How much Faster is the I.o.M. these days .

Figureing at least a tooth . :wink:

I'm keeping some tabs on this very issue and appears most the improvement is pure horse power in the long straights not that much more in the tricky spots. So my constant question is how much fast in turns would it take to match or best the times if could only hit 170 or so in the opens.

Here you go.
Dial 0800GETREAL.

Just pretend these are Manx Nortons or some other old banger. :roll: :lol:
Modern brakes would probably have fatigued the frame after one lap.

http://youtu.be/S5naKxnvffo

3:45 electric.

Current lap records.

http://www.iomtt.com/TT-Database/TT-Rec ... cords.aspx

I used to know a couple of (ex)TT riders. One, Ron Fursman who rode 350 and 500 Manxes, reckoned that the TT circuit was pretty much flat out on a Manx, especially the 350, apart from the obvious places!! You were either at top speed or waiting to get there. I suppose most Manxes/G50s would do in the 130 to 140 mph maybe a bit more on a good day. That was the difference between a good rider, someone like Hailwood, PW, Agostini etc and "the rest", the good riders could hold it full bore for longer, in addition to which an extra 10/20mph on a works MV or Honda would make a big difference in lap times.
Having said that I'm full of admiration for the current riders, tackling Bray Hill at a zillion mph would certainly focus your attention!!
Wonderful place.
cheers
wakeup

yes they do pedal their bicycles harder these days ,

Yes , But how much Faster , is the TRACK . Less Bumps , turns opened , track widened , grippyer Tarseal .

Not how much faster are the whizz bangs , or how desperate the riders .

The Marshall said it was the fastest he'd seen anyone go around that corner ! :shock:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rhem48fnP1c

HOW much HIGHER would one need to gear the old dungers , so as to avoid overreving , with the ' F A S T E R ' - " T R A C K " .

or wottle they do now its all tarted up . ( then thered be better tyres , oils & brake pads presumeably , to chip away a few more seconds )

If we wanted to be really awkward , how much Slower was it then . And would the modern suckers leap of the track or through a wall with all the ruts ?
Looking at every inch of the T R A C K , back 1970 odd , for Ea bit that would slow you down THEN compared to now . Would be another way to put it . :twisted:

How much Slower was the TRACK back then .

Oh Dear :

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y07yt87lhEA

Fairfully Modern ; its After the War ! . http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YGCR8PX_VXQ

Heres footage from 78 . Who is this ' Peter Williams ? ' :? the poor quality & the sun emphasise the Track irregularities undulations bumps & tarmac joins / edges .

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EZ4JvobNbHs

Matt what's the deal with the rider on track @ 15 min mark during IOM that goes by standing on his bike with lines going down to foot controls?

He either Ecaped from HERE , is a Fireman ,
or Thats the only way they could get one of those yamaha dohc triples to go round a corner . :lol: :wink: :mrgreen:

hobot said:

Matt what's the deal with the rider on track @ 15 min mark during IOM that goes by standing on his bike with lines going down to foot controls?

Click to expand...

That was Dave Taylor, who also did a complete lap on one wheel

http://youtu.be/Q8cTRSV6dLI

Matt Spencer said:

Heres footage from 78 . Who is this ' Peter Williams ? ' :? the poor quality & the sun emphasise the Track irregularities undulations bumps & tarmac joins / edges .

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EZ4JvobNbHs

Click to expand...

Matt - did you actually watch this video before you posted it?

Lots of two strokes, as you would expect in 1978, but the commentary and sound is of four strokes from the 60s. The footage shows bikes in Parliament Square, Ramsey, while the commentator is describing Mike Hailwood at Ballaugh Bridge :roll:

It is impossible to quantify how much faster the TT course is now compared with, say, the 60s, but some people believe that 130 + mph laps would not have been achievable if the course had stayed the same. The problem is that the course is a public road used by motorists for the other 48 weeks of the year, and is improved periodically for road safety. Several corners have been opened out or realigned since the middle of the last decade - Windy Corner and Brandish - and the improvement to Brandish not only makes that corner quite a bit faster but also makes the course that little bit shorter too. Quarry bends was opened out earlier and is supposed to be safer but is also faster. These are a just a few examples of the many incremental changes made over the years. If one listens to riders who have been racing on the TT course for a number of decades, they will tell you that they have witnessed a lot of changes to the course since they began. One experienced Manx GP rider told me he didn't like course improvements because it takes a quite a few years to get to know the course, and if it is changing over the years, your points of reference change. He wasn't the only one, either.

The riders who achieved 100 mph laps on 500cc singles in the early 60s, with drum brakes, primitive suspension and inferior tyres, were heroic. A 100 mph lap on a 500cc 2 valve single is still considered an achievement even now, with all the course improvements and 50 + years of improvements in materials in engines, suspension, brakes and tyres. It would be interesting to see what lap times the current top road racers could achieve on an authentic early 60s Manx.

Whatever the fastest IOM lap might be, it is irrelevant to most of us. I believe that if you race, you have got to be prepared to crash, however that is not an option on the IOM. So I would not go there. I met a friend at Sandown Park years ago whom I had not seen for quite a while (his nickname was 'Speed'). I asked him where he had been. He told me he was at t he IOM racing a Manx (early 70s). He said the first time he went there he did an 84 MPH lap, 'but if you keep going there you get quicker'. I knew Ken Blake. He was one of our best riders - lasted two laps there .

acotrel said:

I knew Ken Blake. He was one of our best riders - lasted two laps there .

Click to expand...

Ginger Molloy (second in 500 GP world championship to Agostini) said in a TV interview he never went there because he didnt have the right temperament for the circuit.

Its not my story to tell so not much detail but a couple of months ago I was talking to a rider with several Manx wins on Classic machinery and he expressed surprise that times had not dropped much.

acotrel said:

I knew Ken Blake. He was one of our best riders - lasted two laps there .

Click to expand...

One of the german guys that went there before the war only lasted one lap.
Sad, but someone commented you don't win the race on the first lap...

Its been said elsewhere that it takes 7 years to learn the track.
With the resurfacing and slight corner changing they've been doing lately, someone said they've had to unlearn some of it...

I've heard it said that it must be easier to do a fast lap these days with the bikes being much faster on the straights, but I disagree.

The thing about the IoM is knowing the circuit. When I was there my friend was in the Classic race on an Aermacchi. He had a map of the circuit which he had marked with a highligher pen showing the places where he was flat in top. There were literally miles of circuit where he was flat in top. So he only had to remember which gear and how fast to go for maybe half the circuit. The rest he knew was flat out. On a modern 1000cc bike almost every corner needs a gear change and throttle adjustment which is a hell of a lot to remember at race speed.... and we know what the penalty for failure is at that circuit.

Heres Guy Martin , talking you round a Lap .

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QVXc29ZgutI

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DFUYIH2Ttzk

[video]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rogV80QfLYQ[/video]

Fascinating documentary about the electric bikes at IoM.

Catch it on Netflix Streaming.

https://www.facebook.com/ChargeTheMovie