Déjà vu all over again - Gearbox Oil Leak at Kick Start

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All right - I know that this topic has been dealt with in various forms and that there are old threads on the general topic. I just want to know if there is a way for me (a mechanical neophyte) to undertake this repair:

'72 Commando Combat leaking gear oil out of the kickstart seal. Can this repair be made without removing gearbox from the bike?

If so, what is needed? Is it something that can be done with limited mechanical knowledge?

Any suggestions, photos, encouragement, etc. would be appreciated...

Thank-you!
 
Go to oldbrits.com, they have a tech section that talks about leaking transfer cases. One of the fixes was to drill a small hole in the adjustment cover on the tranny to let the pressure escape. Dont know if that would help since you are already leaking!?
 
I had a similar problem - fixed it by fitting a 'double-lipped' O-ring - I believe these are now available from numerous suppliers. You'll need to remove the gearbox outer cover to fit it - not difficult - -

Cheers.
 
Here is an old post of mine.

"Instead of replacing that worthless oring with another, here is a simple and effective solution.
You must still pop the cover off. Then heat the case around where the oring is with a propane torch or heat gun to pop out the kickshaft bushing.
You can buy this seal, Timkin #240731, seal number 9815 1.25 x 1 x .125 at your local oilseal dealer for around $6.00.
Lay the seal in there with a little locktite, pop the bushing in and you will be good to go and the cover will not be harmed."
 
pvisseriii said:
Here is an old post of mine.

"Instead of replacing that worthless oring with another, here is a simple and effective solution.
You must still pop the cover off. Then heat the case around where the oring is with a propane torch or heat gun to pop out the kickshaft bushing.
You can buy this seal, Timkin #240731, seal number 9815 1.25 x 1 x .125 at your local oilseal dealer for around $6.00.
Lay the seal in there with a little locktite, pop the bushing in and you will be good to go and the cover will not be harmed."

So I ordered this part from RockAuto.com. It was cheaper to order it than pick it up from a local supplier.

Déjà vu all over again - Gearbox Oil Leak at Kick Start


http://www.rockauto.com/catalog/moreinfo.php?pk=1118349

$2.24 plus $2.29 for shipping first class USPS. Finally someone with reasonable shipping for small parts. $4.53 was cheaper than the local place that wanted $6.24.
 
The standard O-ring works fine UNLESS there is excessive clearance which causes the shafts in question to wobble around. IMO, the actual fix is to refurbish the gearbox with new bushings/bearings. THEN the standard O-ring will seal perfectly. Otherwise you are just temporarily hiding the problem.
 
swooshdave said:
So I ordered this part from RockAuto.com. It was cheaper to order it than pick it up from a local supplier.

http://www.rockauto.com/catalog/moreinfo.php?pk=1118349

$2.24 plus $2.29 for shipping first class USPS. Finally someone with reasonable shipping for small parts. $4.53 was cheaper than the local place that wanted $6.24.
I have not leaked a drop in two years since I put this seal in mine. This is in lue of numourous times of have that outer cover off and the rebuild this winter. It was not needed to change the seal for this rebuild. It really really works and maintains the original integrity of the cover. Literally a 15 minute procedure. Well, maybe a half hour.
 
I think the double lipped seal w/o machining is best gem yet on this. For more old school down and dirty that's worked about as well as vendor machined fitting oil seal is to fill in the 0-ring groove with cigarette thick foil then light grease around the shaft and o-ring then a small bead of RTV, then slip cover on and wait over night to use. Knocked factory Tirixie leakage down to wipe off local weepage after long hot rides. Its been a few years and can see the grey RTV exturded a bit around kicker splines but no oil leaks sitting up couple years, with ATF inside.
 
MexicoMike said:
The standard O-ring works fine UNLESS there is excessive clearance which causes the shafts in question to wobble around. IMO, the actual fix is to refurbish the gearbox with new bushings/bearings. THEN the standard O-ring will seal perfectly. Otherwise you are just temporarily hiding the problem.

As you recall this gearbox was rebuilt using the standard parts. And it leaked. So either I did it wrong or like every other Norton owner, I have to fix it using non-standard parts.
 
Something that helped me was to create a 3-4 mm thick slice that I put between Kiken and gearbox, so I pulled the shaft out 1-2 mm. The result was that the seal hit a party on the shaft that was not worn, and the leak stopped
Vidar
 
I used a hydraulic cylinder seal. The Parker number for that seal is 1200-1000-250B. Any hydraulic cylinder seal shop would have them. I goes in in place of the O ring, with no modifications, but it is much stiffer. It is made of polyurethane. On my bike it worked and there is never a drop comes out from the kick start shaft.
 
Déjà vu all over again - Gearbox Oil Leak at Kick Start

A whopping $1.37, they said it was a closeout, the Timken part was $2.24 which is still reasonable.

Need to get the front wheel on the bike so I can swing around and get to the gearbox cover.
 
