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Lucas Rita ignition

Discussion in 'Norton Commando Motorcycles (Classic)' started by westmeath, Apr 27, 2012.

  1. westmeath

    westmeath

    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2012
    Helllo everyone. I am new to the forum and would appreciate a bit of help. I have a Norton Interstate 1972 fitted with a lucas rita AB11 47270A BOX. The Boyer reg/rectifier is bust. I have several replacements but they require a neg. ground. I have rversed the polarity bon the bike but I cannot get a spark.
    What I did was
    1) Black wire from Rita to neg ground.
    2)white/yellow to coil positive and ignition
    3) the pickup reads 270ohms
    4) get spark on plugs when I switch off ignition
    5)With ignition on I get sparks when I touch white/purple to earth neg.
    6) No spark when I kicck the engine.

    All help is welcome . I live in Ireland. WE have a wet spell of weather just now but I would like to be running for the long evenings
    Slainte
     
  2. L.A.B.

    L.A.B. Moderator VIP MEMBER

    Joined:
    Nov 20, 2004
    Welcome to the forum.

    You seem to have wired it up correctly for negative earth and your tests appear to show the AB11 box is functioning normally.

    Where did you take the Ohms reading, at the pickup plate or where the pickup wires connect to the AB11 box wires?

    If the measurement was only taken at the pickup then I suggest you take another measurement at the box end of the two pickup wires and maybe test each pickup wire from end to end? Also check the connections on the pickup stud to make sure the connectors are not touching each other or shorting to the stud or timing case.
     
  3. hobot

    hobot

    Joined:
    Oct 19, 2005
    If a faulty part found here's about only source of em left in the planet. DynoDave Daivd Commeau.

    AGTS Ignitions Services for Racing Ignition Transistor Amplifier including NOS Lucas and repairs
    http://atlanticgreen.com/ignition.htm
     
  4. slimslowslider

    slimslowslider

    Joined:
    Jun 29, 2010
    Is earthing the casing yes or no of any relevance here?
     
  5. L.A.B.

    L.A.B. Moderator VIP MEMBER

    Joined:
    Nov 20, 2004
    Yes, apparently the case should be earthed for either pos. or neg.
     
  6. VintAge

    VintAge VIP MEMBER

    Joined:
    May 18, 2011
    I also have a 47270A amplifier system installed in '79 and the resistance through the pickup and all connecting wires is 300ohms - just measured yesterday.

    I've just been playing with mine, going over connections and clearances and doing testing, because just before I took my 850 off the road to do trans and rear hub repairs, my RITA was providing some really severe kickbacks, which was never a problem before. I don't want to hijack your thread but since you have the same system I was wondering if you ever experienced this??

    Another thing to always consider with the RITA is how extremely power hungry it is. Probably needn't tell you to make sure the battery is really fully charged, although if it sparked during the testing you'd think it would be sufficient while kicking? This is assuming you're watching for spark the same way with the plugs out and grounded (as opposed to being buttoned up and waiting for it to start)? Battery needs to be up to snuff on its own - I always heard it is asking for trouble to try to start/run a RITA with a charger connected.
     
  7. hobot

    hobot

    Joined:
    Oct 19, 2005
    I know nothing about RITA but that I seem to get undue spark plug failure after a time of ignition system misbehavior, ie: after some obvious ignition system fault found and corrected the dang Cdo still won't start or it miss fires until new plugs installed, sheeze. Its too simple not to always try new plugs - just in case - before going bonko...
     
