Protests Compared

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NORTSTER1974

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A month or so ago there was a protest in Virginia, Patriots protesting the infringement of their 2nd Amendment RIGHTS. Ugh, looks like the protesters were armed to the teeth. A totally peaceful protest. Don't Tread on Me. This protest was portrayed by the media with more negativity than anything else that's going on today.

Not an incident of any violence or destruction. I really liked the old dude that said" If they try to take our guns, there will be a second Revolution".

Bring it up a few months to today, a cop was filmed, knee on the neck of a handcuffed man. He died. I saw the videos. UNFUCKINGBELIEVABLE! Not a fan of cops, or criminals for that matter. Everyone deserves Justice, not mob rule and violence. Even the Cop. If this were happening in my town, I would be thankful for my Second Amendment RIGHTS!
These A holes are being bussed in to destroy the town. Looting, Burning, Destroying, everything in their sight. Businesses, buildings, Private, Public, whatever they can Destroy.
The media thinks it is Justified. I haven't heard any of them condemn it. LOSERS! The Cop will pay for his actions. Everyone is granted a Right to a FAIR trial by our Constitution.

Well anyway here's a video of what's going on in Minneapolis, MN. I guess that's OK. WTF,
 
Somewhat of a false equivalency. Gun rights activits have not been being killed systematically since the Portuguese started the slave trade in what, the 17th century. I have one of those gun nuts come on my property to shoot deer. Gun nut I say because he's got stuff in his windows decrying his being attacked for owning guns. No one is taking his efing guns away I told him. But there's certainly no reason to own a bunch of semi auto weapons that fire 100's of rounds a minute. I own guns too, and even have a concealed permit. But do you know what it took to get that permit? A 50 year old document that stated I had a 'honorable discharge' from the army. Now that's nuts. I only got it for effect, there's no way I'd carry a gun around in public.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not advocating violence and I'm sure no one in the real media is advocating violence, they're just reporting what they hear from what I've heard. But we have the loon in the WH condoning violence several times. But there are people in the streets that have been protesting peacefully for decades and nothing has changed. I've had my benefits at white privilege in my 76 years. GI bill, tax benefits from home mortage, lots of other stuff things we take for granted. For generations the non whites have been subjigated for far to long and I can certainly appreciate what they feel.

Every day that I go out with this virus present, that's how people of color feel every day of their lives, and now is added the virus on top of that. Imagine.

The only reason people carry guns to a demonstration is to threaten people as far as I'm concerned. I think they should be arrested for threatening behavior, better known as 'brandishing firearms.' The sooner the better. This lunacy has got to stop, it's just fueled by bad marketing.
 
Looters/rioters aren't "threatening" violence, they are PERPETRATING it.

Not a SINGLE 2nd Amendment (peaceful) protester "threatened" violence. The rankest anti-gun nuts could be right in their faces (ACTUALLY THREATENING violence), and not a single shot would be fired, nor would they even POINT their lawful firearms at anyone.

The DIFFERENCE?

One group is aware of the law, and obeys it. The other are ruining INNOCENT peoples lives and livelihoods, wantonly robbing innocent businesses, and destroying public property that all law-abiding taxpayers have to eventually pay for in higher taxes, resulting in LESS available public funds to help the most needy.

The above is not "opinion", it is FACT.
 
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America clutched it's pearls when black athletes tried kneeling during the National Anthem...

Re visit Dave's post if you are still confused as to why things are the way they are.
 
Not a SINGLE 2nd Amendment (peaceful) protester "threatened" violence. The rankest anti-gun nuts could be right in their faces (ACTUALLY THREATENING violence), and not a single shot would be fired, nor would they even POINT their lawful firearms at anyone.

