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Harley-Davidson turns motorcycling on its head !

Discussion in 'Motorcycle Related Discussions' started by Bernhard, Aug 4, 2018.

  1. Bernhard

    Bernhard

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    Apr 20, 2011
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  2. Brithit

    Brithit

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    Feb 22, 2005
    I found that interesting, but wonder how it will translate to the dealer sales force. Meaning, I went to a local dealer to look at a Buell when they first came out, and nobody wanted to say more than "there it is". I also stopped by some dealers to look at the Street Rod with mid set pegs instead of the forward controls, and they also had no interest even talking about it. I would only assume that the salespeople aren't all that interested in the new 500 and 750 Street models. I did talk to a guy who bought a new Dyna a couple of years ago, and they loaded him up with $1,800 worth of modifications before it ever left the door. That seems to be where the interest and money is for a lot of Harley salespeople. If they can't get them excited about any new product, the new stuff may never have a chance.
     
  3. Danno

    Danno

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    Feb 7, 2010
    All one has to do is to look at the custom bike scene to see where they’re trying to go. Choppers are out; Trackers are in. They can’t stay in business just catering to the old die-hards. Indian (Polaris) didn’t have any die-hards, they took some of Harleys, and look what a bite they’ve taken out of Harley’s pie.
     
  4. Craig

    Craig VIP MEMBER

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    Dec 20, 2005
    Harley has been catering to the hardcore riders for ever , doubt that will change anytime soon ... as in all business they got to show growth that where their challenge is ... hard core guys starting to thin by attrition .... similar to our group
     
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  5. xbacksideslider

    xbacksideslider VIP MEMBER

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    Aug 19, 2010
    It's hard for HD; stuck with an image that goes so deep that its limits both the design and performance envelope of new products. This limits their demographics and shuts out people who otherwise might "buy American."
     
  6. acotrel

    acotrel

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    Jun 30, 2012
    I cannot say I ever raced against a Harley XR750TT, but I was on Calder Raceway at the same time as Don Emde was riding one. It was very nice and fast, but ran a timing side bearing so did not get to race against our fast guys. I believe the bearing problem was fixed in the later Sportster. With that fix, the XR750TT would be great, but the road race frame was a shitter. I think Harley don't know what they have got, when they have something which is really good. To my mind, the Sportster motor is probably as good as anybody really needs. I would much rather have a Seeley or Harris frame with a decent Sportster motor fitted, than any Ducati. At least I might be able to live with the bike without going bankrupt every time I fiddled with it.

     
    Last edited: Aug 6, 2018
  7. kommando

    kommando

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    May 7, 2005
    The new stuff looks very Buell like, must be regretting shutting it down now but if it did not work for them the first time why would it a second just a few years later.
     
  8. Craig

    Craig VIP MEMBER

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    Dec 20, 2005
    Have owned a Ducati ST3s since ‘07 a sport tour bike not a racer .. I have never paid anyone to work on it .... I have taken wheels into shop to have new tires fitted that it ... once while doing valves I damaged valve stem seal , had to have it bused in $12.00 plus $20 for bus ... that it ... I got a steering stem wrench online from China for $10 , only special tool I have needed in 62,000 kms ... kinda tired hearing the old history thrown up every time someone mentions a Duc ... mine has been absolutely dead reliable as has the MG Griso also an ‘07 ..... these bikes I do bulk of my riding on , the Commando I do bulk of wrenching on , all optional of course ....
    Craig
     
  9. acotrel

    acotrel

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    Jun 30, 2012
    My friend had a very successful business fixing Ducatis. He told me he always pulled them down in front of the customer, so they could see the damage. Most of it was caused by guys trying to work on their own bikes. No bill he ever issued was less than $5000.
    With a Harley Sportster motor - what can you do wrong ?
     
  10. Craig

    Craig VIP MEMBER

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    Dec 20, 2005
    Not sure if you inferring I have a big bill coming due, because I do all the mechanical/service work on my Ducati or if you just throwing something out there from back in the day .... there are about 120 members of our regional Ducati Club (ECDC) some members pay to have big service done at dealer ( belts, valves , TPS set etc) that runs about $1200 ... since I been around the Club going on 7 years there have been Zero engine failures reported , I mean nothing zero !!!!! Your friends business must have been running many years ago .... I just checked E-bay you can pick up a complete Ducati engine in working order for much less than half , what you say your friend was charging for repairs .... he had quite a gold mine going , eh ?
    Craig
     
