Yet another Atlas question...headlight

MikeG

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In examining the headlight mounts on the Atlas project I've taken on I noticed that the bolt holes on either side are different sizes. The left hand one looks Ok for a 3/8 dia. bolt, but the right hand is much larger. They are both round, not slotted, and there is a backup washer made into the inside of the ear. Did they perhaps use an eccentric bolt in the larger hole for side to side adjustment, or do I have a mismatched set?
 
All my featherbeds are 5/16 cycle headlight buckets and matching slotted ears
3/8 is not original = butchered-bastardized- ? early commando?
can be fixed with money = new or hours of corrective sheet metal work or live with it....
 
Agree with DynoDave ..... It has been bastardized. Probably the PO found the welded in nuts inside the headlight buckets to be broken loose due to vibration, as mine were. The broken welds usually take out a good portion of the bucket shell as well.

I rebuilt my buckets by welding in a washer on inside and outside of the bucket around the original hole, welded a 5/16-18 nut to the inside washer, and used body filler to fair in the outside washers. Chrome 5/16 bolts are readily available to replace the original cycle thread bolts. If you are a purist, you could make the same repair with 5/16 cycle thread bolts.

Slick
 
It looks to me that the PO dude lost the spacers, and welded in some washers to fill the gap. Sad.

You can probably live with it after some cleanup and paint. Or grind them off and repair the "ears", then get proper spacers.

How are the welded in nuts in the headlight bucket?

Here is what the ears should look like ......

https://andover-norton.co.uk/en/shop-details/14962/headlamp-bracket-r-h-black-painted-

The missing spacers are part #030058. See http://classicbike.biz/Norton/Parts/1960s/NortonParts1963_1968.pdf

Slick
 
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None of my headlamp brackets (65 and 66 slimline) have this kind of hole. All are round and ment for a 5/16" screw.
Also on the parts list (63-68) the brackets show round holes.
 
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Just checked.... my 63, 66 and 68 have the 5/16 slots.
The 60 manxman has the welded big hole washer style we see in these other early slimlines. I guess I should have looked there too. The initial OP has early headlight ears not butchered ones...my bad.
The parts book is, as usual, notoriously bad with old drawings for the later parts book. Nothing new there...
 
I have always been under the impression that the slotted brackets came in with the Commando and the round hole type were not made anymore ,so any featherbed with slotted has probably been crashed!!.
 
so any featherbed with slotted has probably been crashed!!.

Mainly a theory and for research:
Being as the early slimlines had MCH61 healights and the later with SS700. It seems the round hole was for early headlights (5/16 MCH61) (like the 60 manxman) and later ears (slots) changed with the headlights.
My 3 road slimlines are around 3k, 7k and 8k miles in nice original seemingly uncrashed condition and only show old age patina and shop dust. All do have slots in the headlight ears and 5/16 SS700 buckets.

I don't have access to many S1 commando around here, so the slot size for early commando are unsure to me.
MCH66 had either 5/16 or 3/8 (on a S2 Commando highrider)
 
Might it have something to do with the type of headlight? This bike has the painted shell with the speedo mounted in it.
 
It could also be that the change came in just after the move from Norton to AMC. sometime after 63/64, with a change of suppliers . The AMC mob had very little respect for anything that Norton had done before ,sacked all but a couple of staff ,made stupid changes and soon found themselves unable to make the parts ,had to go round the dealers to get stock to finish the bikes. I occasionally meet with the AMC storeman of the time and listen to his stories of what happened after the move.
 
I have always been under the impression that the slotted brackets came in with the Commando and the round hole type were not made anymore ,so any featherbed with slotted has probably been crashed!!.

The slotted lamp brackets / upper cover tubes were introduced 1964/5 by Plumstead ( #031544/5). Slotted brackets were fitted on Teledraulic forks as well. The change is not related to the headlamp shell, as the Atlas scrambler introduced for 1964 had an SS700 shell and at first the non-slotted brackets, later on slotted brackets were fitted. I can only surmise the slotted brackets were introduced as a result of a change to an assembly operation.

