rough running

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After getting my 850 Fastback mongrel running again after 21 years ( it was running pretty well then, 4,500 miles after full rebuild), it now has the following symptoms: Runs on RH cylinder only at idle. LH joins in , but hesitantly, as it is revved out of gear. While riding, same thing happens, and once above 50mph in top gear, it runs consistently on both cylinders, and seems to go well.

The LH plug was changed while doing 550 miles on the trip to Normandy, with no change in symptoms. It has a long timing case breather pipe going to rear , with a one way valve. That is discharging quite a lot more oil than I remember from 2003. There is also oil on inside of Fairing on LHS, opposite the barrels, and oil showing on top two fins at central rear and rear left of barrels. Oil also ends up down lower LHS of bike. The LH plug was oily when checked on the trip. It is using oil too fast , according to tank refilling.

I couldn’t see state of inlet oil seals when checking tappets before trip. The end of the LH silencer, internally , looks basically dry, but maybe not as clean as RHS.

I suspect excessive oil in the combustion chamber as most likely. I can remove LH exhaust for more evidence in downpipe?

I cleaned both concentrics before starting it, but it is possible there is still some pilot passage debris, as I only inserted thin wire from top, rear and pilot adjuster entry points.
Ideas for useful checks to gather more evidence, before head removal please?
 
As you say, after a long lay up, I'd also still suspect the pilot circuit in that carb. Needs a carb cleaner than can dissolve old fuel / varnish and an airline to blow through.

Perhaps some things to look at before you take the head off:
My oil seepage from the head was caused by 3 things. The drain in the head was blocked, which I cleared with a guitar string, only removing the valve cover to get to it. It needed the head re-torquing (then re check valve clearances) and thirdly, I put in the one way reed valve you mention. I have read that these reed valves can get blocked with oil and water emulsion. Having stood for years, I wonder if condensation is being blown into that valve, blocking it?
 
The reed in the one way valve can get stuck. Take it off and apart and clean. It may help.
 
After getting my 850 Fastback mongrel running again after 21 years ( it was running pretty well then, 4,500 miles after full rebuild), it now has the following symptoms: Runs on RH cylinder only at idle. LH joins in , but hesitantly, as it is revved out of gear. While riding, same thing happens, and once above 50mph in top gear, it runs consistently on both cylinders, and seems to go well.

The LH plug was changed while doing 550 miles on the trip to Normandy, with no change in symptoms. It has a long timing case breather pipe going to rear , with a one way valve. That is discharging quite a lot more oil than I remember from 2003. There is also oil on inside of Fairing on LHS, opposite the barrels, and oil showing on top two fins at central rear and rear left of barrels. Oil also ends up down lower LHS of bike. The LH plug was oily when checked on the trip. It is using oil too fast , according to tank refilling.

I couldn’t see state of inlet oil seals when checking tappets before trip. The end of the LH silencer, internally , looks basically dry, but maybe not as clean as RHS.

I suspect excessive oil in the combustion chamber as most likely. I can remove LH exhaust for more evidence in downpipe?

I cleaned both concentrics before starting it, but it is possible there is still some pilot passage debris, as I only inserted thin wire from top, rear and pilot adjuster entry points.
Ideas for useful checks to gather more evidence, before head removal please?
If you want you can change the valve stem seals without removing the head, I copied the tool Ludwig made, pictured in the thread link below:-

valve stem oil seal tools
 
thanks for replies, Ludwig device is clever!
The one way valve is up near the top of shock, 2/3rds along the long breather pipe. I took it off earlier, and it is clear of obstructions and pretty easy to blow through.( off a car, very cheap, and worked well in 2002, reducing oil leaks. I will find a 16 thou wire too!
 
I will find a 16 thou wire too!
The drill is better, the wire tends to push the dirt back into the primary circuit. Guess what happens to the dirt when you start the bike, it comes forward and you have to pray it does not stick in the jet again. The drill has flutes where the dirt is placed as you twist the drill and when you remove the drill the dirt stays in the flutes until you clean the drill, none stays in the carb.
 
The drill is better, the wire tends to push the dirt back into the primary circuit. Guess what happens to the dirt when you start the bike, it comes forward and you have to pray it does not stick in the jet again. The drill has flutes where the dirt is placed as you twist the drill and when you remove the drill the dirt stays in the flutes until you clean the drill, none stays in the carb.
Yes,
micro drills worked good for me as well, but it was easier to source equivalent metric sizes.
But a word of warning go easy when using them, if you break them off inside the jet you're stuffed.
 
Yes,
micro drills worked good for me as well, but it was easier to source equivalent metric sizes.
But a word of warning go easy when using them, if you break them off inside the jet you're stuffed.
and have just found a new 1/16 drill bit in the drill drawer!
 
Be sure to confirm good spray up out the two tiny holes in the floor of carb throat, one either side of the slot where the throttle slide seats in. If poor spray there, suspect pilot. Read Bushmans Guies to Amal Tuning, in the information thread on this forum or elsewhere on the google.
He describes a method of drilling out the blanked off side of pilot drilling, running a tap in to take a cut off throttle stop screw. Then you can blow/poke/see right through pilot drilling when pilot scew is out. Seal off new opening with the cut off screw.
 
and have just found a new 1/16 drill bit in the drill drawer!
Jan, it' s not a 1/16" drill bit. It's a 16/1000" drill bit and you dont put it in a drill to use it. There are these "hand drill" kits that have a wand with a chuck on one end which you chuck the desired drill bit into to use manually..
 
The drill is better, the wire tends to push the dirt back into the primary circuit. Guess what happens to the dirt when you start the bike, it comes forward and you have to pray it does not stick in the jet again. The drill has flutes where the dirt is placed as you twist the drill and when you remove the drill the dirt stays in the flutes until you clean the drill, none stays in the carb.
I am not familiar with cleaning out Concentric carbs .... yet ... but a drill bit? As Skoti mentions, there is a risk of permanent damage. Isn't ultrasonic cleaning working for these carbs?

- Knut
 
As Skoti mentions, there is a risk of permanent damage.
No risk, you only twist it with your fingers, the hole is 17 thou so a 16 thou drill has clearance but is close enough for the deposits to break up and be removed leaving the pilot jet at 17 thou. John Healy has been doing this for 40 years with no issues. If you get one of the drills at 16 thou it will bend easily, they are not hardened.
 
No risk, you only twist it with your fingers, the hole is 17 thou so a 16 thou drill has clearance but is close enough for the deposits to break up and be removed leaving the pilot jet at 17 thou. John Healy has been doing this for 40 years with no issues. If you get one of the drills at 16 thou it will bend easily, they are not hardened.
Yes ,
a good tip which I think was mentioned on this site some time ago is to araldite the drill bit into a WD40 straw, I found that made it easier to gently twist it back and forth with fingers.

I know we're going to have to dodge flak for suggesting a drill bit to clean out carbs, but there you go....
 
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No Flak . Where do I get said micro drill bit ?
Toronto , Canadaland .
These 1/64" drill bits came from Home Hardware. I glued one in a ball inflator
 

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