Swingarm oil 101 needed

The new build is running excellent. I'm actually running out of things to tweak. One annoying development is the increase in oil leaking out of the swing arm reservoir. I guess the new O-rings have broken in or something. It's become a reliable mess after each ride now. I filled the reservoir completely (140w) through the top bolt but wonder how long it will last leaking this much.
My question is what are my options to reduce or stop the leaking? Are there other options besides milling the swing arm to an MKIII system?

I wonder what I could have done wrong when I put this together for it to leak so badly?

Roadrash said:

My question is what are my options to reduce or stop the leaking?

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Simply, leave it alone, and allow the excess oil to drain. The pivot doesn't need to be kept in a constantly "wet" condition as the bushes are made of "Oilite" (sintered bronze).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oilite

Ha don't ya know you and your Commando are such bad examples of im competence it shames us to read when the expected normals are claimed by proper Nortoneers to last a life time or top off a bit every 3 to 4 decades whether it needs it or not, at least that's what I've been told till I gave up and became a dedicated greaser. On the 750's I'm lead to believe that factory just couldn't figure out a good sealing system with all the wiggles so basically its a total loss system that only needs to retain enough to keep the rust off the spindle as no way in god's grey highways are the sintered soft bushes gonna ever wear on the super hardened spindle surface, but is prone to rust spawling away. Correct way is to put lube in the side zerk by clever pump oiler. Others may advise on escalating levels of upgrades but in mean time put some engine honey or other thick sticky lube that actually does flow some what and monitor the amount of time till it stays cleaner then keep mental track to reintroduce the mess when intuition tells ya it might be dry enough to rust as friction restriction will never be an issue whether well oiled or by dry powdered grinding paste rust dust. Spindle collars are the cat's meow upgrade while attention is on that area. Could pull apart to smear grease on once a year or two. Hehehe reflect on my grins not wiping or diapering mine no more knowing it'll last a long time unattended. We just got a report recently of a new owner finding couldn't get oil in then discovering caked grease [put in w/o mods so not much in there] yet spindle slipped right out and ready to just be properly oiling drooling again. Easy greaser path is open the spindle holes some and spiral groove the bushes then put ordinary grease gun on the factory zerk till oozes out then wipe up done till next guy buys it. Don't worry there always the wipe down on the good stuff.

That first picture looks more like a "rusty/dirty water" stain rather than a oil leak... Are you dead set sure oil is from the swingarm .... Eg, is the breather tube located nearby ond "blowing" residue around...

Somehow you could work out how to put an oil reservoir under your seat so you can work out what's going on. Both my commandos have this system. Tthe 850 has a drilled centre bolt with a brased on 3/16 copper brake pipe. a 3/16 vacuum tube [ oil proof ] runs up to a 30mm bottle under the seat which is inverted and has another pc of 3/216 copper brake pipe hanging out the top. [ its a flip top bottle which I have drilled out to 3/16. I just fill the bottle up via a small hole drilled in its bottom [ which is on top now ] . I top up the bottle every 6 months or so. it does leak out but not that quickly.
With the 750. I have done the same except the grease nipple on the r/h end plate has been modified to take the brased on pc of copper brake pipe which has been bent upwards after tightening. Neither bike leaks much but they do leak.

If your bottle leaks out in a week or 2, then pull it apart and find out what's wrong.

did you use straight 140wt or some of that 85w140 stuff? I found that with straight 140w my leak there almost completely went away.

Good input Gents,
#1 it's anticipated to leak,
2- It doesn't need all that oil anyway. I just need to keep it from becoming dry.
3- I'll look for straight 140w. I used a multi viscosity 75w-140w and that + being filled completely may be why it's leaking so much.

Thanks Everyone

This is what I did.

I saw this on a post from someone elses mod.


I inject 140w with syringe until it dribbles out the zerk fitting hole, and the hose tucks under the seat next to the oil tank.




When I see the hose has emptied out, I refill it.
About 2 times each riding season.
It still leaks a little due to it's simple design.

Guido said:

This is what I did.

I saw this on a post from someone elses mod.

I inject 140w with syringe until it dribbles out the zerk fitting hole, and the hose tucks under the seat next to the oil tank.