Well that's just not true:


As NPete suggested, reread Dog's post, at the least the first sentence of it
 
Somewhat of a false equivalency. Gun rights activits have not been being killed systematically since the Portuguese started the slave trade in what, the 17th century. I have one of those gun nuts come on my property to shoot deer. Gun nut I say because he's got stuff in his windows decrying his being attacked for owning guns. No one is taking his efing guns away I told him. But there's certainly no reason to own a bunch of semi auto weapons that fire 100's of rounds a minute. I own guns too, and even have a concealed permit. But do you know what it took to get that permit? A 50 year old document that stated I had a 'honorable discharge' from the army. Now that's nuts. I only got it for effect, there's no way I'd carry a gun around in public.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not advocating violence and I'm sure no one in the real media is advocating violence, they're just reporting what they hear from what I've heard. But we have the loon in the WH condoning violence several times. But there are people in the streets that have been protesting peacefully for decades and nothing has changed. I've had my benefits at white privilege in my 76 years. GI bill, tax benefits from home mortage, lots of other stuff things we take for granted. For generations the non whites have been subjigated for far to long and I can certainly appreciate what they feel.

Every day that I go out with this virus present, that's how people of color feel every day of their lives, and now is added the virus on top of that. Imagine.

The only reason people carry guns to a demonstration is to threaten people as far as I'm concerned. I think they should be arrested for threatening behavior, better known as 'brandishing firearms.' The sooner the better. This lunacy has got to stop, it's just fueled by bad marketing.

The shit you post is laughable. There's so much inuendo in the above post to know where to begin telling you how stupid it sounds... It would take a week of explanations for you to understand why people disagree with you.

The looting and violent protesting isn't just wrong, it's a self inflicted wound on the community where it occurs. The worst thing to happen in this country in my lifetime was the assassination of MLK, because he was right about the racism of his era, and he was right about how to behave to combat that racism. He and his peaceful protesters showed up in their Sunday church clothing and he presented his ideas. Those ideas were purely unassailable because they were righteous and because he was peaceful. He won the support of everyone who wasn't an idiot, or programmed to hate others by their childhood upbringing.

People of my generation who grew up with interracial friends and went to interracial schools during that era, don't need to be shown racism or be lectured about racism like we have never seen it. MOST people of my age grew up being educated about the unbelievable shit that was happening to black Americans just 10 years before we became adults and that injustice lingered into our adulthood. We were long haired hippies. The cops looked at us suspiciously too, so many of us know what it feels like to have a Cop stop us for no reason and just look for a reason to arrest us. (I've had it happen to me, that I"m not going to elaborate on)

There are theories that some of this protest violence is organized by antifa types who promote looting and violence because they feel it furthers some political goal they have, and the actual local people are mostly caught up in that organized frenzy. I don't find that hard to believe, but I don't think the looting and violent behavior wins over anyone to any righteous cause, but maybe those people don't have a righteous cause, unlike those who would peacefully protest the death of George Floyd.

*I think we all know that this cop who murdered George Floyd on video is a sociopath or a psychopath. I can't imagine a normal person casually and coolly kneeling on a handcuffed man's neck for any length of time, much less 8 minutes. I wouldn't ever believe that this is part of his training, and I'm sure that's this guy is going to say he was trained to do this in defense of his murdering George Floyd.

At the root of this looting and violence is the slogan most often used by Al Sharpton, "No Justice, No Peace". which is a perversion of what MLK said. There can be no justice without peace and there can be no peace without justice.

"No justice, no peace" is a call for revenge. Plain and simple. It's neither peaceful, nor just... Stupid Al Sharpton was on the television telling rioters to NOT burn down the businesses that have "black owned business" signs in their windows. This is how far away from the brilliance of MLK the struggle for equality has strayed... It's very sad.

***BTW, the assault on George Floyd was possibly the most disturbing and heinous real event I've ever witnessed.
 
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The shit you post is laughable. There's so much inuendo in the above post to know where to begin telling you how stupid it sounds... It would take a week of explanations for you to understand why people disagree with you.

The looting and violent protesting isn't just wrong, it's a self inflicted wound on the community where it occurs. The worst thing to happen in this country in my lifetime was the assassination of MLK, because he was right about the racism of his era, and he was right about how to behave to combat that racism. He and his peaceful protesters showed up in their Sunday church clothing and he presented his ideas. Those ideas were purely unassailable because they were righteous and because he was peaceful. He won the support of everyone who wasn't an idiot, or programmed to hate others by their childhood upbringing.

