New Starter what type?

I have various type of after market Starters for the Mk3.
I have seen a few examples available one being the WOSP gear reduction starter on eBay.

Suggestions would be welcome.

I designed this starter 06-4791B in April of 2004 and since then have personally built and sold over 1200 through Norton parts dealers when possible as listed. Lacking dealers I will sell direct.
The WOSP company in England has "borrowed" my design a few years ago and their importer in Atlanta ebays them cutting out the norton dealer network where you get the rest of your parts. I question they have any norton or MKIII knowledge for tech support.
1. Do wosp dealers even know what a norton is?
2. Tech support-I very often get calls and emails about the MKIII electric start machinery. And often get asked other norton questions.
3. Limited lifetime warranty
4. I can supply a few remaining chrome ones 06-4791C
5. Interesting ,Ebay now charges you sales tax here in the USA. I only do if you are in Mass.
6.Have been dues paying active member in INOA and NENO since 1988.

I have not wanted to ebay them as it raises the cost for ebay and paypal fees or simply reduces my pay to give to big corporation. I and my dealers did successfully sell about 1100 before wosp entered ebay. I personally sell very few direct.



Not successful at keeping dealers too long in Australia, been through about 5.
Never found one willing in NZ.

+1 for the dynodave starter. I bought one shortly after he started offering them and have never looked back, never misses a lick. (The first time I hit the starter button, it spun my engine so fast I thought I had left the plugs out.)

+2 For Dyno Dave starter. Buy his. He designed it. It's such a big improvement over the stock starter and totally reliable. As Rod R said above: The first time I pushed the button I thought the plugs were out.

+3 For Dyno Dave starter. A good unit that is a big improvement over stock and he is a good person to deal with. I managed to get mine into NZ, as I happened to be in the States and made arrangements there.

As above, I recommend Dyno Daves starter. They really are an excellent product, being smaller and lighter as well as spinning the motor with ease.

The 2 Mk III's that I regularly work on have Dyno Dave starters. Both owners love them.

Derek Wilson said:

The 2 Mk III's that I regularly work on have Dyno Dave starters. Both owners love them.

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I fitted one , and also found it spins and works the same way when I wired the bike for negative earth. Very good.

jan nelder said:

I fitted one , and also found it spins and works the same way when I wired the bike for negative earth. Very good.

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A basic physics lesson is... permanant magnet motors have fixed field magnetic polarity.
The armature, being wire, reverse polarity with change of electrical flow. This is why they reverse rotation.

My starter like most are BOTH electromagnet field AND armature, when you reverse the current, both magnets change polarity and the push me pull you relationship does not change. rotation direction is conserved.

In these, only one of the wired connections, field OR armature, must be changed to reverse rotation.

dynodave said:

I designed this starter 06-4791B in April of 2004 and since then have personally built and sold over 1200 through Norton parts dealers when possible as listed. Lacking dealers I will sell direct.
The WOSP company in England has "borrowed" my design a few years ago and their importer in Atlanta ebays them cutting out the norton dealer network where you get the rest of your parts. I question they have any norton or MKIII knowledge for tech support.
1. Do wosp dealers even know what a norton is?
2. Tech support-I very often get calls and emails about the MKIII electric start machinery. And often get asked other norton questions.
3. Limited lifetime warranty
4. I can supply a few remaining chrome ones 06-4791C
5. Interesting ,Ebay now charges you sales tax here in the USA. I only do if you are in Mass.
6.Have been dues paying active member in INOA and NENO since 1988.

I have not wanted to ebay them as it raises the cost for ebay and paypal fees or simply reduces my pay to give to big corporation. I and my dealers did successfully sell about 1100 before wosp entered ebay. I personally sell very few direct.

Not successful at keeping dealers too long in Australia, been through about 5.
Never found one willing in NZ.

Atlantic Green Tech Svc

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are these the ones I have seen being sold in the UK, possibly Andover Norton, and at a few shows. what price do you sell them for please. I keep talking about returning my 1976 roadster back to electric start, and then dither over which direction to go and the prices increase.

