Help with Ducati Bitsa

I bought this 1975 Ducati 860 about 12 years ago, and its been in my shed ever since. I got it as an unfinished project, the main thing it was missing was a wiring harness. I've built mainly Harleys, and a few Japanese bikes, and rewired most of my Harleys from scratch making my own harness. Well, the Ducati harness was mighty intimidating and I just put it away.

Well I recently decided to let it see the light of day. I finally figured out that this model has essentially a self-energizing magneto type of ignition, so it might be able to start without a battery or general wiring harness. Long story short, I did eventually get it to run for about 30 seconds on the choke. Still needs a lot of work but it was running.

However, I'm trying to figure out exactly just what I have here. I know the frame says made in 1/75, but the engine is a right side shift. The tank is fiberglass and doesn't appear to be a 75, and I'm not sure what the instruments are from. The hole for the switch doesn't seem to fit any Ducati switch. There doesn't appear to be places for high/low beam indicator lights, nor oil pressure or alternator lights. Not sure the triple clamps are 75 either. The headlight, well there's a headlight there but who knows what/where it came from. So take a look at the pics that hopefully post and give me some feedback.

The first pic is after I decided to at least give it a limited wash and wax job before putting it back in the shed.







The sidecovers look unknown, but I'm beginning to think they're cut downs from original covers.



The mufflers do say Conti on them, and I think they're actually chrome under that paint. Well the paint is keeping the rust away.

I definitely do not like the seat or that damn frame bracket in the back. I understand lots of folks removed that frame loop. I've got a pretty good upholsterer who can probably modify the back of the seat to look like a regular one.

I'm beginning to think this bike is a bitsa, and the collector or restoration value is zilch. So although I do want to get it running and just have a little fun, I'm thinking I may just hot rod the damn thing and build it the way I like as there's little appreciation potential. However, there might be a lot of fun factor. I did get a stock Ducati steel 860 tank off Ebay years ago, may try it on sometime.

Could be a 750SS square case, I'm not real sure, though. Might be worth a few bucks. Too bad it's newer than the AHRMA '72 cut-off year to race vintage, although it my comply under the "like design" rule; I got beat by a similar GT at Willow Springs in 2010, so I'll bet they'd let you run it.

Switch to a Clubman racing seat & quarter fairing, get some rearset pegs & clip-on bars and have fun!

Cool bike. (it's not a bitsa)

Thanks mucho for the comments. My back and knees really dislike clipons and rearsets. I'm probably going to look into bars with a little more rise in them. The ones on the bike are some bars that I had lying in the shed as the original ones weren't much different and bent anyway.

The left hand side of the heads does say 860, so it may not be a 750 SS. Then again, those may just be thrown on there. I noticed there's no bracket under the gas tank for an ignition switch and I thought some Ducks had the switch there.

I'm old enough to remember reading about Cook Nielsen's California Hot Rod he built. I was thinking of maybe doing a little to the engine, and making a Texas Street Rod out of it. Little bit street bike, touch of flat tracker. Might be a bit of fun at a few vintage bike nites.

does this help any?
http://www.bevelheaven.com/data-squarecase.htm

So it sure looks like a modified 860GT. Right side shift was not standard but on that bike you could swap it. If you want to go left side shift let me know, I might be interested in the right shift parts.

As you've seen, it says 860 on the head. It will also say 860 on the serial number. Frame is definitely 860GT. So is seat. Tank is unknown. Most of the parts (headlight, forks, wheels, etc. are 860GT.

If it were me I'd fix it up like it is.

Strip out all the wiring and start from scratch. That way you'll know what you have.

The ignition won't last long and is crap. Save up the $350 or so for an better electronic ignition.

the tank looks like an early 750 GT as you said it is glass and from the shape. I have a shop manual with wiring diagram as a PDF BUT it is almost non readable. you will also find that most parts are unobtainuim and when you find them just belly up and pay what the asking price is. I did a rewire on one last spring and put in an aftermarket IGN system. the one you have should have a stop relay to turn it off. You are missing so many instrument parts ( among other stuff ) that are not available your best way to go is a custom bike.

it is NOT a square case 750SS IF you knew much about Ducati's it would be obvious to you. one more thing IT IS A BITSA with a LOT of original parts missing.

grandpaul said:

Could be a 750SS square case, I'm not real sure, though.