When I see the hose has emptied out, I refill it.
About 2 times each riding season.
It still leaks a little due to it's simple design.

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Exactly the reasoning I used. Some drools out. Put some in once in a while. No big deal.

hehe did I not mention Ms Peel with custom perfect cradle and new swing arm had clear reservoir installed on the center clamp bolt for one winter full of STP and engine break in oil, way thicker than straight 140 wt while hanging still from rafters to have it all leak out, so I saw the light and took it off before ever riding with that constantly over filled mis guided leaker modification. Ms Peel was allowed to park on marble Hotel entrances while I attended weekend long seminars as a greaser not a constant leaker.



What I did with the clear tubing instead.

An old post from 2008-

They usually leak because it's hard to find the recommended SAE 140 lube. I have been using a 50\50 mix of 90W gear oil and STP which thickens up quite nicely and seems to stay in much better.

I wouldn't think many of you would have even seen sae140 oil, 75/140 will only ever be sae 75 in a swing arm, you would never push 140 in with a little plastic syringe,probably the reason they put a grease nipple on the swing arm, you want iso 460 or 680, the people who use it normaly use lots of it so a litre wouldn't be missed, probably greatfully exchanged for beer

Although it was not on the shelf locally, they brought it in in a couple days.

http://www.napaonline.com/Catalog/Catal ... 0006410049

Once it sinks in [if ever does] the only reason for something oily hydrocarbon based around the spindle is for rust protection, ya might shop for very sticky thick engine break in oil that flows like warm tar. Room temp tar has now be found to drip once about every 70 yrs.

I suppose the later Mark II/IIA's and Mark III's swingarm seals are of a better design, for the price they charge they better be. If the flanges of the earlier swingarm bushings are of the same dimensions I would think you could use the later type swingarm seals. However, these seals seem to be a little bit fragile. To try and overcome this I beveled the rear edges of the gearbox cradle to prevent any sharp edges from cutting the seal lips. Also the area where the seal slides onto the cradle I left unpainted and even polished the surfaces a bit with a Scotchbrite disc. To prevent the seals from being cut or deformed while passing over the spindle bore in the gearbox cradle I fabricated an aluminum 'dummy' swingarm spindle and inserted it in the gearbox cradle before installing the swingarm. Once the swingarm is in position, I removed the 'dummy' spindle with a long 3/16 inch bolt and then inserted the real swingarm spindle.

Another thing that I considered is if you fill the swingarm spindle with oil,you will get leaks past the seals due to the oils heat expansion. So I vented the top swingarm spindle bolt and installed a tube to run overboard.

I have about 1500 miles on my bike since I assembled my swingarm and amazingly I have not had any oil leaks and I am using multi-viscosity oil. Before I did this work on my swingarm it always drooled oil everytime I serviced the swingarm. Here is a picture of my 'dummy' swingarm spindle and the 3/16 inch dia. extraction bolt.



Dummy Swingarm Spindle with ruler

splatt said:

75/140 will only ever be sae 75 in a swing arm
That's what I realized after what Irutt posted, and I believe the answer to (most) of my leaking problem.

pete.v said:

Although it was not on the shelf locally, they brought it in in a couple days.

http://www.napaonline.com/Catalog/Catal ... 0006410049

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Thanks for the link pete.v

I originally used 20-50 oil in my reservoir's ,but then went to 90 oil. It leaks out a little but I only top the 30ml bottle up maybe twice a year. My tube on the 850 is inside the frame area so not seen. The 750 tucks in behind the z bracket. I used black oil resistant vacuum tubing.

Try Morris oils 680 steam cylinder oil, does come in a 5 litre pack

kerinorton said:

I originally used 20-50 oil in my reservoir's ,but then went to 90 oil. It leaks out a little but I only top the 30ml bottle up maybe twice a year. My tube on the 850 is inside the frame area so not seen. The 750 tucks in behind the z bracket. I used black oil resistant vacuum tubing.

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Good plan

There are some ingenious swinging arm lubricating 'solutions' on here. I'm surprised no-one has plumbed in a pump yet...

But what are these 'solutions' really solving?

When Norman White did my cradle and swinging arm he said "it's got all new improved seals and has been filled with the correct oil, it does not need touching now and will outlast you"

That's good enough for me anyway!