People of my generation who grew up with interracial friends and went to interracial schools during that era, don't need to be shown racism or be lectured about racism like we have never seen it. MOST people of my age grew up being educated about the unbelievable shit that was happening to black Americans just 10 years before we became adults and that injustice lingered into our adulthood. We were long haired hippies. The cops looked at us suspiciously too, so many of us know what it feels like to have a Cop stop us for no reason and just look for a reason to arrest us. (I've had it happen to me, that I"m not going to elaborate on)

There are theories that some of this protest violence is organized by antifa types who promote looting and violence because they feel it furthers some political goal they have, and the actual local people are mostly caught up in that organized frenzy. I don't find that hard to believe, but I don't think the looting and violent behavior wins over anyone to any righteous cause, but maybe those people don't have a righteous cause, unlike those who would peacefully protest the death of George Floyd.

*I think we all know that this cop who murdered George Floyd on video is a sociopath or a psychopath. I can't imagine a normal person casually and coolly kneeling on a handcuffed man's neck for any length of time, much less 8 minutes. I wouldn't ever believe that this is part of his training, and I'm sure that's this guy is going to say he was trained to do this in defense of his murdering George Floyd.

At the root of this looting and violence is the slogan most often used by Al Sharpton, "No Justice, No Peace". which is a perversion of what MLK said. There can be no justice without peace and there can be no peace without justice.

"No justice, no peace" is a call for revenge. Plain and simple. It's neither peaceful, nor just... Stupid Al Sharpton was on the television telling rioters to NOT burn down the businesses that have "black owned business" signs in their windows. This is how far away from the brilliance of MLK the struggle for equality has strayed... It's very sad.

You make some good points in this post, most of which I agree with. There is most certainly an agent provocateur aspect to these riots, undercover officers, Antifa etc.. No one here is advocating for destruction.

Hippie or not you could have just CUT YOUR HAIR! haha. Skin color, not so much? Your experience as a long haired hippie is not comparable AT ALL and almost insulting.

Non of us here are qualified to speak about the black experience in America. PERIOD.

I wish you would lose the first paragraph, you don't need to attack a fellow forum member to make your point.
 
The Nazis calling for violence, and the PEACEFUL 2nd amendment protesters are TWO DIFFERENT CROWDS.

EXACTLY.

The looters and the PEACEFUL civil rights protestors are TWO DIFFERENT CROWDS.

Where is the disconnect here?
 
Hippie or not you could have just CUT YOUR HAIR! haha. Skin color, not so much? Your experience as a long haired hippie is not comparable AT ALL and almost insulting.

You should read to words to David Crosby's song, "Almost cut my hair" As a kid, our long hair was a symbol of our rejection of the earlier culture. It was a symbol to everyone, that a person believed that our culture was fucked up. Everything from racism to the vietnam war, and traditional politicians were things we opposed and we displayed it in our being. Cutting our hair was an option for many. The fact is that a lot of people of all cultures, "cut their hair" and accept some bullshit philosophy or conceal their real feelings to get ahead, and many of us did not and would not "cut our hair" because we felt it resprented something we were proud of, and paid whatever price it cost in terms of not being hired for a job, or being pulled over in your '70 microbus by the cops because you look like the kind of person we need to check out...

Non of us here are qualified to speak about the black experience in America. PERIOD.

Please stop with that shit. Of course nobody knows what it's like to be any other person. What makes you think every black person has the same experience... Jesus, what irony that you think each black person has the same experience and you lecture others about their perception of another person's experience. You have very little idea of my experiences, so how would you know how it compares to anyone elses...

I wish you would lose the first paragraph, you don't need to attack a fellow forum member to make your point.

My point is that it's all just his feelings and a bunch of inuendo. It's a rebuttal of his hyperbolic post. As I said above, the rioting and looting should be condemned instead of making excuses for it. It's not the kind of thing that brought about the civil rights movement and the progress that has been made so far. MLK was smart. He obeyed the law, he made his righteous, historic statements, and no fair minded person could find a reason to oppose his words or his movement.

The rioting and looting actually give people an excuse to say, "Black people are fucked up", or at least think that privately and withhold their support for equality. The murder of George Floyd, shouldn't be remembered with stolen flat screens. I would think a candlelight vigil outside a (not burned down) police station would galvanize ALL americans that the police need to weed out the psychopaths and change the culture within police departments that make them samuri who just kill anyone, anytime they feel the need.