(it's not a bitsa)

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bill said:

it is NOT a square case 750SS IF you knew much about Ducati's it would be obvious to you. one more thing IT IS A BITSA with a LOT of original parts missing.

grandpaul said:

Could be a 750SS square case, I'm not real sure, though.

(it's not a bitsa)

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Actually aside from the tank and side covers most of it is there and original. Master cylinder is a later Bremo. Mufflers look like Contis, worth a bit if perfect.

A clean bike like yours (lightly modified) just sold for $6k with apparent engine problems.

http://www.bevelheaven.com/bikes4sale/MK-860GT/

Dave
All most every thing above the top triple tree is either missing or wrong but mostly missing. Have you tried to find these original parts??? The mufflers are either dunstall or copy's as they are NOT conti's, just look at the ends and you will see.

swooshdave said:

Actually aside from the tank and side covers most of it is there and original. Master cylinder is a later Bremo. Mufflers look like Contis, worth a bit if perfect

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bill said:

Dave
All most every thing above the top triple tree is either missing or wrong but mostly missing. Have you tried to find these original parts??? The mufflers are either dunstall or copy's as they are NOT conti's, just look at the ends and you will see.

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If you look in the first picture I think those are the original instruments (should be Smiths). Everyone ditched the plastic dashes but it doesn't matter as they are being reproduced. So are all the dash lights.

http://www.mdinaitalia.co.uk/cgi-bin/co ... LIGHT_DASH



Of course I have a box of those original parts. :mrgreen:

I thought they looked like Dunstals, especially the ends. Doesn't matter as they are trashed. He said they were stamped/marked Contis but I'm sure you'll question that too. :|

Unless you have to have a bevel and are willing to pay for it if I was sportster I would either sell the bike. The parts are horribly expensive and I haven't even gotten to the engine. You do not want to have to rebuild one of those engines. I just shudder even thinking about that.

I bet with a little cleaning that thing could bring $3-4k. Heck, I'd love that tank.

most all the later ducs used veglia instruments but it MIGHT have smiths and my parts manual shows borletti or smiths. the only parts I have found for the original dash is the dash itself along with LED dash lights and NOTHING else. I am not sure where he found the conti stamp but I have NEVER sean conti's with that type of end, they all had a single hole with the outer diameter rolled over for a smooth look NOT a megaphone look with a baffle stuck in to it.

you want to sell some of you original parts as I might have a buyer ???

swooshdave said:

If you look in the first picture I think those are the original instruments (should be Smiths). Everyone ditched the plastic dashes but it doesn't matter as they are being reproduced. So are all the dash lights.

http://www.mdinaitalia.co.uk/cgi-bin/co ... LIGHT_DASH

Of course I have a box of those original parts. :mrgreen:

I thought they looked like Dunstals, especially the ends. Doesn't matter as they are trashed. He said they were stamped/marked Contis but I'm sure you'll question that too. :|

Unless you have to have a bevel and are willing to pay for it if I was sportster I would either sell the bike. The parts are horribly expensive and I haven't even gotten to the engine. You do not want to have to rebuild one of those engines. I just shudder even thinking about that.

I bet with a little cleaning that thing could bring $3-4k. Heck, I'd love that tank.

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bill said:

most all the later ducs used veglia instruments but it MIGHT have smiths and my parts manual shows borletti or smiths. the only parts I have found for the original dash is the dash itself along with LED dash lights and NOTHING else. I am not sure where he found the conti stamp but I have NEVER sean conti's with that type of end, they all had a single hole with the outer diameter rolled over for a smooth look NOT a megaphone look with a baffle stuck in to it.

you want to sell some of you original parts as I might have a buyer ???

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Early 750s used Smiths and Amals!

I agree and would love to see the Conti stamp on those mufflers.

Here's your lights, Steve @ Bevelheaven has more options depending on your year of bike. Comes either with regular bulbs or LEDs.

https://store.bevelheaven.com/body-dres ... 60gt-type/



The dash I have is not perfect, not sellable. I'm just going to hold onto all the original parts, even as they are being replaced.

There are more and more parts being reproduced, what can't you find?

so far you have not told me any thing I don't know already. the parts he needs is almost everything that mounts the dash and instruments :x I don't know what year parts manual I have BUT we can compare part #'s if you have a book to see IF you have something he needs that you want to sell.

swooshdave said:

Early 750s used Smiths and Amals!

I agree and would love to see the Conti stamp on those mufflers.