  8. dynodave

    dynodave

    Joined:
    May 28, 2003
    A genuine "A" version used a varistor for protection in either + or - ground.
    A genuine "B" had deleted that build design though the instructions were never updated by Mistral. It used a specific new type transistor (boyer used same)....when that transistor production was terminated the Rita stopped production. Boyer had already moved to a different transistor and therefore did not affect them. Though I am still way too busy to solicite much work, both the "A" and "B" RITA that I repair are done as the "B" version without varistor and grounding the case does nothing. :mrgreen:
     
  9. westmeath

    westmeath

    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2012
    Good news. I have sparks on turn over. It turns out that the stud in the picckup wires was shorting. I cannot understand how this happened as the engine started first time befor e I staretd to change the grounding. It must be the fairies. I really appreciate all the advice I received from the forum . It is very easy to get directed to a correct solution when you are advised by people who have great knowledge of the Commando. Many thanks again and I am enjoying this forum :D :D :D
     
  10. dynodave

    dynodave

    Joined:
    May 28, 2003
    It is well know byt rita users that the "tall stud" washer stack up goes limp :roll: and must be tightened & wiggled to re-establish electrical contact. life springs back. fairies? Almost sounds like magic....I call it voodoo.... = not enough education to explain....vroooommmm vroooommmm

    Back to my husqvarna 298XP muffler research or was that the 7016 PTO rebuild ??? :mrgreen:
    cheers
    dave
     
  11. DogT

    DogT VIP MEMBER

    Joined:
    Jan 20, 2009
    PTO, Permeability Tuned Oscillator? I doubt it.

    Dave
    69S
     
  12. dynodave

    dynodave

    Joined:
    May 28, 2003
    mid 70's simplicity garden tractor PTO Power Take Off clutch. $.75 friction strip, $17 bearing and a 12-1/2 deg skim cut on the clutch cone. Or buy over $250 in new factory parts ( I have 3 of these tractors) with a rototiller attachment.....Gotta get the tomatoes, beans etc planted very soon.
    The wood cutting for me is almost over.... Husky 298XP (junior 2101xp) like a fuel dragster of chain saws.
    After this I have to get the bike chassis dyno up and running for the May NENO meeting/open house. :mrgreen:
    http://nneno.org/
     
  13. hobot

    hobot

    Joined:
    Oct 19, 2005
    Hey David, appreciate the tractor's PTO's and big saws for big wood heating but am spoiled by the compression release on my Hushy 385, ~6 hp saw and must have similar on my Commandos some day. Hehe with logger power saw can about remove the drags to really throw some piles of chips.

    Is RITA as good as points to ease electric starters job?
     
  14. dynodave

    dynodave

    Joined:
    May 28, 2003
    Actually an excellent set of points and AA unit is better than the RITA due to low current draw and better idle characteristics. However, a rita is way way better than the old MKIII boyer. Can't comment much on the newer systems. Everyone is scared of a test/evaluation that is not positive. I have only ever tried to find the technical truth and let the chips fall where they may.

    Put in blueberry and raspberry bushes today....glued in the friction material on the PTO drum. :mrgreen:
     
  15. Chris

    Chris VIP MEMBER

    Joined:
    Jan 21, 2008
    Hi Dave

    Am I mistaken or is Mistral making new amplifiers now days?
    Seem to remember someone going down to Fulham to get a new one set up.

    Chris
     
  16. L.A.B.

    L.A.B. Moderator VIP MEMBER

    Joined:
    Nov 20, 2004

    http://www.hoppybikes.co.uk/moira.htm
     
  17. VintAge

    VintAge VIP MEMBER

    Joined:
    May 18, 2011
    Right, I've seen this site and it says they "will" be providing the new amplifier but I don't know how long the page has been up. Anyone have any info on this item?
     
  18. swooshdave

    swooshdave

    Joined:
    Apr 15, 2009
    So has anyone ever bought the MOIRA and what is the price?
     
  19. illf8ed

    illf8ed VIP MEMBER

    Joined:
    Dec 30, 2003
    The two RITAs I've had in two separate Commandos have been bullet proof except for that stud and stack if fiber washers and low tension leads...I agree with Dave. Got stranded on the way home from the 49 mile ride in Sann Francisco and thought it was bad gas. After pulling doing a lot of other checking the kulprit was the nut on the stack vibrated off. Used blue locktite this time. Was pretty mad at myself as this should hav even were I looked first on the side of the road...an easy fix.
     
  20. acotrel

    acotrel

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2012
    The box used for the Lucas Rita was originally used on Jaguar cars in the early 70s , but I can't remember what it was called.
     

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