Protect yourself

Flatspot

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I’m especially grumpy right now. I was due to go into hospital today to have a small op

cancelled at the last minute because of a bed shortage!
 

Tornado

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Here's and excellent article on this whole "they're over inflating the numbers!" Claim:


It is easy to sit back in the old arm chair and play being an epidemiologist. Point is, that is a complex profession, takes >decade to obtain the full qualifications to make proper interpretations of the data.
 

Fast Eddie

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Best not to try to draw a line because at some point we are likely to find ourselves on the wrong side of it...for one reason or another.
EXACTLY !!

We are already on the wrong side of such a line.

“Selfish motorcyclist crashes and takes up hospital bed that could have been used for blah, blah”

THATS where the logic ends up.

I am fully jabbed and do not agree with the majority of those who are against. But I do not regard them as some form of enemy.

The list of people who raise the risk of needling hospital care through their own choices is HUGE yet considering them pariahs is a new one, that in the very least, is being fanned by politicians.

Its sad that our political masters have succeeded in pitting us against each other in this way.
 

baz

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EXACTLY !!

We are already on the wrong side of such a line.

“Selfish motorcyclist crashes and takes up hospital bed that could have been used for blah, blah”

THATS where the logic ends up.

I am fully jabbed and do not agree with the majority of those who are against. But I do not regard them as some form of enemy.

The list of people who raise the risk of needling hospital care through their own choices is HUGE yet considering them pariahs is a new one, that in the very least, is being fanned by politicians.

Its sad that our political masters have succeeded in pitting us against each other in this way.
Maybe draw the line at horse riding? By far the most dangerous form of transport statistically
 
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Sounds like some of y'all get the same bs that is (or was) routine over here, goes like this.

"It is now the pandemic of the unvaxxed, get the vax then u can't get covid or spread it"
 

gortnipper

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Whether you are vaccinated or not you can still pass it on
How can an unvaccinated person be more of a risk?

Vaccine effectiveness studies have conclusively demonstrated the benefit of COVID-19 vaccines in reducing individual symptomatic and severe disease, resulting in reduced hospitalisations and intensive care unit admissions.
1

The number of unvaccinated is certainly a major public health concern. According to the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, about 25% of U.S. adults are still unvaccinated, and many are clustered in regions where inoculation rates are especially low. Those clusters can easily become hot spots because they give the virus so many vulnerable hosts to attack.

A study of 146,243 adult contacts—about two thirds within households—of 108,498 adult index cases in the U.K. was posted as a preprint. Those newly vaccinated by Pfizer or AstraZeneca started out half and three-quarters as likely as unvaccinated index cases to transmit COVID, respectively.
 
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Whether you are vaccinated or not you can still pass it on
How can an unvaccinated person be more of a risk?
The point above is in response to a prior post, that included

"Those who choose not to get the Covid shot do so not only at their own risk, but also at the risk of those they come in contact with."

that implies only unvaxxed folks can affect others

You can be vaxxed & still be a risk to those U come in contact with.

Over here, at the highest levels, you would hear this FUD
"It is now the pandemic of the unvaxxed, get the vax then u can't get covid or spread it"

Demonizing the Unvaxxed however remains in a big way.
 
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gortnipper

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The point above is in response to a prior post, that included

"Those who choose not to get the Covid shot do so not only at their own risk, but also at the risk of those they come in contact with."

that implies only unvaxxed folks can affect others

Your conclusion is illogical.

Protect yourself
 

Fast Eddie

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What’s the Omicron plan in NZ chaps?

I watched a report saying that your lock down has kept Omicron out of NZ so far. Which sounds great.

But where does that plan go? The commentator was basically saying that as soon as you open the door, Omincron is simply gonna spread like wildfire. Fuelled further by the population having been locked down and not exposed to thing which keep immunity on its toes.

Is these being discussed by the policy makers do you know?
 

ntst8

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The policy makers aren't overly clear except to say the we won't be going back into lock downs. Vaccination rates are over 90% across almost all of the country, and mid 80's in the lowest areas plus over half have had a booster (third shot) already with numbers steadily rising.
We have a so-called traffic light system in place, which will go to Red if (when) Omicron starts to spread. This is very restrictive on the unvaccinated but for the vaccinated gathering sizes will be limited to 100 , working from home encouraged, and mask wearing mandatory in most public situations. Travel within the country wont be restricted for the vaccinated, international travel still restricted for the moment.
So it seems the plan is to accept that it will spread and try to keep the spread to a manageable level for the health system - the right approach to my mind. We can't remain isolated for ever.
While there is obviously a lot of thought and discussion going on at Govt level there is little public release of info on who is at risk etc. Most of what i have gathered comes from BBC science podcasts, which can be very informative.
 

baz

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Personally I'm not against vaccination I had all 3 as soon as I could but I have a health reason
If I were young and healthy I would not have had it
I just don't understand people being vilified for choosing not having it especially when it's 80,000 of our doctors/ nurses etc that worked all through the pandemic that are due to be sacked in April if they don't have the shot
 

gortnipper

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What’s the Omicron plan in NZ chaps?

