Timing Cover Fit (2010)

Installing the timing cover on the 850 Commando motor I noticed that the cam shaft does not come through dead centre of the oil seal. The camshaft looks to be about ten thou offset. Now would this be because the post in the idler gear is bent? How did this situation develop? How does one correct this condition?
No idea on the history of the motor as it came to me in pieces.

What generally happens is at some point the cam nut was removed and the idler spindle was not supported. Extened out from the soft casing, the spindle will wow out the bore and become loose fit. Then when the cam chain is adjusted the spindle will pull in to the adjustment. The cover is then put on and the spindle is pulled back to it's home position tightening the cam chain and pulling the cam off center. Needless to say, adjusting the cam chain will be almost impossible to get right and a catastrophic event can happen(broken timing/cam chain).

The long term remedy for this is to bore and sleeve the case where the spindle goes. The short term solution is a have a sacrificial timing cover (should be part of a standard "Norton" tool kit) cut out to reveal the adjuster bolts. This cover will also be used to support the spindle during cam nut removal.

Through this topic you may see many option for this tool.

Educational and preventive post pvissreil. Here's a simple one slice TS cover sitting on a ledge surrounded by wall parts art. I send various special tool around if need be.

Norvill sells a tool that doesnt require finding a timing cover. The current price shown is 35 pounds , but given how hard it is to find a damaged timing cover to cut up and the cost of a usable one, it is probably worth it. I do not have one of these tools (the Norvil) and if one of the members has experience with it, it would be nice to get a report on whether they are happy with the quality.

http://www.norvilmotorcycle.co.uk/
http://www.norvilmotorcycle.co.uk/444400.htm

Russ

Borrow one from one of our members, just ask.

Dave
69S

Keep in mind the oil pump seal to TS cover is dependent on the TS cover gasket and oil pump nipple thickness. These come in two matched sets, one for 750 the other 850 specs but can be switched out to either 750 or 850 as long as using the right matched set. 850 has a bit thicker TS gasket IIRC.

I would have thought if the timing cover dowels are fully engaged and the cam shaft is still out of line there's a good chance the cam bearings have failed. Not good as these bushes need line reamed very accurately and parallel to the crankcase mouth.

Cash

When you turn the cam does the end of the cam rotate smoothly or does it "wobble"? I had a Commando brought to me leaking oil into the points housing, that had the end of the cam "bent" and would turn in an "orbit" in the timing cover. Needless to say it made the oils seal ineffective.

If the cam bearings are worn to the extent that you see 0.10" offset, you should be able to to "wobble" the cam by hand if the cam sprocket and chain are removed.

Ron L said:

If the cam bearings are worn to the extent that you see 0.10" offset, you should be able to to "wobble" the cam by hand if the cam sprocket and chain are removed.

Click to expand...

And if the head is off as the valve spring pressure will remove all of the free play.

Cash

Have decided to cut up one of three sacrificial timing covers that I dug up out of dead storage in order to create the idler support tool. All 3 are damaged in different ways from P.O.s. Two I suspect are from 750 's as they weigh less and gasket mating surface is thinner. #1 has internal casting number of 06-3112 and merely needs a broken off pillar bolt removed from points cavity. #2 has internal casting number of 06-1072 AB and one of the pillar bolt hole areas is mangled up.Also small screw from pressure relief valve drill path is missing ! #3 I suspect is heavier 850 type 06-1072/4 and has a note stuck to the rocker oil line feed area saying wrong helicoil. Yes this has a helicoil insert unlike the other 2 which are pure aluminum cut and look like different threads than this #3 cover with the note. Did this cover #3 use a different bolt? It is the thicker one and would require more drilling-hacksawing. At present my choice would be timing cover #2. Yes?

Torontonian I don't know that your T/C's are knackered that bad to warrant cutting them up. You could be subject to threatening pm's or worse if you do it.

Who am I to judge though? I'll post a link to an earlier thread with my experiences doing this. In short the old style covers work for more engine types than do the later types with the Norton name cast in. Maybe you could sell one and buy an older style but then they may be harder to get and more scarce (so the threatening pm's could escalate to something worse). Anyway bro here's the link:

lesson-making-intermediate-shaft-support-tool-t4672.html?hilit=timing%20pinion%20support%20tool

Rennie,
I was hoping you would come up with that thread. It's one that should be required reading for Norton owners. I didn't have it handy like you do.

Dave
69S

Oh Gawd , now I have the fear in me Lord Vader, all 3 covers have some Norton name cast into 'em.

Just drill a clearance hole from the front of the cut timing case.

A thought.

Cash

If cutting up the sacred Norton timing cover gives conscience issues, here is the tool made by Ludwig:

Having this issue and just ordered the conical tool to ease assembly of the points seal.
However, noticed the spindle for the idler sprocket can be moved left to right about 0.020".
Thats measuring over both shafts (cam and idler) with hands pulling shaft ends as close together
as I can which loosens the chain, then with hands only, spreading shafts as far apart as I can.
Difference in measurements is about 0.020". Its easily visible movement and I'm checking to
keep idler sprocket pressed all the way inboard throughout. HOW BAD is this???
And, the idler shaft/spindle has a big slot in the end of it which I can put a large screwdriver in
and, with a wrench on the screwdriver, I can rotate the spindle either direction. Its quite snug
but not really torqued up tight. Is this NORMAL??? if not how BAD???