clutch sticking OR stuck - ??? - another noobie question

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my clutch doesn't seem to be disengaging with the clutch lever in the full (lever) pull-back position, or it's just plain stuck. with the clutch lever pulled back, in gear, and turning the engine over with the kick start lever, the rear wheel turns in sync with the kick start rotation. i'm fairly sure the cable mechanism is properly adjusted. not sure if the plates are stuck from this thing sitting for the 6 or 7 years, and things are stuck or maybe things need an adjustment. what is the best way to inspect, approach, and address the issue - if I have an issue. pretty sure i'll need some tools, if so, what do I need? TIA....
 
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Every Commando owner absolutely needs a clutch spring compressor tool. You can buy one or make your own.

So, pull the primary cover and watch the clutch center as you squeeze the lever. Does the spring bow out? Can you feel spring tension? There is an adjuster there (see the workshop manual).

It's also critical that the release arm in the gearbox cover has not fallen out of it's slot. If the release and adjust mechanisms are OK, then remove the clutch plates and clean them.

Homebrew clutch spring tool:

clutch sticking OR stuck - ??? - another noobie question


It's a 3" cast iron pipe cap, drilled to accept a 1/2" bolt with 1/2-20 nuts.
 
purchase from the source or your favorite parts supplier. this is not that much.
https://andover-norton.co.uk/en/shop-details/15499
if you are going to work on the engine or gearbox, its a good idea to purchase a full set of 3/8 drive Whitworth socket set and open/box end wrench set.
if you have a local British motorcycle vintage club or know members locally, then you can ask them to beg or borrow.
but IMHO I would purchase when needed.
 
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I may be wrong (usually more often then not) but the clutch separates the engine from the transmission. Operating the kick-start lever with the transmission in gear will result in the rear wheel turning regardless of the position of the clutch lever. You cannot manually start a Commando in gear with the kick-start lever regardless of the position of the clutch lever. Bump starting is another different issue.

If you want to know if the plates may be sticking then put the transmission in neutral pull in the clutch lever and operate the kick-start lever, The lever should operate smoothly with only a little resistance unless the plates are sticking and if so then the engine will try to turn over as the lever is pushed down.

After sitting for 6 or 7 years, yes it's probably stuck together. If it ever had some oil on the plates (dry clutch) the oil will have turned to goo, further cementing the friction and steel plates together.

You will need to make, borrow or buy a special tool to deal with the large cir-clip and clutch spring to remove and replace the clutch plates. If you get that far be very careful and remove and install all of the plates EXACTLY as you took them out. Do not shuffle them or flip them over, the cogs and teeth develop a wear pattern over time that match their position in the hub and basket.

It may help us help you if we know the year, make, and model of your Norton they are all the same but different.

Ride On
Dave
 
if you are going to work on the engine or gearbox, its a good idea to purchase a full set of 3/8 drive Whitworth socket set and open/box end wrench set.

done that - ;) - bought them off fleabay from the UK. not bad tools - even with shipping, for what they cost. seemed like a decent bang for the buck. looking at my favorite supplier (old brits) for the compression tool.
 
The Buckeye Rider said:
the clutch separates the engine from the transmission. Operating the kick-start lever with the transmission in gear will result in the rear wheel turning regardless of the position of the clutch lever.

Correct 100%, if not more than 100%.
 
I may be wrong (usually more often then not) but the clutch separates the engine from the transmission. Operating the kick-start lever with the transmission in gear will result in the rear wheel turning regardless of the position of the clutch lever. You cannot manually start a Commando in gear with the kick-start lever regardless of the position of the clutch lever. Bump starting is another different issue.

If you want to know if the plates may be sticking then put the transmission in neutral pull in the clutch lever and operate the kick-start lever, The lever should operate smoothly with only a little resistance unless the plates are sticking and if so then the engine will try to turn over as the lever is pushed down.

After sitting for 6 or 7 years, yes it's probably stuck together. If it ever had some oil on the plates (dry clutch) the oil will have turned to goo, further cementing the friction and steel plates together.

You will need to make, borrow or buy a special tool to deal with the large cir-clip and clutch spring to remove and replace the clutch plates. If you get that far be very careful and remove and install all of the plates EXACTLY as you took them out. Do not shuffle them or flip them over, the cogs and teeth develop a wear pattern over time that match their position in the hub and basket.

It may help us help you if we know the year, make, and model of your Norton they are all the same but different.

Ride On
Dave

thanks Dave - FYI, 74 Mk2 roadster.

to all - thanks for the replies - so far, all good info!
 
done that - ;) - bought them off fleabay from the UK. not bad tools - even with shipping, for what they cost. seemed like a decent bang for the buck. looking at my favorite supplier (old brits) for the compression tool.