I watched a report saying that your lock down has kept Omicron out of NZ so far. Which sounds great.

But where does that plan go?

The plan has basically been, keep the virus out of NZ as much as possible until vaccination rates > 90%, on order to protect the population and the greater health care system, which is generally excellent for BAU but not equipped to handle a pandemic.


Govt comms here

 
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I’m especially grumpy right now. I was due to go into hospital today to have a small op

cancelled at the last minute because of a bed shortage!
Pre omicron it was 30% of covid cases in UK hospitals were acquired in hospital, post omicron its now 70% of covid cases in hospital were acquired in hospital. At that % the covid UK hospital figures are meaningless and only ICU and deaths give you a clue as to what's going on.

Addendum (deaths as data is also misleading in UK)

Francois Balloux, professor of computational systems biology at University College London, said: “Until recently, monitoring deaths within 28 days of testing positive was a good proxy - it mirrored the real world.

“Now that is obviously not the case. At the moment, the numbers look horrible and worse than they should.

“The upside is they will soon look fantastic. I think we’re in a better situation than we have ever been since March 2020, and especially in the UK, I am pretty optimistic that we can soon call a day and then we’re finished.”

For the week ending January 7, the Government reported 1,282 deaths. However, the Office for National Statistics registered only 992, of which just 712 had Covid as the primary cause of death.
 
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gortnipper

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The commentator was basically saying that as soon as you open the door, Omincron is simply gonna spread like wildfire. Fuelled further by the population having been locked down and not exposed to thing which keep immunity on its toes.

I don't understand this?

Is the arguement being made that 95% of population with first dose and 93% full vaxx and 12 cases/day per million in NZ with controlled borders and historical lockdowns is worse than

78% of population with first dose and 71% full vaxx and 1,360 cases/day per million in UK with more open bordersand lesser lockdowns?
 
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I don't understand this?

Is the arguement being made that 95% of population with first dose and 93% full vaxx and 12 cases/day per million in NZ with controlled borders and historical lockdowns is worse than

78% of population with first dose and 71% full vaxx and 1,360 cases/day per million in UK with more open bordersand lesser lockdowns?
One possible reason is the Vaxx figures for UK ignore all those who are unvaxxed but have had Covid and so have immunity. But other than that then NZ should be ok other than the fear factor of the unknown.

If not now then when ?
 

Fast Eddie

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I don't understand this?

Is the arguement being made that 95% of population with first dose and 93% full vaxx and 12 cases/day per million in NZ with controlled borders and historical lockdowns is worse than

78% of population with first dose and 71% full vaxx and 1,360 cases/day per million in UK with more open bordersand lesser lockdowns?
It’s not an argument, it’s a question.

And it’s not an attempt to critique what’s been done, it’s a question about what’s going to be done next…

What we’ve seen here is that it’s clear that being vaccinated does NOT prevent people catching Omicron. Even our high vaccination rates did not prevent a wildfire type spread. Same in ‘role model’ Isreal.

So when NZ opens the door, Omicron WILL take hold and WILL spread like wildfire.

But as has been said already, with Omicron here, hospitalisations are at around half what they were at the worst previous peak, ICU less, patients on ventilators has not changed at all, and deaths remain very low. So in reality there is little to fear, but that’s often difficult to accept.

I‘m just wondering what the plan is for you guys? IMHO that is actually your only choice; open the door and let it spread, as apart from being locked down and closed off for the next 100 years, I don’t see an alternative.

But SAYING that is not easy for a politician!

So I’m curious as to what the govt stance is going forwards in NZ?
 
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baz

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Hopefully when NZ does open up and the Omicron takes hold it'll do the same as it has in South Africa and in the UK
And we can all move on
 

Time Warp

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Hopefully when NZ does open up and the Omicron takes hold it'll do the same as it has in South Africa and in the UK
And we can all move on

Why would you want scum arriving with Covid Baz.
This is the reason I have seen no family for two years now and almost given up hope of ever seeing them again let alone the only elderly Uncle I have . :(
 
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The plan has basically been, keep the virus out of NZ as much as possible until vaccination rates > 90%, on order to protect the population and the greater health care system, which is generally excellent for BAU but not equipped to handle a pandemic.


Govt comms here

Sounds like La La Land .."in the event"??

"Covid-19: Whole country will move to red in event of Omicron community outbreak"


 
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