PM sent

There are various upgrades available for the Mk3 starter system. The previous mentioned Dyno daves kit and its copies, The CNW version of the prestolite motor and the do it yourself upgrade of the original starter motor itself.
The original two pole prestolite can be modified to provide this level of reliability if you have to required skill and desire the bike to still look original.
Cost of the various versions can vary enormously and it amazes me how much suppliers hike the price up for what they sell as to what they pay to buy in the base product.
Example, There is a dealer advertising on ebay for sale a Mk3 3 coil case conversion at £125. (this is a complete motor for a harley, you just use the four pole frame and brushes) Again on ebay you can buy a complete Harley starter from a dealer, brand new and made to a far better spec than the original for £84, That is delivery included. The price these dealers pay to there supplier is less than this possibly around the £40 - £50 mark.
I have modified quite a few new harley starters for Mk3 owners and i buy the base motor for the £84 price then make it fit the commando. This is what CNW do (or they get the manufacturers of the harley starters to modify them at source), The aftermarket harley starters are made in the far east or india, don't moan, as i said they are far better made than the original harley.

My first MK3 had the stock starter, and it really was more of an assist to the kick starter. On my second MK3 (which I still have) I eventually converted to dynodave's starter, including the heavier gauge cables. The difference was amazing, with instant, turbine-like starts every time. I eventually swapped it to my grandson's MK3, were it now resides. Can't say enough good things about it. I've never tried the complete four pole frame and brushes starter, but it also has to be an improvement over the original.

Ken

Certainly lots of differences.
The original prestolite field has 7 turns of copper strip,
The ND has a quadfilar 21 turn field. The ND makes a significantly higher gauss (magnetic) strenght than prestolite.
Then the ND has a larger diameter armature, whch in itself increases torque to the gear over the prestolite.
*The ND armature I use only with the double wrap coils , though a ND single wrap is available(WOSP?) just like the single wrap prestolite. Again double wrap=better torque...

For some strange reason I drove my new OEM prestolite for 5 seasons on the yuasa spec battery and it was always cranking and starting. I had contemplated removing the kicker.
I designed my starter only at a friends request since a rebuild, in a California norton shop to 4 brush version, was expensive and turned the wrong way.
So I fixed the rotation only to find the armature shaft and gear was crap. New Norton specific armatures stopped being built/supported by Prestolite in 1986. No good armature? then nothing to rebuild.
Hence 06-4791B, just paint them black or C for chrome. very limited supply

My conversion of the Harley starter involves making a new drive gear, modifying the rotor to accept this new gear (chopping off the harley gear, drilling and boring the stub shaft left and pressing in the new gear and pinning it in place) turning the rotor down to accept a new drive end bearing and machining up a new drive end cap.
This gives you a four pole all roller element bearings starter that will start a Mk3 with ease. Why the OEM starter was so poor is because it had/has plain bush bearings and little or no maintenance. couple that with living under a pair of amals that regularly dunked petrol on the starter that washes the lubricant out the bearings make for a very poor set up.
After converting the starter motor fitted to my Mk3 and after not using the kick starter for a year I did indeed remove the kickstart, so allowing me to move the footrests to something other than a 'sit on the toilet' riding position. I know rearsets are available that still allow the kickstart to be used but i hate the 'loop over' style of brake lever. No kickstart allowed me to make ones to my own design.

I know that the "modern" starters are better but a friend with an original MKIII says he did nothing more than install heavier gauge cables and I can confirm his OEM starter works fine. It doesn't spin as fast as my Alton does - more like my wife's Ducati Diavel!

Thicker cables is the first thing to do to improve the starting and the cheapest option!

MexicoMike said:

I know that the "modern" starters are better but a friend with an original MKIII says he did nothing more than install heavier gauge cables and I can confirm his OEM starter works fine. It doesn't spin as fast as my Alton does - more like my wife's Ducati Diavel!

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I can confirm Peter's (dobba 99) starter conversion is superb as he did one for me a few years ago, I just choose to use the kick starter for the first start of the day.

I installed heavy aircraft cables early on and the original starter would function but slowly. It was when the early Boyer kicked back on low voltage and locked the sprag that I destroyed the armature by revving trying to get the sprag to unlock that I discovered the DD starter. The root cause of the problem was the under-performing charging system that led to the low voltage condition in the first place. Final fix = 3 phase alternator, Payzon Altair, DD starter and new sprag and related parts. Starts and runs like a modern bike and I can keep my headlight on without fear of running the battery down.

What he said:

JimNH said:

The root cause of the problem was the under-performing charging system that led to the low voltage condition in the first place.

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And what I have been saying for decades....is anyone listening...hello out there!