Ugh, too many close calls even this year to stand looking at that very much. My big extinguishers cost ~$45 to refill with CO2. My shed with two cycles, gen-set power station and such - priceless.

ATF barely weeps out Trixie's cigarette foil and RTV bodge with old factory used o-ring. Ms Peel has machined in Anover fitted seal and barely weeps ATF same as Trixie.

Another down-dirty sealing mod is to stack two oil pump feed nipples in the tach drive, no machining needed or any pacific rim items.
 
hobot said:
Ugh, too many close calls even this year to stand looking at that very much. My big extinguishers cost ~$45 to refill with CO2. My shed with two cycles, gen-set power station and such - priceless.

ATF barely weeps out Trixie's cigarette foil and RTV bodge with old factory used o-ring. Ms Peel has machined in Anover fitted seal and barely weeps ATF same as Trixie.

Another down-dirty sealing mod is to stack two oil pump feed nipples in the tach drive, no machining needed or any pacific rim items.

ATF in the tranny. Hmmm.
 
GM Dextron for forks and gear box and Ford Type F for primary with friction plates used to be my practice, now I prefer power steering fluid in forks. ATF or thick gear oil is a non issue except for drag factor to anyone trying to spank hi hp very angry crazy wild squids driven further insane by a obsolete push rod air cooled baby bugger they could not Approach > which requires red lining WOT in lower gears - so sleeve bushes go dry and turn to ceramic grit in there. Its an innate design issue impossible to solve - only reduce some by thinner oil. I will just have to replace bushes as often as rear tires or suffer primary belt coming off d/t clutch wobble to pile up and jam around crank area away from home- ugh.

Live - Learn - then die off.
 
hobot said:
GM Dextron for forks and gear box and Ford Type F for primary with friction plates used to be my practice, now I prefer power steering fluid in forks. ATF or thick gear oil is a non issue except for drag factor to anyone trying to spank hi hp very angry crazy wild squids driven further insane by a obsolete push rod air cooled baby bugger they could not Approach > which requires red lining WOT in lower gears - so sleeve bushes go dry and turn to ceramic grit in there. Its an innate design issue impossible to solve - only reduce some by thinner oil. I will just have to replace bushes as often as rear tires or suffer primary belt coming off d/t clutch wobble to pile up and jam around crank area away from home- ugh.

Live - Learn - then die off.

So just to recap... gear oil for the rest of us. :mrgreen:
 
Nah just those too ruled by tradition to use reason to do other wise or just using up what's on hand before seeing the light of lite wt lube inside AMC boxes : )
Also helps ID leak sources by color seen. Not a single downside to ATF but plenty of advantages. I did not put in ATF until I asked for feedback on other - decades running lists - to read I was a late comer to their long tested wisdom. Your call.

Déjà vu all over again - Gearbox Oil Leak at Kick Start
 
Déjà vu all over again - Gearbox Oil Leak at Kick Start

Remove shifter and kickstarter. A screwdriver was used to wedge the kickstarter open a smudge.

Déjà vu all over again - Gearbox Oil Leak at Kick Start

Loosen adjusting nut on clutch.

Déjà vu all over again - Gearbox Oil Leak at Kick Start

Clutch cable will now be loose.

Déjà vu all over again - Gearbox Oil Leak at Kick Start

So here's the real problem, it wasn't a failed o-ring, it was a failed bushing that held the o-ring in! So oil could basically gush out. Lovely. :|

Déjà vu all over again - Gearbox Oil Leak at Kick Start

Bushing was not tight. This is bad.

Déjà vu all over again - Gearbox Oil Leak at Kick Start

Push in the seal. It was a nice fit.

Déjà vu all over again - Gearbox Oil Leak at Kick Start

Magic stuff.

Déjà vu all over again - Gearbox Oil Leak at Kick Start

Smeared some JB Weld on the bushing and pressed it in. I think this will hold.

Déjà vu all over again - Gearbox Oil Leak at Kick Start

Cover back on. Clutch cable back in, snug up adjuster on clutch. Kickstarter and shifter back on. Throw some more oil back in and check in a few days for leaks. Centerstand got an oil bath, one side will take longer to rust than the other...
 
I’m trying to solve the same gearbox leak. Took cover off today more gunge inside than I would have liked.

Déjà vu all over again - Gearbox Oil Leak at Kick Start


No kickstart axle bush :shock:!!! That will be why it leaked then. I have all seals & gaskets in front of me ready to go but never thought to order the kickstart bush!!!!

Déjà vu all over again - Gearbox Oil Leak at Kick Start



Is this "JB weld" if so how do I get it out? Do I have to remove it ? When I heat the case to put the new bush in will it liquefy (the weld not the case :D )?

Déjà vu all over again - Gearbox Oil Leak at Kick Start


Déjà vu all over again - Gearbox Oil Leak at Kick Start


Any help would be great. Fed up fixing my bike just want to get out and ride it.

Thanks
McVic
 
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