Dominator gearbox (2013)

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The gearbox of the Dominator is equal to that of Commando?.
What are the differences?
The insides parts of the Dominator gearbox can be reused on a Commando?
Ciao.
Piero
 
Re: Dominatorcgearbox

pierodn said:
The gearbox of the Dominator is equal to that of Commando?. the later AMC type gearbox of a Dominator is almost the same
What are the differences? mainshaft, beefier shell
The insides parts of the Dominator gearbox can be reused on a Commando? Yes except for the mainshaft
Ciao.
Piero
 
It is always good practice to fit gears in pairs. Because the tooth form changed at some time in the sixties, don't mix Commando gears with Dommie gears for the same set. i.e. mainshaft 2nd with layshaft 2nd. Also the Commando gearbox shell is supposedly stronger and the top mount milled away on one side by 0.125". a spacer is then fitted to make gearbox removal easier.

Martyn.
 
I had an AMC box in which the fourth gear pair were a different ratio from the Commando. It was 24/18 instead of 23/18. In fact since I just rebuilt my gearbox and found a worn out fourth gear, I've just put the 24/18 back in.
I wonder how it will work on a 750 Commando with not much mid-range :)
 
The mainshafts in dommie and Commando gearboxes are quite different.
The clutch sits on a circlip in a Commando box, and the clutch in a dommie sits on a shoulder in the shaft.
The clutch sits out different lengths too on dommie and Commando boxes.

As well as the gears having different tooth forms and different tooth counts at different times and for different models.

And, to add to this, half ? the AMC boxes made were for AJS nad Matchless models - the housing has the lugs on the shell in a different place for Matchless and AJS use - they simply won't even bolt into a Norton....
 
Matchless said:
Also the Commando gearbox shell is supposedly stronger and the top mount milled away on one side by 0.125". a spacer is then fitted to make gearbox removal easier.

Martyn.

Which just reminded me,when I removed the gearbox on the 750 I seem to remember the cradle looking somewhat bowed in.
The bain of Nortondom,the previous owners. :lol:

Item #34 might be on the order list (need to check)
http://www.nortonmotors.de/ANIL/Norton% ... &Plate=005
 
pierodn said:
The gearbox of the Dominator is equal to that of Commando?.
What are the differences?
The insides parts of the Dominator gearbox can be reused on a Commando?
Ciao.
Piero

WHAT IS A DOMINATOR?

Model 7 1949-1956 ? The original Dominator with a norton gearbox? NO gears interchange at all........with the AMC gearbox
Model 77?
generic featherbed?

dave
1951 model 7 Dominator
1952 model 7 Dominator

3 featherbeds (500 + (2) 750), not a dominator to me unless there is a generator/dynamo

10+ Commandos

I don't know the factory ever made this term very clear.
Any researchers with good references?????
 
Norton brochures in the 1960s consistently refer to Dominators.
The 'Dominator Deluxe' label was recycled, to now refer to bathtub etc enclosures.
No generators in these babies, darlings...

It has always been debated whether Atlas's fall into this 'Dominator' category or not.
Most lean to not, since they, and the Mercury, have their own name.
But they share almost everything mechanical and cosmetic with their Dommie siblings, its really only the holes in the middle that are different.
So its probably just sheer bloody-mindedness not to include them... ?

We did of course assume that the OP was referring to AMC boxes.
The earlier Norton laydown and upright and dollshead and Sturmey Archer gearboxes you don't usually associate with Commandos.
??
 
Rohan said:
I have excellent references - I wrote them myself !!!!!?

LOL

OK I don't have a problem with all NHT that are pre-commando...ie featherbed being dominators
Might that include atlas hybrids...non featherbeds?
 
dynodave said:
Might that include atlas hybrids...non featherbeds?

The factory didn't ever refer to the hybrids as dominators - anywhere ?
Hybrids seems a suitable and accepted label for them.

Some of them, at least, were built when the Company was known as Matchless Norton,
so Matchless Nortons they may be too.... (?).
 
I realize this is an old post but I'm considering using a dommie gearbox with a commando main shaft fitted
Does anyone know if the gearbox can be wrestled in to a commando gearbox cradle without machining an 1/8 " off the gearbox shell lug?
Also is the dommie gearbox shell actually weaker than a commando one?
 