If you are going in there for the first time then; measure the quantity of oil you drain out of the primary case, if its way more then what is called for then you may want to have a look at the crankshaft main seal. This will entail digging deeper then originally intended but would save you a tremendous amount of time if engine oil is migrating into the primary side. Then again a special tool is required to pull the alternator rotor off the crank without damage.
While you have Old Brits on the line order a couple of the primary gaskets and seals for the drain plug. It's always handy to keep a few spares around.
Best of luck, keep us posted.
Ride On
Dave
 
I may be wrong (usually more often then not) but the clutch separates the engine from the transmission. Operating the kick-start lever with the transmission in gear will result in the rear wheel turning regardless of the position of the clutch lever. You cannot manually start a Commando in gear with the kick-start lever regardless of the position of the clutch lever. Bump starting is another different issue.

If you want to know if the plates may be sticking then put the transmission in neutral pull in the clutch lever and operate the kick-start lever, The lever should operate smoothly with only a little resistance unless the plates are sticking and if so then the engine will try to turn over as the lever is pushed down.

After sitting for 6 or 7 years, yes it's probably stuck together. If it ever had some oil on the plates (dry clutch) the oil will have turned to goo, further cementing the friction and steel plates together.

You will need to make, borrow or buy a special tool to deal with the large cir-clip and clutch spring to remove and replace the clutch plates. If you get that far be very careful and remove and install all of the plates EXACTLY as you took them out. Do not shuffle them or flip them over, the cogs and teeth develop a wear pattern over time that match their position in the hub and basket.

It may help us help you if we know the year, make, and model of your Norton they are all the same but different.

Ride On
Dave
Actually you can kickstart a commando while it's in gear.
Don't ask me how I know but it's happened at least twice .
:)
 
It's good to learn to inspect the clutch regardless, but take the bike off the stand, put it in gear and try pushing it. Now pull in the clutch and try again. You should notice a difference! Now take it out of gear and try pushing it. If there is more resistance with the clutch pulled in than there is in neutral then I would blame clutch drag/sticking.

A clutch compression tool is easy to make. Mine is made from an old hole saw. Others have been made from ABS or PVC pipe caps.
 
It's designed as a dry clutch, but some oil gets in there, either from the primary drive supply, a leaking crank seal, or crawling up the output shaft via the clutch pushrod. If it's properly adjusted and the cable and throw-out (American slang) are functioning properly, all you can do is pull it apart and clean it, and make sure no excess lubricant is entering the primary case, either from the engine or the gearbox. And you'll still need to pull the diaphragm spring and plates and clean everything periodically. And check all the plates-they do warp and wear out over time.

Damn, what fun! And it's only the clutch! ;)
 
While in there you could always add a DynoDave clutch seal to operating rod it not costly and eliminates the possible issue of gear box oil migrating to clutch .... My parts terminology may be in correct but you get the idea
 
You know, for years I've been hearing that the Norton clutch "was designed as a dry clutch." I don't buy it.

The clutch operates in a chain case with lubricant being picked up/tossed around by the primary chain. No designer would look at that and say, "This is a dry clutch environment." And NOBODY could possibly expect the assembly to stay "dry" when oil is being sprayed all around it. I suspect that, at worst, designers may have selected a clutch assembly that functioned in another application as a dry clutch, knowing that it would work fine as a wet...or should we say, "damp" clutch. ;)

Motorcycle dry clutches (except for BMW twins) and wet clutches are essentially the same. If somebody hands you a new Ducati dry clutch assembly and a new Honda wet clutch assembly, you won't be able to tell by looking at the design which one is a "dry" clutch and which one is a "wet" clutch. And if someone handed you a new Norton clutch assembly, the same thing would be true; it's the same design/layout as the Ducati dry clutch and the Honda wet clutch - multiple metal plates/multiple friction discs. Mount it in where it's bathed in oil and it's a wet clutch mount it "externally" and it's a dry clutch.

So...IN MY OPINION, the Norton dry clutch thing is a myth.
 
Indeed. I have always been somewhat perplexed by the description of the Commando clutch as dry.

It is a multi plate clutch, without any sealed compartment etc, running directly in a permanent oil bath, which when running will actually be a foam / mist bath.

Unless that chaincase is run dry, you got a wet clutch however you look at it.
 
I only ever saw the dry clutch story in BeltDriveMan's posts, a unique view that I ignore.
 
I only ever saw the dry clutch story in BeltDriveMan's posts, a unique view that I ignore.

He was rude, but probably not wrong.

The “it’s a dry clutch” story is endlessly trotted out about Triumphs too.

A dry clutch with a wet chain round it and a wet bearing in the middle of it!
 
IMHO the only thing that dictates if it is a wet or dry clutch is the composition of the friction materials used. So the question is and i think as bdm was showing the frictions were marginal when wet as the coefficient of friction was reduced when wet and to the point that it would slip. This points to the wrong friction material was used in both the bronze and earlier plates
 
After you take the plates out and clean them.Put it back together and use a dyno dave clutch rod seal.I used to take my clutch apart every year because of sticky plates on all my commandos.Dave sorted out the problem by figuring it was the gear oil coming through the push rod.Dave really knows his stuff.Never had the problem since.I put them on all my commandos since.I only take the cover off now to clean and change the oil.
Bruce
 
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