  11. cehenard

    cehenard VIP MEMBER

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    Sep 29, 2014
    Craig, I have to agree with you. Although most people should NOT work on their own bikes a lot of us are quite capable and knowledgeable, have the tools and the common sense to do a job or know when to take it to a professional. I too do most of my own work on my motorcycles. I too hear all of the ridiculous stories that must come from some imagined place. I can't fathom spending $5000.00 on repairing any of my motorcycles. This thread started out talking about Harley Davidson. I've had my current HD Roadglide less than 5 years. I just rolled over 63000 miles. I've had no trouble with it. It's on the third front tire, fourth rear tire, gets 40 mpg, it'll easily do over the ton and is no slouch in the twisties. You'd never hear that from someone who didn't ride it. You'll hear all the crap that you've been hearing since the 1970's . I've got two Ducati's that didn't cost ridiculous outrageous money to buy and don't cost ridiculous outrageous money to maintain. One is air cooled, two valve, simple, light and fun. The other is liquid cooled, four valve, light, fun and like a cocked cannon. The part that I don't complain about, but nobody would want to hear is this; I spend more time and effort and possibly money trying to keep my NORTON running like a dependable decent motorcycle, than all the others that are constantly put down as pieces of overpriced garbage. I love my Norton and all my bikes. You'll never hear me say any motorcycle brand is junk. They're all different. I'll not go touring on my Rokon or try motocross on my 305 Dream, but they're good bikes. Good luck Harley.
    Charlie
     
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  12. acotrel

    acotrel

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    Jun 30, 2012
    The main attraction about Harleys is that they are completely rebuildable, same with Nortons and there is always plenty of after-market stuff. With other bikes, it is not so easy. I love Ducatis, but to me they are like Ferraris. A Harley or a Norton is like a Chevrolet. I could live with a bevel Ducati or a Monster, but not much else.
     
  13. Craig

    Craig VIP MEMBER

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    Dec 20, 2005
    Acotrel .... still not sure what you getting at .... a 90 degree V- twin engine is a thing of beauty and really quite easy to work on .... the fussy part is getting plastics off and on .... as far as aftermarket choices lots for all bikes , more than enough for the Ducati ST3s I have so far added : zero gravity tinted tour screen , anodized billet reservoir covers, billet chain adjusters , heated grips , foot peg lowering plates, DP comfort seat , heli-bars, DP open air box ,DP ecu and Termignoni CF pipes ,all available online and installed and set up by me ... I like all bikes and the joy they offer me , still can’t decide what sounds the best though ....
    Craig
     
  14. acotrel

    acotrel

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    Jun 30, 2012
    I watched my friend putting the cam gear etc. together in one of those 4 valve heads, which was off a water cooled Ducati. It took about 15 fingers all inside it at once. I think what he was referring to about the damage, might have been about getting the valve timing or clearances wrong. Whatever it was, it was extremely costly. Isn't an ST3 motor two valve motor with belt drive to the cams ? You should not get into difficulties with that. In much of the stuff I have read about bevel Ducatis, they seem to be very reliable and a Monster type should be even easier to work on.
     
  15. Craig

    Craig VIP MEMBER

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    Dec 20, 2005
    The ST series of bikes are numbered to reflect number of valves mine being a ST3 makes it a 3 valve 2 intake , 1 exhaust per cyl. (an ST4 has 4 valves etc) ..... it is water and oil cooled , lots of pipes .... replacing belts is not really difficult , but the older air cooled Monsters would be easier to get at .... the newer Monsters would be much more time consuming ... even the older monsters have the 2 spark heads .... lots of folks figure valves and belts on Ducati is a black art ... but truthfully not as tricky as doing a big 4 banger Suzuki’s valves ....like anything else first time a little tricky but next time easier and so on
    Craig
     
  16. Fast Eddie

    Fast Eddie VIP MEMBER

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    Oct 4, 2013
    Well I’m currently riding a rented 107ci Road King....

    And I love it !
     
  17. oldbeezer

    oldbeezer VIP MEMBER

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    Nov 2, 2017
    I briefly had a Road King, it changes your attitude and expectations about riding. Going slow seems natural and enjoyable.
    Please note I said "had a Road King" it would not be my first or second but if I could afford it maybe my fourth.
    BTW a great choice for the "Mother Road"
     
  18. Craig

    Craig VIP MEMBER

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    Dec 20, 2005
    Yup , RoadKings are great bikes really like the style 107” is hard to not like .... in fact I like all twins bikes, women , etc. .... have great tour ....
    Craig
     
  19. acotrel

    acotrel

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2012
    A lot of guys don't know the basics of building a motor and even a Commando gives them problems. If I rebuilt a Ducati motor, I would not get the valve timing wrong. I think a lot of guys who buy Ducatis have got too much money. Money lets you pay somebody else, it doesn't give you mechanical skills. Tangling the valves on a water-cooled Ducati must be a thrilling experience ?
     
  20. acotrel

    acotrel

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    Jun 30, 2012
    I once rode a Heritage Softail - it reminded me of my 1942 Indian Scout, which I sold for $30. It didn't go, stop or handle, but it sounded great. But not as good as a Brough Superior.
     
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