-Knut
 
It could also be that the change came in just after the move from Norton to AMC. sometime after 63/64, with a change of suppliers . The AMC mob had very little respect for anything that Norton had done before ,sacked all but a couple of staff ,made stupid changes and soon found themselves unable to make the parts ,had to go round the dealers to get stock to finish the bikes. I occasionally meet with the AMC storeman of the time and listen to his stories of what happened after the move.

Bullocks! Build quality improved considerably at Plumstead vs. Birmingham, thanks to modern machinery and a quality management system second to none. As for employees, most Norton staff refused to move to London save for 2 or 3 men, from what I've read. Of course AMC had to sack the rest - what should they do otherwise after closure of the derelict facility? According to various accounts, sentiments against AMC among staff in Birmingham appeared to be fierce, probably more so than the other way around.
As for parts shortage, that problem appears to have arosen at the end (1968) to finish off the last batches, at which time Commando production was gearing up and N_V didn't want to restock for models at end of life. The amount of buy-back is unfounded though and may be exaggerated or just invented, as are many tales of this period. AMC made 7500 hybrids in addition to the Dominator models. It goes without saying that parts supply had to be flawless while bikes were built in high numbers.
As for "stupid changes", please name them!

-Knut
 
Do we agree the round hole tube top cover headlight bracket are 24994/5 (in 1963/65 IPL)?
#031544/5 are the 5/16 slotted type (66-68 IPL) and continued on S1 command 68-69-70 at least on the fastback model.
Total change in 71...here in US

However, I would think the change overs were not clean and clear cut as headlight type or production model year, or parts book documentation.
 
[QUOTE="

However, I would think the change overs were not clean and clear cut as headlight type or production model year, or parts book documentation.[/QUOTE]


This for sure. Thank you Dave and everyone else who answered. At least now I know I need to either fabricate or locate one more spacer/bushing for the one mount.
 
Do we agree the round hole tube top cover headlight bracket are 24994/5 (in 1963/65 IPL)?
#031544/5 are the 5/16 slotted type (66-68 IPL) and continued on S1 command 68-69-70 at least on the fastback model.
Total change in 71...here in US

However, I would think the change overs were not clean and clear cut as headlight type or production model year, or parts book documentation.

You are splitting hairs on a simple minor item that was put there to enable the bike assembler at the factory to make either LH or RH dip depending on whether the bike was exported ….or not.
 
You are splitting hairs on a simple minor item that was put there to enable the bike assembler at the factory to make either LH or RH dip depending on whether the bike was exported ….or not.

I would think you don't get it...the bucket type has nothing to do with the light unit.
Simple progression of bucket holders(fork covers) and separate progression of bucket types and their apparent varying transition time frames.
Information... not a hair cut
 
Do we agree the round hole tube top cover headlight bracket are 24994/5 (in 1963/65 IPL)?
#031544/5 are the 5/16 slotted type (66-68 IPL) and continued on S1 command 68-69-70 at least on the fastback model.
Total change in 71...here in US

However, I would think the change overs were not clean and clear cut as headlight type or production model year, or parts book documentation.

My experience supports your assessment, Dave. My Atlas, a 62 build model, has a round hole on the right. What was originally on the left, I cannot say for sure, because I replaced the left after a crash in 1966. The replacement part circa 1966-1967, had the slotted hole.

On my Atlas, both right and left support ears did not have welded on washers as the OP's, but rather used spacers (the shiny part in the picture).

Yet another Atlas question...headlight

Slick
 
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Just checked the 60 manxman, It definitely has spot welded thick washer/spacers. Large holes (.513"or?13mm?) covered with big washers outside and 5/16 CEI bolts. Allows adjustability considering there is a fat speedo cable coming out the bucket.
 
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