The TTI box doesn’t have the top lug machined down, and I didn’t find that it caused any fitting difficulties as a result.

If fitting with the engine in situ, perhaps you’d benefit by slackening off the 3 crank case to engine plate fixings to give a little room to wiggle and slide.
 
From memory the Model 88 and Model 99 were 500cc and 600cc Dominators respectively - I don't think the 650SS, 650cc Manxman or the 750cc Atlas were known as Dominators. The mainshaft in the commando box is 1/4 inch longer to accommodate the new clutch. When I fitted the TTI box, I set the engine sprocket up so that it floats on a spline the 1/4 inch, plus a bit - to get the single row chain aligned. The previous gearbox was the Norton AMC type. I had fitted a close ratio gear set from America. It all simply fitted in, with no problems at all. I still use the Manx type clutch. They have been used on 1000cc Norvins, so will cop the torque. The Commando clutch is probably overkill. But whichever clutch you use, usually determines which mainshaft you must use. What I failed to do with the close gears is retain the Commando first gear - silly mistake. We now have clutch starts in all races.
 
Hi, I remenber Hobot using the pre-cdo gearbox , saying their casting is better ! more strong ?? but you must know the intermediate and outer covers are a bit different due to the kick spring , the later one being better , and if you swap you must swap both (intermediate and outer ) just because there is a "boss" inside the outer which longer (where the kick shaft pass)............otherwise the upper lug being larger as you had noticed , it's slightly less easy but largely doeable!
 
I think , over the years , all gears were made , with any number of teeth .
Matching got a 1 tooth variation , regarding each cog .So multitudeinous ratios availiable , pre N V T days .

The Kickstart Pawl WOULD NOT fit inside the smaller 1 st gears . so - thats a ' Starting Point ' for a road bike .
A fault not suffered by the Close Ratio Triumph Box , which ratios are near identical to the standard ' Manx ' C.R. Box .
Dominator gearbox (2013)


In the magazines over the years , the number of times it was said thet the gear profile , material & heat treatment were ' improved '
defies belief . Thus perhaps some caution is not amiss . Though generally ' all the cogs will interchange and operate . if not indefinately .

Thus a differance from ' keeping it going ' , and something youd be confidant in at 1509 mph , down Bray Hill .
 
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Hi, I remenber Hobot using the pre-cdo gearbox , saying their casting is better ! more strong ?? but you must know the intermediate and outer covers are a bit different due to the kick spring , the later one being better , and if you swap you must swap both (intermediate and outer ) just because there is a "boss" inside the outer which longer (where the kick shaft pass)............otherwise the upper lug being larger as you had noticed , it's slightly less easy but largely doeable!
Ok thanks for that info, I basically have a really good dommie gearbox it's stamped 4244
And a commando one that's had the shell welded up and parts missing
I want to build the gearbox up to swap over on the commando I'm using to save some down time
Cheers
 
I think , over the years , all gears were made , with any number of teeth .
Matching got a 1 tooth variation , regarding each cog .So multitudeinous ratios availiable , pre N V T days .

The Kickstart Pawl WOULD NOT fit inside the smaller 1 st gears . so - thats a ' Starting Point ' for a road bike .
A fault not suffered by the Close Ratio Triumph Box , which ratios are near identical to the standard ' Manx ' C.R. Box .
Dominator gearbox (2013)


In the magazines over the years , the number of times it was said thet the gear profile , material & heat treatment were ' improved '
defies belief . Thus perhaps some caution is not amiss . Though generally ' all the cogs will interchange and operate . if not indefinately .

Thus a differance from ' keeping it going ' , and something youd be confidant in at 1509 mph , down Bray Hill .
I'll keep all the cogs to the relevant gearbox
Cheers
 
Hi Baz , if your Commando intermediate /outer covers are good (so just the main shell welded), put them on the dommie tranny, as said above the kick spring attachment is better , making the kick return more positive..............and the spring less likely jumping out its location.
 
Hi Baz , if your Commando intermediate /outer covers are good (so just the main shell welded), put them on the dommie tranny, as said above the kick spring attachment is better , making the kick return more positive..............and the spring less likely jumping out its location.
Ok thanks for the info I hadn't realised there was a difference
 
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