there was silly old me thinking the Dunstall cams were based on the numerous cam forms Mr Hele developed / employed on his Domirace motors which Mr Dunstall ended up with after buying the Dominator race project bits when the Norton factory in Birmingham was closed....silly me.

Well, don't beleive everything that Dunstall printed, it clearly couldn’t have come from the 500 Domiracer cam/engine that Mr Helne developed for Norton’s in 1961/2 season, as these were full race cams with half inch lift on their own, running on eccentric homemade rockers/ajusters , bucket cam followers, with longer push rods as discussed previously else where.
From my own personal experience if Paul Dunstall was an expert camshaft maker then I clearly should not have been sold by him a “Dunstall street cam” that had two inlet lobes as much as 11 degrees apart :!: :!:

:shock:

lcrken · Jan 25, 2016

Bernhard said:
Never seen a Dunstall cam with pd on it, and I have had at least 3 in my hands.
They were not made by PD, Eddie Robinson was responsible for developing most of Dunstall’s parts, although mass production was farmed out to different places.
If you measure the diameter of the base of the cam and take that sum away from the measurement to the top of the lobe/ base of the cam, you will have the camshaft vale lift, but the timing will have to be checked with a degree disc.

Some had the PD and some didn't. I've had two that had the PD, one "street" cam, and one "race" cam with needle bearings and pressure oil feed to the lobes. This is a picture of the markings on the race cam.

Ken

Rohan · Jan 25, 2016

Don't suppose you have looked at the timing figures for that race cam.
The glimpse of those lobes looks lumpy and then some....

We diverge a little from the PO quest here, maybe his cam needs checking for some timing figures.

wilkey113 · Jan 25, 2016

Thanks for those photos Ken.
I finally got to get my photos on to Photobucket. Here at the links:

http://i1228.photobucket.com/albums/ee4 ... ssbmea.png

http://i1228.photobucket.com/albums/ee4 ... at1mxo.png

After seeing your Dunstall cam, it looks as if mine is stamped WEC, rather than WFC. Possibly just cut off at the bottom.
The cam is still greasy and in it's original grease paper.

Any further information and help, would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks
Jeff

lcrken · Jan 25, 2016

The pictures help a lot, Jeff. I think what you have is a Dunstall MK 3 Street camshaft for an Atlas engine. I could be wrong, but that's what it looks like to me. Dunstall came out with the MK 3 around 1968, or maybe 1969.

Ken

lcrken · Jan 25, 2016

Rohan said:
Don't suppose you have looked at the timing figures for that race cam.
The glimpse of those lobes looks lumpy and then some....

We diverge a little from the PO quest here, maybe his cam needs checking for some timing figures.

I'm afraid you're right, Rohan. I never used the cam in an engine, so never measured the profile.

Ken

wilkey113 · Jan 26, 2016

Thanks Ken, I appreciate the info. And I do believe you're correct. In talking with the gentleman that I got the cam from, it came with a P11 that the original owner bought some Dunstall bits for, but never used.
I'm assuming this came wouldn't be good for a stock set up 650ss motor? What's your take on that?
Thanks
Jeff

lcrken · Jan 26, 2016

wilkey113 said:
Thanks Ken, I appreciate the info. And I do believe you're correct. In talking with the gentleman that I got the cam from, it came with a P11 that the original owner bought some Dunstall bits for, but never used.
I'm assuming this came wouldn't be good for a stock set up 650ss motor? What's your take on that?
Thanks
Jeff

I don't think you'd get that much benefit from it in a stock 650ss motor. Generally you need to bump up the CR along with adding the cam to really see some improvement. I have to admit that I'm a little biased against Dunstall bits in terms of lack of quality control. Not everyone agrees with me on that.

Ken

wilkey113 · Jan 27, 2016

Thanks Ken, I know what you mean, and I believe you're correct in regards to quality control.
In regards to your advise that I wouldn't see much improvement with this cam unless I bumped up the compression ratio, would you think that I could use the cam, and expect "normal" performance from a 650ss motor?

lcrken · Jan 27, 2016

wilkey113 said:
Thanks Ken, I know what you mean, and I believe you're correct in regards to quality control.
In regards to your advise that I wouldn't see much improvement with this cam unless I bumped up the compression ratio, would you think that I could use the cam, and expect "normal" performance from a 650ss motor?

Realize I'm only guessing here, but I think it would probably work OK as is. Dunstall did advertise it as a street cam, not a race cam, and the duration is somewhere between a stock Commando cam and a 2S cam, so it shouldn't really be all that extreme.

Ken