Here's your lights, Steve @ Bevelheaven has more options depending on your year of bike. Comes either with regular bulbs or LEDs.

https://store.bevelheaven.com/body-dres ... 60gt-type/

The dash I have is not perfect, not sellable. I'm just going to hold onto all the original parts, even as they are being replaced.

There are more and more parts being reproduced, what can't you find?

Click to expand...

bill said:

so far you have not told me any thing I don't know already. the parts he needs is almost everything that mounts the dash and instruments :x I don't know what year parts manual I have BUT we can compare part #'s if you have a book to see IF you have something he needs that you want to sell.

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Have you ever been wrong? :mrgreen:

not nearly as often as a certain other member on here that like to toot his horn :lol: :lol:

swooshdave said:

Have you ever been wrong? :mrgreen:

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One Thing For Sure .
Its definately a DUCATI .

Now , Shame on You . . . . you need to get out a can of Chain Bar Lube , and a tin of C.R.C. for the Al oominum . At Once . PLEASE .

Now Ducati were never renowned for building " to Spec . " so though unlikely , it could be to original build specification . :lol: 8)

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Wireing is elementry , Std. Euro colour code for 70s on could be fitted . Ordinarrilly coloured speghetti was . early may be partly Std British
colour codes . These have ' Tracers ' , say white wire with Green ' trace ' , to differentiant from the other White . White being Light ( Lamp )
related .

So White / brown trace is Oil Light .

Browns Live . :shock:

So a little investigation is in order . :idea: :mrgreen: ( as well as COROSION INHIBITING .)

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Plenty of DUCATI on Google Pictures . Your Headlamps italian . look at the 450s for period dateing . Duc went to Jap Switchgear at one stage , for some .

Id think a Clean and check over , Id be reluctant to mod other than to ' sport ' spec .

73 750 Sport .



1975 860 GT



1974 450



This sucker has similar fittings & fittments . Duc changed spec progressively , and used leftovers on end runs . So there are machines outside the regular production runs , which only really happened FROM the 860 GTS series .

LOOK AFTER IT .

I didn't include a pic of the gauges, but they're Veglia.

Second, I'm not big on originality, I'm big on riding. Some folks get off over numbers matching stuff, but I'm more the hotrodder. Even if I restored this to absolute originality, I don't think its going to affect my 401(k). Might as well just have fun.

I'm even thinking of some aftermarket gauges, and indeed have already been looking at some aftermarket ignition systems. Speedhut has some good lookers, just have to find a way to drive an electric speedo from the cable drive. Or get one of the new GPS drive setups.

There seems to be a few folks who have converted Ducati Monster ignitions, or there's the few European setups. Something like that is in this bike's future.

I kind of like what Ferdinand Porsche said one day when he saw some older restored cars on trailers. "We built them to be driven, not stared at."

I'm still trying to figure out if that big hole in the instrument mounts is for some kind of ignition key. If so, what kind?

sportster_restorer said:

There seems to be a few folks who have converted Ducati Monster ignitions, or there's the few European setups. Something like that is in this bike's future.

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http://www.ducati.ms/forums/14-vintage/ ... lhead.html

So far all I've found is the Kokosan conversion. Of course not made anymore.

Be aware that the electric start 860GT apparently has a different ignition setup than the kickstart one.

The biggest reason for changing the ignition is the horrific ignition curve (spike) on the stock system.

If you look at it like a M-X er ,

stripped down , no supurflous components . Then fit road equipment. plus Updates for Durability .
One was for sale for 25 ( grand ) today .1 owner Mag Wheel mint blue E S 860 ridiculous , 2.500 new . STOCK .

a few rough goers and a few big Jappers . A hideous CB 750 swing Arm . No wonder they wobbled . The Duke was the best handler of the Day .
Wasnt untill the Big Suzukis used some material in the chassis a jap bike was worth a damn , in hill country .

Keeping fittings period keeps it as a time warp .

Overall you need a cohesive result , anyway .

P.S. Thems DUNSTALL mufflers . hidem Quick . the boys here'll be afterem . WORTH PRESERVEING , or disposeing of .

Will be a non Desmo , with the Iron Rims . Have you Done any rideing on a bevel to see if theyre youre thing ?? :arrow:

I've got a Darmah, if I had a bike like your one I'd make myself a 900ss replica. I think the tank is a 750 GT item.
You have all the hard to get parts,the rest are easy to come by....frame is slightly different but it would be close.