I don't think it has anything to do with democrats or republicans, or the president or an ex president. It's a human thing and police culture thing.

Peaceful protests get respect and support. Rioting and burning down cities do a lot to hurt the support the actual cause which the murder of George Floyd deserves.
 
Had waist length hair for 7 years of my young life, currently past my shoulders. Almost cut my hair was my anthem when I was 15 ha.
We're getting off topic here, but I think you know what I mean by the black experience in America, or you have misinterpreted my point.

I believe your following statement accurately sums up the motivation behind the initial post in this thread, well said. Remember, there are plenty of white participants in this looting as well.

"The rioting and looting actually give people an excuse to say, "Black people are fucked up", or at least think that privately and withhold their support for equality."
 
Covid 19 is being used as an excuse to promote creeping authoritarianism. Police powers are only part of the story. On one of our Facebook pages for an Australian newspaper, there was an article about developing a 'power ballad' as a protest. Authoritarianism is the same old shit it always was. The Nazis loved 'O-Fortuna from Carmina Burana'. - I lived through WW2, so I am probably more aware of what led up to it. The problem is that extremism comes in two forms - Communism and Fascism, neither of which have anything to do with democracy, however they are both common responses to failures of capitalism. Hitler grew out of the failure of the Weimer Republic which was capitalist and democratic, - but the economy failed.

 
The protests in America are serving to increase Trump's power, so he is probably not unhappy that they are occurring. Once he has the Army and National Guard doing his bidding, in a civil setting, he will be in his element.
 
"The front line was replaced with fresh agents, like magic. Big crowd, professionally organized, but nobody came close to breaching the fence. If they had they would have been greeted with the most vicious dogs, and most ominous weapons, I have ever seen. That's when people would have been really badly hurt, at least. Many Secret Service agents just waiting for action. 'We put the young ones on the front line, sir, they love it, and ... good practice."
 
ah yes, 1969...I had a '65 VW bus, long hair, a draft card (with a high lottery number) and plenty of weed...….the good old daze...can't we just all git along?
Protests Compared
 
Someone carrying a military style rifle at a peaceful protest is threatening to me. There's no place for guns at a protest. I don't want to live in a place where civilians carry guns around willy-nilly. Just the way I am. And the pseudo uniforms don't add credence. I'd like to see their DD214. I've got maybe $10K worth of guns in my house, but I have no need to show them to people.

On the other hand, I worked for a federal police force. The agents mostly were a bunch of wannabe cowboys. I was not an agent, just technical support person. Some of them were OK, but it was tiresome, and they got extra pay. But when I did dangerous stuff like climb 400' towers, I had them tell me they would never do that. I got no extra pay. There's a disconnect there somewhere.
 
"The front line was replaced with fresh agents, like magic. Big crowd, professionally organized, but nobody came close to breaching the fence. If they had they would have been greeted with the most vicious dogs, and most ominous weapons, I have ever seen. That's when people would have been really badly hurt, at least. Many Secret Service agents just waiting for action. 'We put the young ones on the front line, sir, they love it, and ... good practice."

A friend of mine had two brothers in the Victoria Police. One was killed while riding a police motorcycle. The other one was involved in crowd control at protests. When the police were standing shoulder to shoulder facing rowdy protestors and getting jostled, one of the police would usually punch the policeman next to him, in the head. It is their sense of humour, they just don't give a shit who gets hurt.
 
I’m still struggling to understand how looting and destroying your own community proves a point or enlists support for your cause. I think we need to follow the money to get the real picture. The only two lessons I’ve learned are that cameras are everywhere and I still don’t like cities.
 
Well, call it self interest but I'm just glad to be a long, long way from there.
Best thing John Howard (ex-Prime Minister) ever did was to buy back all the guns from civilians in the wake of the Port Arthur massacre.
There's way, way, way less shootings now than used to happen because a gun was in easy reach of a loony/crack-head/angry drunk/etc
...also, our cops aren't jumping out of their skin every time they get called to a "disturbance" - still can't be easy for them though.
I understand many 2nd amendment advocates think we've been emasculated, but I don't see it that way.
I hope it pans out well for you over there.
Cheers
Rob
 
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